New Animation VS Old Animation

[Sayo-chan]

Besides having a mistake (two left hands), there's nothing noticeably wrong with that scene, and the old animation had plenty of errors like that. Also, seeing that scene in motion is also very hard to even notice the error.

I've never seen one single mistake of two left hands in the original, but I would like to see it if it exists.

And no, this is jarring even in motion.

[rereboy]

Besides having a mistake (two left hands), there's nothing noticeably wrong with that scene, and the old animation had plenty of errors like that. Also, seeing that scene in motion is also very hard to even notice the error.

I've never seen one single mistake of two left hands in the original, but I would like to see it if it exists.

And no, this is jarring even in motion.

It's so jarring that I saw the scene more than once and only even notice it when it was pointed out in that still because its only on in a few frames (when Vegeta actually is falling he was the correct right hand). And I said mistakes like that, they don't have to be "two left hand" mistakes, there are plenty of mistakes caused by oversights, the most common of which are coloring mistakes.

Most of the bad stuff that people are finding is stuff that that is only really apparent in stills, which people seem to be purposely seeking. The episode was not, by any means, great in terms of animation or art, it was weak, but people, like usual, like to exaggerate.

[Sayo-chan]

Besides having a mistake (two left hands), there's nothing noticeably wrong with that scene, and the old animation had plenty of errors like that. Also, seeing that scene in motion is also very hard to even notice the error.

I've never seen one single mistake of two left hands in the original, but I would like to see it if it exists.

And no, this is jarring even in motion.

It's so jarring that I saw the scene more than once and only even notice it when it was pointed out in that still because its only on in a few frames (when Vegeta actually is falling he was the correct right hand). And I said mistakes like that, they don't have to be "two left hand" mistakes, there are plenty of mistakes caused by oversights, the most common of which are coloring mistakes.

I noticed it the first time. So you didn't, okay? It doesn't make it any less jarring. Huge anatomical errors are not at all comparable to coloring mistakes. Terrible art+mediocre animation+boring narrative = bad product. So far GT is looking better than this. At least they didn't take a movie plot and haphazardly retell it with worse art/animation (which they'll no doubt do with the second film as well).

[rereboy]

I noticed it the first time. So you didn't, okay? It doesn't make it any less jarring. Huge anatomical errors are not at all comparable to coloring mistakes. Terrible art+mediocre animation+boring narrative = bad product. So far GT is looking better than this. At least they didn't take a movie plot and haphazardly retell it with worse art/animation (which they'll no doubt do with the second film).

Like I said, I didn't because it's on for just a few frames and a fraction of a second. The fact is that it's a detail that it's only on a few frames of the scene (a fraction of a second) with Vegeta having a right hand right afterwards. That's not what I would call really apparent or jarring. If you want to call it that just because you noticed it the first time you watch it, despite it only being on for a fraction of a second in the mist of his overall falling motion, be my guest. And I have no idea why mistakes like this one aren't comparable to coloring mistakes. If anything, coloring mistakes tend to be more noticeable because they tend to be on the air longer. Videl's changing leg color in episode 2 or 3 was way more jarring and noticeable than this and they are just as physically impossible as changing fingers or hands.

And I never mentioned GT.

[Sayo-chan]

The fact is that it's a detail that it's only on a few frames of the scene (a fraction of a second) with Vegeta having a right hand right afterwards. That's not what I would call really apparent or jarring.

I called it jarring because I noticed it right off the bat, and to my knowledge, I'm not the only one. I don't understand why this is so hard for you to accept, and why you continue on repeating yourself.

Jarring: incongruous in a striking or shocking way; clashing.

It fits the definition for how I applied it. There shouldn't be an issue here.

And I have no idea why mistakes like this one aren't comparable to coloring mistakes. If anything, coloring mistakes tend to be more noticeable because they tend to be on the air longer. Videl's changing leg color in episode 2 or 3 was way more jarring and noticeable than this and they are just as physically impossible as changing fingers or hands.

Noticeable /=/ degree of error, which is the point here. It's far more amateurish to make such a mistake than to color something wrong. It's also far more lazy. This episode was all around sloppy.

And I never mentioned GT.

I didn't say you did. I stated my opinion regarding the progression of Super thus far in relevance to the topic at hand.

