"Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

[Skar]

It's not like Toei was on the verge of bankruptcy and had no choice but to begin production on DBS at that moment. If there was little time to work on it then Toei could've waited a few extra months.

To this point, it wasn't/isn't necessarily about the money, but about the timeslot, and that's something that COULDN'T wait.

With Dragon Ball Kai ending — which, as we know, was a last-minute replacement for the timeslot once Toriko ended (itself a replacement for the previous round of Kai's failure) — Toei was in a panic about what to do to avoid losing the timeslot. They had nothing else that could or would fit.

I see that makes sense. I'm wondering if it was possible to have a Kai version of the original Dragonball instead. That could've given them an extra year and half to two years I think. Since the animation quality hasn't changed all that much with the new saga, I'm worried it's going to stay the same until the end of Super. Could the anime only be intended to fill in that timeslot and they plan to produce a better quality film of the saga later on?

[LuckyCat]

I'm wondering if it was possible to have a Kai version of the original Dragonball instead. That could've given them an extra year and half to two years I think.

I'm sure it's possible for them to do it, but with all the movies and tie-in products featuring adult Goku and Vegeta, it doesn't seem like that would line up with Toei/Shueisha's reboot strategy.

[Skar]

I'm sure it's possible for them to do it, but with all the movies and tie-in products featuring adult Goku and Vegeta, it doesn't seem like that would line up with Toei/Shueisha's reboot strategy.

That's true. I think they could've tried something else without having to compromise the quality of the new Dragonball anime. During the movie retellings, I was trying to convince myself that it was just filler and Toei planned to make up for it with the new saga. If it continues to be this bad then they sacrificed the entire series just to fill that timeslot. I wonder if there's anything that suggests it will improve later on or if we should just accept that this is the best we're going to get. I think it's easier to know what to expect even if it's bad than to get your hopes up.

[TheMikado]

This is the main story and what pushes forward the plot, I would call this Mr.Toriyama's vision. The little things Toyotaro and Toei add are just meat to the skeleton, to try and make things more interesting in their perspective and without changing the direction of the plot.

Another example, in the manga we have Goku notice something about Hit, in the anime Hit gives us his first reaction ever, by glancing at SSJ Goku. I think Mr.Toriyama wrote something like: an action that hypes Hit's mystery, without specifying.

In my personal opinion, the manga has less additions than the anime. Obviously because it lacks space and therefore has less opportunities to elaborate. The space pirate tidbit, while it could still be mentioned in the manga the way it was played for drama in the anime, looks nothing like something Mr.Toriyama would write, just my impression.

That's my take on it. If anything the manga seems WAAAAAAY more faithful to how I would expect a new dragonball to feel and play out.

[Blade]

Alright guys so which is it?? Because I'm in the school of thought that says the Manga is much closer to the original vision then this anime. I would like know the backgrounds of each views Dragonball experience. I.E. Age, when they first got into Dragonball, and what series, etc.

Honestly. I think that both are just different takes on a set of limited instructions. I enjoy and dislike things about both the anime and the manga, but most strongly, I get the impression that Toriyama hasn't provided any real vision per say for this arc - only a loose direction and a couple of character designs.

I would say he provided the skeleton of the story, at least. Let's look at Frost, we can assume with some confidence that Mr.Toriyama input was at least this:

Frost is a phony who fools everybody initially by demonstrating surprising politeness, when pushed into a corner he resorts to foul tactics to achieve victory. He defeats Goku and Piccolo, angering Vegeta. Who stops Frost's from being killed by Champa and takes matters into his on hands.

This is the main story and what pushes forward the plot, I would call this Mr.Toriyama's vision. The little things Toyotaro and Toei add are just meat to the skeleton, to try and make things more interesting in their perspective and without changing the direction of the plot.

Another example, in the manga we have Goku notice something about Hit, in the anime Hit gives us his first reaction ever, by glancing at SSJ Goku. I think Mr.Toriyama wrote something like: an action that hypes Hit's mystery, without specifying.

