Unpopular DB opinions

[Gonstead]

SSJ2 should of stayed exclusive to Gohan.

To me it just seems and works better that way.

[Piccolo Daimao]

SSJ2 should of stayed exclusive to Gohan.

To me it just seems and works better that way.

Same here. There shouldn't have been Super Saiyan 3 either; seriously, take that out of the story and there'd be little to no change. For example, in the first SS3 transformation scene, Gokuu could've just gone up to Boo to stall him. He'd tell him that he shouldn't take orders from Bobbodi, who'd protest and then Boo would take Gokuu's advice and kill him. Then Gokuu would tell him to wait for the strong fighter that'll come in a couple of days, then teleport back up to God's Palace to train the kids for Fusion.

[Michsi]

Same here. There shouldn't have been Super Saiyan 3 either; seriously, take that out of the story and there's little to no changes. For example, in the first SS3 transformation scene, Gokuu could've just gone up to Boo to stall him. He'd tell him that he shouldn't take orders from Bobbodi, who'd protest and then Boo would take Gokuu's advice and kill him. Then Gokuu would tell him to wait for the strong fighter that'll come in a couple of days, then teleport back up to God's Palace to train the kids for Fusion.

I think the SSJ3 is a good addition to the Buu Saga, but not for power or plot related reasons. It's a little fan theory of mine that this transformation was meant to be a little derided. From the way it looks to being the only SSJ transformation in the story that didn't save the day, despite being the strongest.

[Piccolo Daimao]

Same here. There shouldn't have been Super Saiyan 3 either; seriously, take that out of the story and there's little to no changes. For example, in the first SS3 transformation scene, Gokuu could've just gone up to Boo to stall him. He'd tell him that he shouldn't take orders from Bobbodi, who'd protest and then Boo would take Gokuu's advice and kill him. Then Gokuu would tell him to wait for the strong fighter that'll come in a couple of days, then teleport back up to God's Palace to train the kids for Fusion.

I think the SSJ3 is a good addition to the Buu Saga, but not for power or plot related reasons. It's a little fan theory of mine that this transformation was meant to be a little derided. From the way it looks to being the only SSJ transformation in the story that didn't save the day, despite being the strongest.

But it just got too ridiculous. There's no actual need for Super Saiyan 3. Literally the only thing good about it was that it didn't save the day for once, but it didn't do anything worth for the story either. Furthermore, it causes a plothole that's pretty hard to explain away, and no, I'm not going to bother delving into that now.

[Saiga]

So? It's a cool transformation, it doesn't really need much more than that to justify itself. And if you remove it from the story than Goku can't fight against Kid Boo.

[Piccolo Daimao]

So? It's a cool transformation, it doesn't really need much more than that to justify itself. And if you remove it from the story than Goku can't fight against Kid Boo.

Well, yeah, it kind of does, if you want a coherent (and enjoyable) story. And, to be honest, the actual appearance of Super Saiyan 3 was pretty lame. Raditz-long hair and no eyebrows?

Gokuu doesn't have to fight against Pure Boo. You could just change a few things round. E.g. have Mr. Satan step in against Pure Boo from the off, and then Pure Boo spits out Mr. Boo like normal. The two Boos fight, while Gokuu and Vegeta formulate the Genki-Dama plan. Super Saiyan 3 was nothing but a staller anyway.

[Saiga]

Well, yeah, it kind of does, if you want a coherent (and enjoyable) story. And, to be honest, the actual appearance of Super Saiyan 3 was pretty lame. Raditz-long hair and no eyebrows?

It's still coherent and enjoyable with Super Saiyan 3. I think just removing it would also remove some of the enjoyment out of the series. And the appearance of it is subjective, I think it's cool, and would have been especially cool if it kept the tail from the sketches.

Gokuu doesn't have to fight against Pure Boo. You could just change a few things round. E.g. have Mr. Satan step in against Pure Boo from the off, and then Pure Boo spits out Mr. Boo like normal. The two Boos fight, while Gokuu and Vegeta formulate the Genki-Dama plan. Super Saiyan 3 was nothing but a staller anyway.

That's changing the story, which you said removing SS3 wouldn't do.

SS3 is not really that much different from other power ups we got in the series, like Piccolo's fusions. Those were really nothing but stallers as well.

[Piccolo Daimao]

Well, yeah, it kind of does, if you want a coherent (and enjoyable) story. And, to be honest, the actual appearance of Super Saiyan 3 was pretty lame. Raditz-long hair and no eyebrows?

It's still coherent and enjoyable with Super Saiyan 3. I think just removing it would also remove some of the enjoyment out of the series. And the appearance of it is subjective, I think it's cool, and would have been especially cool if it kept the tail from the sketches.

Why would his tail grow back, though? Anyway, that's another matter. I just didn't really like it. There's one big plothole that affects a big part of the story because of SS3.

Gokuu doesn't have to fight against Pure Boo. You could just change a few things round. E.g. have Mr. Satan step in against Pure Boo from the off, and then Pure Boo spits out Mr. Boo like normal. The two Boos fight, while Gokuu and Vegeta formulate the Genki-Dama plan. Super Saiyan 3 was nothing but a staller anyway.

That's changing the story, which you said removing SS3 wouldn't do.

SS3 is not really that much different from other power ups we got in the series, like Piccolo's fusions. Those were really nothing but stallers as well.

I said there'd be little to no change. And I have my gripes with Piccolo's fusions too.