[rereboy]

Like I said, if you want to call it jarring because you noticed the first time you watched it, be my guest. I tend to try to be fair about how classify things and look at the big picture and how thing stack up looking at it more objectively, not just how things were for me, that's all. That's what I was trying to transmit.

Also, I fail to see why a drawing mistake regarding a hand that lasts a fraction of a second is more amateurish than inconsistent coloring mistakes. Both are basic errors caused by oversights that should be obvious.

[Sayo-chan]

It's my position that it wasn't just me, but we'll have to agree to disagree then.

[SaintEvolution]

The old animation was did with more calm and caution. The newer ones are did with many computered and modern processes, that do not deserve many caution or calm(actually, they are rushed methods).

[LonelyShadow]

Just watched the episode, some of the close-ups of the character's faces looked fine, others looked like Paint '15, everyone agrees that, for most of the episode, the animation is abysmal. I honestly don't know anything about the process of animation so I won't be so bold, but I've seen people on this site fix many terrible shots in less than an hour.

I would really like to know who was responsible for this (Q: What studio animated this episode?), hell, many parts looked worse than Uchiyama's work. The action scenes of SSJ and SSJ2 Goku vs Beerus are paintful to witness, some of the faces for SSJ2 Goku are "decent", after Goku turned SSJ3 the animation got a little better, but not vastly. The animation for today's episode can be described as: "mediocre." There were so many horrible parts noticeable even for a simple human eye and there were some others that are actually pretty good, but they don't save the entire episode.

What did they invest their effort in? The twitter account?

I would like to believe that after this episode was aired, they called the person responsible for this and simply say: "Kill him."

I wonder, why did they give us hype with opening by showing Goku as a SSJ3 like: "the greatest shit ever," "That fight you saw on BoG? It's going to be more awesome!"

This is why I don't get myself hopes, just like a doctor trying to explain the situation to a patience diagnosed with metastasis.

[VintageSaiyan]

Many of those are middle of scene stills. In motion they aren't even apparent.

For example, the second image in this picture looks horrible, right?



Lets see the scene where it's from:

http://webm.host/02425/

Hardly noticeable and not a horrible scene at all.

How can you defend that, even in motion? It's absolutely terrible across the board, easily one of the worst transformations in all of Dragonball. And let's not forget to mention that the absolutely horrendous animation did no favors for the disgusting fight choreography. If you can even call that fight choreography.

The only acceptable thing in that scene is King Kai's dumb flabbergasted expression, because that's exactly what a lot our faces looked like right after watching this turd. lol more than 2/3rds of that clip is barely animated, it's a bunch of poses with a lackluster aura & shaky cam slapped on it to make it seem like it's actually a moving image. just lol.

[Doctor.]

I've never seen one single mistake of two left hands in the original, but I would like to see it if it exists.

What about two right hands?

[jjgp1112]

Yeah, can't say I'm a fan of using in-between shots to demonstrate bad animation. You could make even the very best animated episodes and movies look bad with that. But still, last night's episode was very bad, but no worse than some of the shitty Uchiyama episodes of DBZ. Let's not act like this is some grand disgrace or besmirching of the great name of OG Dragon Ball, which itself was a low budget, often rushed, and haphazardly produced show. That's Toei Animation for ya

[DBZMerciter2005]

That's Toei Animation for ya

Yup. Doesn't One Piece suffer the same way DB does?

Don't get me wrong, I like the cleaner, crisper look of modern animation in comparison to the older stuff (especially Attack On Titan's look). However I cannot defend some of the shots shown in the past two pages. Some of them are so bad that even my mediocre art skills are better.

That said I just expect it at this point. It's like DB can't exist without varying qualities of animation.

[Noah]

Even though these scenes are filler and cause some plot holes, the way they're presented is really neat.

Which plot holes, mind if I ask you?


Can someone say where the heck with these black lines in SSJ3 Goku eyes come from? It looks awful

[Hellspawn28]

While the animation in Super is far from great, it could have been much worst. The animation in Mars of Destruction and Variable Geo Neo both make Super look like if it was animated by Studio Ghibli.

I felt like I jynx myself with this post. While the animation in Episode 5 is not as bad as Mars of Destruction, but it's almost as bad as Variable Geo Neo. Variable Geo Neo's animation looks like it was made in flash and it came out like in 2006 or 2007 (I think). The animation in VGN is bad enough to make the animation in Mr. Pickles look good.

