"Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

[Lord Frieza]

Poor Bora and Upa, coming home to find a huge pile of tense balls covering their home. Hell poor anyone walking nearby, the lookouts so high those balls could reach terminal velocity and kill someone!

No matter how far we've departed from it being the main focus, the Dragon Ball universe's foundation is fundamentally gag based. Assuming the ball beat the odds and actually managed to hit someone, most likely the worst that would happen is they get knocked out and start swearing when they wake up.

I know, I know I just found the thought of people down below running for their lives because Dende or Popo were having an off-day to be rather amusing.

[ekrolo2]

Finally got around the reading the latest chapter (late to the party, I know) and fuck was it hilarious! I really didn't like the anime version because it's played up serious to the point where Vegeta looks like a moron for not just using SSB, but giving it a more comedic beat made it considerably better.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

Does anyone else get the feeling that Kaio-ken Super Saiyan Blue may be an anime-only thing, and not something from Toriyama's story draft (meaning that it won't be in the manga)? Not only it breaks the power scale (not only Toriyama's, but the Super anime's as well) & has inconsistent feats (Hit is shown to be a little weaker than SSB Goku, yet he can take multiple hits without significant damage by KKx10 SSB Goku?), but Goku has already been given enough good reasons for him to stop using it, since it heavily damages his body after using it, and it even gives him that ki sickness. Besides, the Super anime has a history of bringing back old techniques for fun, maybe they are behind Kaio-ken's return as well.

[LightBing]

Does anyone else get the feeling that Kaio-ken Super Saiyan Blue may be an anime-only thing, and not something from Toriyama's story draft (meaning that it won't be in the manga)? Not only it breaks the power scale (not only Toriyama's, but the Super anime's as well) & has inconsistent feats (Hit is shown to be a little weaker than SSB Goku, yet he can take multiple hits without significant damage by KKx10 SSB Goku?), but Goku has already been given enough good reasons for him to stop using it, since it heavily damages his body after using it, and it even gives him that ki sickness. Besides, the Super anime has a history of bringing back old techniques for fun, maybe they are behind Kaio-ken's return as well.

My initial impression was that the x10 part could be anime only. Goku barely accomplishes the technique, yet decides to push it up to x10. It's also very much contradictory to the progression of the initial Kaioken (Goku couldn't handle higher multiplications easily) and also an exaggeration to his needs during the fight with Hit.

The kaioken itself, I'm very confident it's Mr.Toriyama's idea. I would find it very strange for him to leave the entirety of the fight as a blank, or that Toei would ignore what he wrote.

[Sonicjamareiz]

Does anyone else get the feeling that Kaio-ken Super Saiyan Blue may be an anime-only thing, and not something from Toriyama's story draft (meaning that it won't be in the manga)? Not only it breaks the power scale (not only Toriyama's, but the Super anime's as well) & has inconsistent feats (Hit is shown to be a little weaker than SSB Goku, yet he can take multiple hits without significant damage by KKx10 SSB Goku?), but Goku has already been given enough good reasons for him to stop using it, since it heavily damages his body after using it, and it even gives him that ki sickness. Besides, the Super anime has a history of bringing back old techniques for fun, maybe they are behind Kaio-ken's return as well.

Why does it matter if its a Toei or a Toriyama thing?

[DBZGTKOSDH]

The kaioken itself, I'm very confident it's Mr.Toriyama's idea. I would find it very strange for him to leave the entirety of the fight as a blank

Given how different the fights are between the anime & manga, it seems Toriyama hasn't given them many details about the fights, and leaves them to Toei & Toyotaro respectively for the most part.

Does anyone else get the feeling that Kaio-ken Super Saiyan Blue may be an anime-only thing, and not something from Toriyama's story draft (meaning that it won't be in the manga)? Not only it breaks the power scale (not only Toriyama's, but the Super anime's as well) & has inconsistent feats (Hit is shown to be a little weaker than SSB Goku, yet he can take multiple hits without significant damage by KKx10 SSB Goku?), but Goku has already been given enough good reasons for him to stop using it, since it heavily damages his body after using it, and it even gives him that ki sickness. Besides, the Super anime has a history of bringing back old techniques for fun, maybe they are behind Kaio-ken's return as well.

Why does it matter if its a Toei or a Toriyama thing?

What's your point? I'm talking about the possibility that we may not see Kaio-ken in the manga.

[sintzu]

I would find it very strange for him to leave the entirety of the fight as a blank, or that Toei would ignore what he wrote.

He said he just writes outlines and leaves the rest to Toei so if it's not in the manga then this might've been the outline :

"After watching Vegeta's fight, Goku figured out Hit's technique and was able to fight evenly with him for awhile however, he realized that he was no match for him so he left the ring, giving U6 the victory"

You can do a lot with that kind of outline but you can also cause a lot of contradictions if the main writer isn't taking your work into account.

The Saiyan arc is a great example of this, we see Piccolo destroy Goku's ship in a filler episode but in a manga based episode Goku says he destroyed it when he was a baby.

[Kuririn Fan]

No way dude, that seems way too important to be just a "Toei thing". I guess we'll find out in july, lol.

[sintzu]

No way dude, that seems way too important to be just a "Toei thing". I guess we'll find out in july, lol.

