Is Vegito vastly superior to Gogeta or only slightly?

[Darkprince410]

I always felt that while Vegito was stronger, Gogeta's attacks were far more deadly. Basing it on his attacks. (Stardust Breaker)

That's not really a good way of looking at it though, since Vegetto had no intention whatsoever of killing Gohan Buu. He was intentionally playing around with him to force Buu into absorbing him. We never see Vegetto try to use a single attack on Buu that had the capacity to kill him, so saying that Gogeta's attacks were more deadly doesn't really have much merit.

Gogeta's attacks are more deadly because of the fact we didn't see Vegito's. Anything else is fan speculation.

That's not really a good way of looking at it though. The only way one can legitimately say that the attacks of one of them is deadlier than the attacks of the other is if we saw both actually using attacks with the intent to kill. Since Vegetto wasn't trying to kill Buu at all, then saying Gogeta's are deadlier cause he was trying to kill Janemba is irrelevant.

[TheBritWriter]

That's not really a good way of looking at it though. The only way one can legitimately say that the attacks of one of them is deadlier than the attacks of the other is if we saw both actually using attacks with the intent to kill. Since Vegetto wasn't trying to kill Buu at all, then saying Gogeta's are deadlier cause he was trying to kill Janemba is irrelevant.

Except Gogeta did so in a way that freed the host from the evil energy, that only became Janemba when merged onto someone. Vegito on the other hand had to exhaust Buu where absorption was the only option so he could dismantle buu and save everyone, which didn't go accordingly.

Gogeta has shown he is better in technique, or that he does have the power to undo a fused being similar to Buu whilst leaving the host unharmed.

[Darkprince410]

That's not really a good way of looking at it though. The only way one can legitimately say that the attacks of one of them is deadlier than the attacks of the other is if we saw both actually using attacks with the intent to kill. Since Vegetto wasn't trying to kill Buu at all, then saying Gogeta's are deadlier cause he was trying to kill Janemba is irrelevant.

Except Gogeta did so in a way that freed the host from the evil energy, that only became Janemba when merged onto someone. Vegito on the other hand had to exhaust Buu where absorption was the only option so he could dismantle buu and save everyone, which didn't go accordingly.

Gogeta has shown he is better in technique, or that he does have the power to undo a fused being similar to Buu whilst leaving the host unharmed.

Except that's not how events played out. Given what's shown in the movie as well as what's explained in the Daizenshuu, Gogeta simply destroyed Janemba, and it only happened to restore the oni that had been Janemba's "host". It wasn't a special technique that freed the host or anything like that, simply a ki bullet that eradicated Janemba. Vegetto didn't have that option, as destroying Buu would have killed Gohan and the others as well.

He had to go with the only option that was available to him, which was to force Buu to absorb him so he could go inside and save everyone.

[Neo-Makaiōshin]

My personal headcanon is like this :
For reference and argument sake lets say both Goku and Vegeta have a pl of 10.000 and we will ignore that Goku > Vegeta. Also we will have to ignore comparing Bu saga Vegetto with GT Shadow Dragon Gogeta in order to put them in even ground, so that mean we will compare them as if they were "born" in the same timeframe in the same arc.

Gogeta (base) = (A+B)×10=20.000×10=200.000
Gogeta SS1 = 10.000.000
Gogeta SS2 = 20.000.000 (for fairness i will give him more trnasformations)
Gogeta SS3 = 80.000.000
Gogeta SS4 (Personal headcanon of SS4 is SS3×10) = 800.000.000

Vegetto (base) = (A×B) = 10.000×10.000 = 100.000.000
Vegetto SS1 = 5.000.000.000

How the 2 compares to Goku:

SS1 (Base×50) = 500.000
Ss2 (ss1×2) = 1.000.000
SS3 (SS2×4) = 4.000.000
SS4 (SS3×10) = 40.000.000

Coclutions : Base Vegetto is ×10 stronger than SS1 Gogeta and in SS1 Vegetto stomps Gogeta with little to no effor.Gogeta in SS1 is x2.5 stronger than SS3 Goku.

[Truhan]

I like your thought process, but I would prefer if Potara Fusion was just their power output multiplied by each other, and then by the strongest/weakest fighter. Imagine that their power was 50 times higher than their base (SSJ):

50 * 50 = 2'500, and then 2'500 * 10'000 (Base Goku or Vegeta) = 25'000'000

Since (A + B) * 10 is the same as multiplying the lowest power by 20, we have:

10'000 * 20 = 200'000, which SSJ would increase into 10'000'000

SSJ Vegetto is 2.5 stronger than SSJ Gogeta. In my headcanon, off course. The difference would only increase the more power Vegeta and Goku used as Vegetto.

[buutenks]

If you are using gogeta use the one from the movie.

Super janenba raped ssj3 goku with easy.Super janenba is around super buu's level or so.ssj gogeta took a full frontal punch from him after janenba powered up and he didnt even flinch.

Clearly ssj gogeta>>>>>>>ssj3 gotenks.

So IMO,vegetto would be stronger but only slightly.

Except SSJ3 Goku is nowhere near Super Buu's level and also Goku was able to land some good hits on Janemba whereas his attacks arent even fazing Buutenks.

EH,we dont know how many times super buu is stronger than ssj3 goku,just that he is stronger.And when did i mention buutenks?Goku states he and vegeta cant beat super buu,ssj3 goku gets his butt kicked without even putting a dent in janenba then says that he needs fusion to beat him.I dont see how that is any different.