[JulieYBM]

What did they invest their effort in? The twitter account?

The average episode costs between $100,000-300,000 USD. Some series use as little as $90,000 an episode. This is how money is spent on an episode. The average two-cour series costs 300,000,000 JP Yen. Gundam Seed would cost $300,000 because of poor time management. Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann cost $180,000-200,000 an episode, but it looked so good because of how many talented animators worked on each episode.

I would like to believe that after this episode was aired, they called the person responsible for this and simply say: "Kill him."

The person responsible is the person that green-lit production on the series so close to its air date.

[LSSJGODSSJ4Gogeta]

Not only did episode 5 have bad drawings in super,but it had bad colors. Hopefully goku ssjgod vs beerus looks better.

[LonelyShadow]

What did they invest their effort in? The twitter account?

The average episode costs between $100,000-300,000 USD. Some series use as little as $90,000 an episode. This is how money is spent on an episode. The average two-cour series costs 300,000,000 JP Yen. Gundam Seed would cost $300,000 because of poor time management. Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann cost $180,000-200,000 an episode, but it looked so good because of how many talented animators worked on each episode.

Hey there! Thank you for informing me about it, I'll definitely give that article a little read, I had an idea of how much money does an episode takes to animate, I'm pretty sure that they did invest a lot of their money on the making of every episode, I'm just saying that it doesn't feel like a lot of effort was put into this episode, the animation alone isn't just bad (in this episode,) it's lazy. There were many drawings of every character that just didn't look professional and could have been fixed if they just care a little bit about the quality of the show.

With all that being said, I hope the best for the future episodes, I want to see an amazing episode of Dragon Ball Super and not just something that is embarrassing to show to your friends.

The person responsible is the person that green-lit production on the series so close to its air date.

We need his name, a photo and a sword. Seppuku confirmed.

[JulieYBM]

What did they invest their effort in? The twitter account?

The average episode costs between $100,000-300,000 USD. Some series use as little as $90,000 an episode. This is how money is spent on an episode. The average two-cour series costs 300,000,000 JP Yen. Gundam Seed would cost $300,000 because of poor time management. Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann cost $180,000-200,000 an episode, but it looked so good because of how many talented animators worked on each episode.

Hey there! Thank you for informing me about it, I'll definitely give that article a little read, I had an idea of how much money does an episode takes to animate, I'm pretty sure that they did invest a lot of their money on the making of every episode, I'm just saying that it doesn't feel like a lot of effort was put into this episode, the animation alone isn't just bad (in this episode,) it's lazy. There were many drawings of every character that just didn't look professional and could have been fixed if they just care a little bit about the quality of the show.

The episode is not the result of laziness. Laziness implies the key animators and animation supervisor didn't care. They care, they just had no time to work on the episode thanks to poor management.

It's important to keep in mind that one does not need to be good at their job to be a professional. This applies to any field. God knows I've known folks who are not good at their jobs in my real life. A lot of these key animators might very well also be bad animators, regardless of how much time they have.

[LonelyShadow]

The episode is not the result of laziness. Laziness implies the key animators and animation supervisor didn't care. They care, they just had no time to work on the episode thanks to poor management.
It's important to keep in mind that one does not need to be good at their job to be a professional. This applies to any field. God knows I've known folks who are not good at their jobs in my real life. A lot of these key animators might very well also be bad animators, regardless of how much time they have.

Well... I do have a definition of lazy, many of these shots was shown for many seconds, they could have been redone some of these after seeing the results:

Spoiler:

This shot was shown for 5 whole seconds, it's ok if it only showed for less than a second, but man...

On the first image Goku is a SSJ on the second one he is a SSJ2, identical hair. I don't know how to refer to this other than lazy (which is weird, they did some good draws of SSJ2 Goku in this episode.)
DBS x Toriko is official.
Goku desu >o<

Also, the animation in this episode did feel like it needed more frames. I don't have to be nice with the people who made this episode and say that they tried, they did something worse than terrible with this episode. Like you said, there might be some circumstances that caused the result to be worse, but man, this is incredible.

I don't hate the new animation at all, just like the old one, it has his big problems and it's good moments (last week's episode was very enjoyable), is just this episode that was horrible and, in my opinion, the decision of: "everyone shall be bright as sh*t."

P.S: Do you know what studio animated this episode? I'm so interested in seeing some of their work.