Goku a Superhero?

[Savage68]

Goku. Not a superhero.

Gohan. Also not a superhero.

Great Saiyaman. Superhero.

Simple enough!

Nail.
On.
The.
Head.

[Kendamu]

That's because some people don't know what a superhero really is and the people who do know keep arguing with the people who don't know. I just felt like simplifying things a bit since, really, the answer is extremely simple if you just step back and take a look at the overall picture.

That's a pretty bold statement considering your own definition of a superhero is narrower than Marvel's. I guess Thor isn't a superhero?

You mean the God-turned-human medical student (that has no Godly memories) who was normal before he gained powers, a costume, and a cool name through the accidental discovery of his old hammer? Sounds superhero-ish to me. Not only that, but he went the extra mile to do the whole double life thing like most superheroes.

Sure, he basically turned back into his old self, but the general consensus nowadays is that Batman is the reality and Bruce Wayne is the disguise. Same could be said for Thor.

[TonyTheTiger]

It's not a pseudonym, though. He actually is Thor. It's more or less the opposite of something like Green Lantern where a guy gets powers. Thor just regained what was rightfully his in the first place. Bruce Wayne wasn't born Batman. Regardless of which is his "true" self (I'm with you that he probably feels more attachment to the Batman identity), he still became Batman at some point. Thor was always Thor despite at one point having an alternate persona. He never became Thor.

And if you want a clearer example, Marvel's Hercules. Or DC's Orion. Or post Marvel Girl Jean Grey. There are a lot of characters under Marvel and DC's umbrella of "superhero" beyond just people with alter egos.

What about the reverse? Couldn't we consider Freeza and Cell supervillains?

[Hellspawn28]

I don't see why Cell or Freeza can't be counted as Supervillans? They are no different from the other popular villains like Loki, Violator, Doctor Doom, General Zod, Venom, and several villains in fiction?

[Piccolo Daimao]

What about the reverse? Couldn't we consider Freeza and Cell supervillains?

Yes, we can consider Freeza and Cell as supervillains, and probably other villains like Piccolo Daimao and Vegeta. Supervillain is defined as:

A fantasy fiction criminal or evil-doer, often with supernatural powers or equipment, in popular children's and fantasy literature who can present a credible challenge for a superhero.

Piccolo Daimao, Vegeta, Freeza and Cell all match that criteria in my opinion, just as much as the Joker, the Green Goblin, Lex Luthor, Magneto and Dr. Doom. It's much easier to label someone as a supervillain than it is to label someone as a superhero.

[TonyTheTiger]

But doesn't it follow that if you have a supervillain and that supervillain is beaten then whoever is doing the beating is a superhero? That of course is ignoring a concept like anti-hero which isn't really relevant to Goku and Gohan but possibly relevant to Vegeta.

But my point is that if Cell is a supervillain and Gohan beats him, saving the world in the process, then what's Gohan if not a superhero? Just some strong kid Cell pissed off? I think that's selling Gohan short.

[JulieYBM]

Herms just now reminded me, actually, of something that had occured to me back when I first got VizBIG Volume #5. In chapter #338: "The Artificial Humans, Head to the City..." (人造人間街へ…/Jinzouningen Machi e...), the Artificial Humanshad just destroyed Yajirobe's hover car and descended into the city. I don't have the dialogue on hand, but Gokû began barking off orders to the gang that struck me as almost "Superman leading the Justice League of America." It was, as far as I could remember, the first time this had happened in the comic proper. Dragon Ball Z movie #3 Super Deciding Battle for the Entire Planet Earth had a few similar moments, but this scene really stuck out to me.

That's the cloest element I can find that really connects Gokû to the traditional mainstream American/Western interrpretation of what a 'superhero' is. Considering how sparse the occasion(s) are it's almost a non-issue.

[Piccolo Daimaoh]

I know technically "superhero" would just mean a hero who happens to be "super", but in actual usage the term invokes various fairly specific elements (a secret identity separate from the heroic persona; a costume worn to conceal this secret identity; a commitment to fighting crime; etc), none of which apply to Goku at all.