This month we'll get Vegeta's fight with Cabba and possibly hit so next month will be Goku's,not July.

[Kuririn Fan]

The Saiyan arc is a great example of this, we see Piccolo destroy Goku's ship in a filler episode but in a manga based episode Goku says he destroyed it when he was a baby.

Goku's ship was intact, that's why Dr. Brief was able to construct that spaceship. In that bad anime filler, Piccolo destróys it but later Goku still says it's ok.

[sintzu]

In that bad anime filler, Piccolo destróys it but later Goku still says it's ok.

Yeah I remember it now, thanks for the heads up.

I really hope we don't get anything like that again.

[Sonicjamareiz]

In that bad anime filled, Piccolo destróys it but later Goku still says it's oak.

Yeah I remember it now, thanks for the heads up.

I really hope we don't get anything like that again.

The anime is following an outline that Toriyama wrote I doubt something like that would ever happen again.

[sintzu]

The anime is following an outline that Toriyama wrote I doubt something like that would ever happen again.

If the Kaioken is a Toei thing then that's exactly what's happening now.

[LightBing]

Based on the fight's we have so far, Mr.Toriyama outlines aren't as vague/limited as you guys have it. The only significant anime only stuff has been the Makansappo, Vegeta's Final flash/Gyarikku Hou and Frost expanded deceit. The outcomes of the fight's and the fighter's characteristics are very clearly from Mr.Toriyama. Everything significant is from him. The Kaioken and Hit's technique fall in this category.

[Dbzfan94]

Based on the fight's we have so far, Mr.Toriyama outlines aren't as vague/limited as you guys have it. The only significant anime only stuff has been the Makansappo, Vegeta's Final flash/Gyarikku Hou and Frost expanded deceit. The outcomes of the fight's and the fighter's characteristics are very clearly from Mr.Toriyama. Everything significant is from him. The Kaioken and Hit's technique fall in this category.

I agree with this. I think I recall reading an interview from Toriyama on here (could be completely wrong so forgive me) that basically said he was rereading the original manga to remember techniques and such, so Kaioken returning isn't so out of left field as we may think. The reason for Kaiokens absence in the Cell/Buu Sagas is definitely Toiryama though

[kinisking]

Based on the fight's we have so far, Mr.Toriyama outlines aren't as vague/limited as you guys have it. The only significant anime only stuff has been the Makansappo, Vegeta's Final flash/Gyarikku Hou and Frost expanded deceit. The outcomes of the fight's and the fighter's characteristics are very clearly from Mr.Toriyama. Everything significant is from him. The Kaioken and Hit's technique fall in this category.

I'm not even sure if Vegeta's final flash or galick gun could be considered significant because they weren't a major focus of the fight. None of them finished off Magetta. What did was the insult, just like with the manga. So I completely agree that significant stuff is coming straight from him. I think people are underexagerrating his role in the story so that they can blame it on toei when something goes wrong.

[Sonicjamareiz]

Based on the fight's we have so far, Mr.Toriyama outlines aren't as vague/limited as you guys have it. The only significant anime only stuff has been the Makansappo, Vegeta's Final flash/Gyarikku Hou and Frost expanded deceit. The outcomes of the fight's and the fighter's characteristics are very clearly from Mr.Toriyama. Everything significant is from him. The Kaioken and Hit's technique fall in this category.

I'm not even sure if Vegeta's final flash or galick gun could be considered significant because they weren't a major focus of the fight. None of them finished off Magetta. What did was the insult, just like with the manga. So I completely agree that significant stuff is coming straight from him. I think people are underexagerrating his role in the story so that they can blame it on toei when something goes wrong.

Yes I see the blame Toei bandwagon a lot its like Toriyama can't do anything wrong in their eyes.

[kinisking]

Based on the fight's we have so far, Mr.Toriyama outlines aren't as vague/limited as you guys have it. The only significant anime only stuff has been the Makansappo, Vegeta's Final flash/Gyarikku Hou and Frost expanded deceit. The outcomes of the fight's and the fighter's characteristics are very clearly from Mr.Toriyama. Everything significant is from him. The Kaioken and Hit's technique fall in this category.

I'm not even sure if Vegeta's final flash or galick gun could be considered significant because they weren't a major focus of the fight. None of them finished off Magetta. What did was the insult, just like with the manga. So I completely agree that significant stuff is coming straight from him. I think people are underexagerrating his role in the story so that they can blame it on toei when something goes wrong.

Yes I see the blame Toei bandwagon a lot its like Toriyama can't do anything wrong in their eyes.

I've seen it go in completely opposite directions. Most people either think he can't do anything wrong, or they disrespect him greatly by saying he's senile or a horrible writer. Thankfully this forum isn't quite as bad as elsewhere.

[LightBing]

Very curious about the direction of the Cabba and Vegeta fight. Guessing that Mr.Toriyama notes only have: threatens Cabba until he turns SSJ, it was all an act by Vegeta and finishes Cabba in SSJB.

Trusting that Toyotarõ doesn't have things like the characters suspecting Vegeta turned evil out of nowhere. That was very silly in my opinion. A Salad tidbit would also be nice.

Predicting the chapter ends with Hit entering the ring.

[Pannaliciour]

I was hoping to see Vegeta vs Hit and how they explain Hits time-freeze.