In my personal opinion, the manga has less additions than the anime. Obviously because it lacks space and therefore has less opportunities to elaborate. The space pirate tidbit, while it could still be mentioned in the manga the way it was played for drama in the anime, looks nothing like something Mr.Toriyama would write, just my impression.

I'm not saying that you're wrong - we're purely speculating here, but there's also a practical issue that hasn't been addressed. I think it's worth pointing out that long-winded, expositional dialogue doesn't necessarily lend itself well to limited Manga panel-space at the best of times. Even with the extended issue length, Toyotaro still has a lot of ground to cover here - especially with all the action panels in this issue. I mean, the Piccolo fight seems rushed as it is - ask yourself if there really also room to wedge in all of the space-pirate stuff? I'm not convinced.

It's equally possible that Toyotaro simply decided to leave that stuff out with the knowledge in-hand that the episode in question would have already aired by now. Whilst I agree that when viewed in isolation, it seems like a rather different take on the characterisation of Frost, the Manga itself is a promotional tie-in product. It's not a stretch to assume that he's writing almost specifically to the exact same catchment.

[HeroR]

I think the Frost vs. Goku fight in the manga is longer because they skipped Resurrection 'F' storyline and Toyotaro wanted to give people their Goku vs. Freeza fix. Since the anime retold the entire Goku vs. Freeze fight, having Goku and Frost's fight be longer would have felt redundant so they went through it quickly. They were people complaining about Goku fighting Freeza for a third time in less than a year.

And since Goku and Frost took up most of the chapter, it meant Piccolo getting very little love while the anime gave him almost an entire episode.

As for which one is better, it all comes to personal likes. The story is obviously Toriyama's. I personally always enjoy the anime of ''Dragon Ball'' more than the manga, so the ''Super'' anime is more interesting to me. Also, I actually don't like Toyotaro's version of Goku. I do enjoy Toriyama's Goku and even Toei's Goku to an extent, but Toyotaro's Goku rubs me the wrong way.

[Araki]

I do enjoy Toriyama's Goku and even Toei's Goku to an extent, but Toyotaro's Goku rubs me the wrong way.

There's something weird about Toyotaro's Goku, indeed. For instance, he is much more sympathetic towards Gohan in the anime. In the manga he sounds seriously disappointed by Gohan's career choices. If not even upset, when he should have gotten over it long ago.

[Lord Beerus]

I do enjoy Toriyama's Goku and even Toei's Goku to an extent, but Toyotaro's Goku rubs me the wrong way.

There's something weird about Toyotaro's Goku, indeed. For instance, he is much more sympathetic towards Gohan in the anime. In the manga he sounds seriously disappointed by Gohan's career choices. If not even upset, when he should have gotten over it long ago.

Yeah, it was really weird to hear Goku practically insult Gohan for choosing to pretty much support his family and make sure sure he still has a job. Goku may be an asshole sometimes, but he's not that much of an asshole.

[Vice]

Yeah, it was really weird to hear Goku practically insult Gohan for choosing to pretty much support his family and make sure sure he still has a job. Goku may be an asshole sometimes, but he's not that much of an asshole.

Goku and Vegeta have turned into assholes towards practically everybody that ain't themselves or the two god duos.

[phattangent]

... I'm wondering if it was possible to have a Kai version of the original Dragonball instead. That could've given them an extra year and half to two years I think. Since the animation quality hasn't changed all that much with the new saga, I'm worried it's going to stay the same until the end of Super. ...

I would watch it, however, I think that it's unlikely happen. I would also watch a Jaco anime, if they ever made one. That would be cool.

[Duo]

... I'm wondering if it was possible to have a Kai version of the original Dragonball instead. That could've given them an extra year and half to two years I think. Since the animation quality hasn't changed all that much with the new saga, I'm worried it's going to stay the same until the end of Super. ...

I would watch it, however, I think that it's unlikely happen. I would also watch a Jaco anime, if they ever made one. That would be cool.