[Mjb1985]

Goku needed to get his groove back. Ssj3 was just for that.

Trunks ( Androids ) > Piccolo > Trunks ( Mecha )

SSJ Vegeta > Initial Semi Cell

50% Goku > Grade 3 Trunks

Cell ( Vs Gohan ) > Cell ( Vs Goku )

Trunks and Goten being close to Teen Gohan

Ssj Gotenks Pre > Ssj3 Goku

Base Gotenks Post > SSJ Gotenks Pre

Base Goku / Vegeta ( 28th ) > Good Buu


There are tons of unpopular DB opinions out there I'm sure I missed a bunch.

[Piccolo Daimao]

You know, I've actually changed my mind. I think Sean Schemmel's Gokuu in DBZ Kai is just as good, if not better, than Kelamis' Gokuu, and it's a good performance. I don't really have any problems with the voice and delivery itself, only that the dialogue needs some more "hick" sprinkling, in the form of contracted words such as "ain't" and "gonna".

SSJ Vegeta > Initial Semi Cell

50% Goku > Grade 3 Trunks

Cell ( Vs Gohan ) > Cell ( Vs Goku )

Those three are actually pretty common.

[Mjb1985]

I would add Super Saiyan 2 Gohan ~ Dabura.

Yea some of those are real common even if they are right they are just unpopular.

[Michsi]

But it just got too ridiculous. There's no actual need for Super Saiyan 3. Literally the only thing good about it was that it didn't save the day for once, but it didn't do anything worth for the story either. Furthermore, it causes a plothole that's pretty hard to explain away, and no, I'm not going to bother delving into that now.

What I meant wasthat maybe it was supposed to be ridiculous. Maybe the author was subtly trying to poke fun at the transformations and what the story had become. Ridiculous could be used to describe the entire Buu saga, from the kids being SSJs, to Buu , to fusions, to everything that is Gotenks and so on. So from that prespective, the SSJ3 fits right in. Not every single thing has to be woven tightly into the plot, so the SSJ 3 not proving to be useful is not a bad thing, especially in this arc, where Toriyama decided that he wanted to turn everything on it's head: the new transformation did not save the day, the glorified SSJ form became a joke, the imposter and coward becomes the true hero, the Genkidama that never worked before finally did. If it's one and only purpose was to add ludicrousness that is this arc, then I say it did a pretty good job.

[Saiga]

I don't think it was intentional on Toriyama's part, and I'm starting to resent how often people call the Boo Arc a self parody when Toriyama has said nothing of the sort. Dragon Ball has always been ridiculous, and SS3 is just a part of that.

[Piccolo Daimao]

It got too ridiculous. There needs to be a balance. Goten and Trunks shouldn't have gotten Super Saiyan seemingly out of nowhere, with a weak write-off excuse of "lulz bargain sale". Toriyama just got lazy, but that's understandable, considering the longevity of the series by this point.

[Mjb1985]

Agreed he was writing it with one foot out the door.

[Travis Touchdown]

There's one big plothole that affects a big part of the story because of SS3.

What plothole does it make? I've been mulling it over and I don't get it. What am I missing?

[Piccolo Daimao]

There's one big plothole that affects a big part of the story because of SS3.

What plothole does it make? I've been mulling it over and I don't get it. What am I missing?

Oh, for fucks' sake...

I didn't want to get into this, but fine, whatever. Nothing against you in particular; it's just that I don't like repeating myself, nor do I want to derail this thread.

The reason that Gokuu doesn't use Super Saiyan 3 to defeat Majin Boo is because he wants to leave it up to the kids, right? But before Mr. Popo even suggested that the kids use Fusion, Gokuu himself said that he couldn't beat Boo because he was only equal to Vegeta. So unless you want to stretch some warped theory that Gokuu was just lying and waiting for Popo to bring up the idea of Fusion for Goten and Trunks (because he's such a good actor), then you can do so. But I won't believe you, because, as I said, it'll be a stretch.

This kind of shit is why the Boo arc is the worst written arc of the series. Even the Cell arc is more coherent than this mess.

[TheDevilsCorpse]

Topic derailed, well not really. Still discussing your opinion, which I find unpopular =P Anyway, you say it'd be a stretch, but I don't really see how.

Goku could have honestly thought that he couldn't win when he first made the statement. He knows he was equal to Vegeta at SS2, and Vegeta died against Buu. He also knows SS3 will drain his time in the mortal realm and the exact depths of Buu's power aren't clear since he has yet to fight him. Goku would factor in that Buu could still be much stronger his time may run out before he had a chance to beat him, therefore he can't win. It wasn't until he needed to actually stall for time AND not die again that he decided to gamble on the form. While fighting Buu, he thinks he has a good grasp of the Majin's power and assumes Gotenks would be able to handle the job even if he doesn't finish Buu off himself...

A valid explanation, and hardly a stretch my any means IMO.

[Son Edo]

I cant remember if i posted in this thread.

SSj3 Gotenks > SSj Gogeta, Evil Boo-Gotenks was the coolest looking villian in the entire series, SSj3 is a cooler design than SSj2, Coola was a better villain than Freeza, Coola was the best Movie villian, Baby-Vegeta was the best GT villain, SSj4 is the same as Elder Kaioshins power-up, Semi perfect Cell's appearance was better than Perfect Cell.

[Mjb1985]

Yea Ssj3 Gotenks > Ssj Gogeta gets people real pissy.