No.


[quote="The actual definition of "superhero""]
a hero, esp. in children's comic books and television cartoons, possessing extraordinary, often magical powers.[/quote]


How does that not fit Gokū?

[Hellspawn28]

I think Vegeta will fall under as a "Anti Hero" since he was neither good or bad after the Saiyajin saga since he wanted to fight and win against Goku.

[Makaioshin]

Excuse my last post, I somehow missed the bottom of his post.

I know technically "superhero" would just mean a hero who happens to be "super", but in actual usage the term invokes various fairly specific elements (a secret identity separate from the heroic persona; a costume worn to conceal this secret identity; a commitment to fighting crime; etc), none of which apply to Goku at all.

No.


[quote="The actual definition of "superhero""]
a hero, esp. in children's comic books and television cartoons, possessing extraordinary, often magical powers.

How does that not fit Gokū?[/quote]
A dictionary definition provides a simplification of the meaning of the word in order to help you better understand it. Its not absolute and dictionaries can and do offer different definitions for words. Batman doesn't normally have extraordinary powers but is considered a superhero. A superhero is a type of literary character which has certain characteristics like the ones the user you quoted had mentioned.

[Piccolo Daimao]

You see, we're going round in circles now because everyone has different definitions of what they consider a superhero to be.

[caejones]

I'd go for the overkill approach: how difficult would it be to ask Marvel/DC representatives to weigh in on the subject? Seeing as they own the term...

[Piccolo Daimao]

I'd go for the overkill approach: how difficult would it be to ask Marvel/DC representatives to weigh in on the subject? Seeing as they own the term...

They probably don't give enough of a shit to answer a bunch of Dragon Ball fans what a superhero is just so they can settle their argument.

[NeoKING]

Funny enough, Mr. Satan is called a Super Hero in his TV debut in the manga.

[Piccolo Daimao]

Funny enough, Mr. Satan is called a Super Hero in his TV debut in the manga.

And at the end of the series, when Oob says he's poor, Goku says he'll get Mr. Satan to give him some money, as he makes a ton of money as a superhero.

[Adamant]

But doesn't it follow that if you have a supervillain and that supervillain is beaten then whoever is doing the beating is a superhero? That of course is ignoring a concept like anti-hero which isn't really relevant to Goku and Gohan but possibly relevant to Vegeta.

And all those sci-fi stories where the powerful menace is stopped by some smart guy, usually a scientist, discovering their weakness and exploiting it.

[Godo]

At least the Big Green dub gave Goku a Superhero voice. In the Funi dub, Great Saiya-man was given a Superhero voice.

I think it's mentioned in the manga a couple of times that Goku can be seen as a hero, though. As when he "saved the world" and such. Urunai Baba mentioned this once.

So in other words, Goku is a hero, but not in the Superhero sense. That is, he doesn't prevent injustice actively.

[caejones]

Funny enough, Mr. Satan is called a Super Hero in his TV debut in the manga.

And at the end of the series, when Oob says he's poor, Goku says he'll get Mr. Satan to give him some money, as he makes a ton of money as a superhero.

... Yay Papayaman? XD
Although Papayaman doesn't do anything outside of GT and Toyble's AF... and only in the latter does he act as a Superhero.

[Ketchup_Revenge]

I don't really consider him a superhero, even though he has super powers and does heroic things. But with Superheros, what makes them superheros is that consciously make a choice to uphold justice, no matter how twisted their reasoning may be. Goku does consciously uphold justice, but only on rare occasions when he has a reason to. Goku's reasoning is simply that he is an avid martial artist, and loves the thrill of fighting a strong opponent.

People often misunderstand what purity of heart means in Dragon Ball. Purity of heart does not refer purity of goodness or evil, but rather a lack of intent. This is how Goku can continuously make seemingly selfish and extremely risky or blatantly stupid decisions, and still be considered "pure". This is explained when Baba refers to him as "pure like a beast".

[Piccolo Daimaoh]

You see, we're going round in circles now because everyone has different definitions of what they consider a superhero to be.

Well, I'm going by the actual definition. Not the fan definition.