It's becoming an elephant in the room, in my mind, that this still hasn't been done. Super has these obvious pre-production issues going on, it seems like they could benefit from spending a few episodes on an already-finished Manga while figuring out where this whole mess is going.

[TheMikado]

Yeah, it was really weird to hear Goku practically insult Gohan for choosing to pretty much support his family and make sure sure he still has a job. Goku may be an asshole sometimes, but he's not that much of an asshole.

Goku and Vegeta have turned into assholes towards practically everybody that ain't themselves or the two god duos.

Yes, Super's characterization is completely off...

[sintzu]

Goku and Vegeta have turned into assholes towards practically everybody that ain't the two god duos.

That will change the minute they surpass them.

[ChronoTwigger]

Indeed, I like the manga pace.
It rush over fluff. This tournament is nothing serious, not a "display of power", good things had to come. So even if Piccolo battle last just some page, everything's fine, according to the plot.
I also like Frost being just a naive pretentious hero, like the ones that do good deeds only to be famous. It remember me other tenkaichi characters of the past. In the anime you're good or you're evil... mumble...
Now Vegeta defrost the alien, a Cabba good fight, chances Magetto vs Monaka and then... the real deal: SSGod in action.
I HOPE SO, if the plot was really about the tournament it could end as the most anti-climax ever seen XD.

(I also like more how ChiChi reach Goku this way, instead of doing a 30ft jump, then crying and the like).

Thumbs up for the manga.

[Noah]

Yeah, it was really weird to hear Goku practically insult Gohan for choosing to pretty much support his family and make sure sure he still has a job. Goku may be an asshole sometimes, but he's not that much of an asshole.

Wasn't that manga only?

Goku and Vegeta have turned into assholes towards practically everybody that ain't the two god duos.

That will change the minute they surpass them.

Don't put your hopes up in something nearly impossible to happen

[namekiansaiyan]

Yeah, it was really weird to hear Goku practically insult Gohan for choosing to pretty much support his family and make sure sure he still has a job. Goku may be an asshole sometimes, but he's not that much of an asshole.

Wasn't that manga only?

Goku and Vegeta have turned into assholes towards practically everybody that ain't the two god duos.

That will change the minute they surpass them.

Don't put your hopes up in something nearly impossible to happen

Piccolo is on his way back.

[sintzu]

Don't put your hopes up in something nearly impossible to happen

Whis said if Goku and Vegeta teamed up against Beerus they might beat him so it's only a matter of time before they're able to defeat him in a one on one battle.

Champa is weaker then him so this applies to him as well.

Whis and Vados might be a stretch but if they use fusion then they might have a chance.

[Lord Beerus]

Yeah, it was really weird to hear Goku practically insult Gohan for choosing to pretty much support his family and make sure sure he still has a job. Goku may be an asshole sometimes, but he's not that much of an asshole.

Wasn't that manga only?

Yeah, that only happened in the manga. In the anime, Goku didn't mind that Gohan had other very important priorities and even kinda supported him for his decision.

[Noah]

Whis said if Goku and Vegeta teamed up against Beerus they might beat him so it's only a matter of time before they're able to defeat him in a one on one battle.

Champa is weaker then him so this applies to him as well.

Whis and Vados might be a stretch but if they use fusion then they might have a chance.

Oh, sorry... I misinterpreted, I thought you were saying that Piccolo and Gohan could surpass Goku and Vegeta in the future.

[kinisking]

Whis said if Goku and Vegeta teamed up against Beerus they might beat him so it's only a matter of time before they're able to defeat him in a one on one battle.

Champa is weaker then him so this applies to him as well.

Whis and Vados might be a stretch but if they use fusion then they might have a chance.

Oh, sorry... I misinterpreted, I thought you were saying that Piccolo and Gohan could surpass Goku and Vegeta in the future.

Eh, gohan surpassing them is very possible if he sticks to his training like he says.