Then we have a full power super janenba( he powered up once gogeta came in to play,this shows he wasnt at his max vs ssj3 goku) punching ssj gogeta in the face and he doesnt even flinch.

So again,vegetto is still stronger,but only slightly.

Also,ssj1 goku and vegeta in the buu saga are easily at full power perfect cell level if not higher,that is leagues above ssj trunks and goten.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

SS Vegetto was many times stronger than SS3 Gotenks. SS Goku & Vegeta weren't many times stronger than SS Goten & Trunks, so SS Gogeta shouldn't be many times stronger than SS Gotenks either, assuming that Fusion gives them the same increase in power (and I don't see any reason for Gogeta to get a higher boost than Gotenks).

Another indication: A Potara fusion of Goku & Gohan would have been strong enough to beat Gotenks Boo because the Potara are that extreme, according to Rou Kaioshin. When Vegetto appeared, Rou Kaioshin said he was the strongest because they are 2 of the 3 strongest in the universe (#1 Gohan, #2 Goku, #3 Vegeta), and they are rivals on top of that, implying that Vegetto is the strongest possible result, stronger than Goku & Gohan would have been if they had merged. That would make base Vegetto much stronger than Gotenks Boo, U. Gohan, and SS3 Gotenks, maybe on around the same level as Gohan Boo, like the anime shows us. Which would make SS Vegetto over a hundred times stronger than SS3 Gotenks (!!!), and dozens of times stronger than a hypothetical SS3 Gogeta.

So yes, Vegetto seems to be really vastly superior to Gogeta, not just when in the same form, but in any form.

[miguelnuva1]

Vegito is not stronger than Gokhan, he only had the stronger potara fusion increase.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

Vegito is not stronger than Gokhan, he only had thw stronger potara fusion increase.

We can't know that for sure. The way I interpret Rou Kaioshin's statement implies, IMO, that Vegetto is stronger than "Gokhan" would have been.

Chapter: 504 (DBZ 310), P9.2-3
Context: as Vegetto beats up on Gohan-absorbed Boo
Kaioshin-Kibito: “H-he’s strong!!! Majin Boo there is helpless!!! To think that merging with the Potara would be this incredible…!!”
Elder Kaioshin: “Idiot, it’s because it was those two that they were able to go so far. Two of the top 3 masters in both the living world and afterlife have merged, after all. What’s more, two rivals have joined together. That’s definitely strongest.”

[Hitiro]

We can't know that for sure. The way I interpret Rou Kaioshin's statement implies, IMO, that Vegetto is stronger than "Gokhan" would have been.

But Rou Kaioshin also said that a fusion of Goku and Gohan wouldn't need anything other than base form. While Boohan is stronger then Bootenks I don't think it was by a massive degree. I mean if you believe Gohan's base form is basically the power he was showing right now then Base Gokhan should be much stronger than SSJ Vegetto. I mean if we put out some numbers and the maths, something like this:

Goku: 1
Vegeta: 1
Base Vegetto: (1+1)*25 = 50
Evil Boo: 800
Gohan: 1,000
Bootenks: 1,600
Boohan: 1,800
SSJ Vegetto: 2,500
Base Gokhan: (1,000 + 1)* 25 = 25,050

So I put 2,500 first for SSJ Vegetto and then worked backwards but lets say for arguments sake the Potara give their combined battle powers a 25x multiplication. These are just low-ball figures here. I've always thought about 25% is needed to thoroughly wreck an opponent in Dragon Ball. Also I don't think Evil Boo was only twice as strong as SSJ3 Goku. But the boost should look something like this I imagine. As you can see Rou Kaioshin's statement about them not needing to transform would hold up if we treat Gohan's power as his new base. And if you want to believe their battle powers are actually multiplied I would think that whatever huge number Gohan has a battle power multiplied by Goku's base battle power would provide a much higher battle power than just multiplying Goku and Vegeta's together.

[Perfectionist-Cell]

My personal headcanon is like this :
For reference and argument sake lets say both Goku and Vegeta have a pl of 10.000 and we will ignore that Goku > Vegeta. Also we will have to ignore comparing Bu saga Vegetto with GT Shadow Dragon Gogeta in order to put them in even ground, so that mean we will compare them as if they were "born" in the same timeframe in the same arc.

Gogeta (base) = (A+B)×10=20.000×10=200.000
Gogeta SS1 = 10.000.000
Gogeta SS2 = 20.000.000 (for fairness i will give him more trnasformations)
Gogeta SS3 = 80.000.000
Gogeta SS4 (Personal headcanon of SS4 is SS3×10) = 800.000.000

Vegetto (base) = (A×B) = 10.000×10.000 = 100.000.000
Vegetto SS1 = 5.000.000.000

How the 2 compares to Goku:

SS1 (Base×50) = 500.000
Ss2 (ss1×2) = 1.000.000
SS3 (SS2×4) = 4.000.000
SS4 (SS3×10) = 40.000.000

Coclutions : Base Vegetto is ×10 stronger than SS1 Gogeta and in SS1 Vegetto stomps Gogeta with little to no effor.Gogeta in SS1 is x2.5 stronger than SS3 Goku.

Where did you get that formula for fusion dance?

[Perfectionist-Cell]

Why are you guys saying Gogeta is around Gotenks level that is absurd.Trunks and Goten were in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber for a week you guys really think they are close to their fathers? If you use that type of logic Goku and Gohan would be Buu level when they were in there for year since you guys think Goten and Trunks are close to their fathers after a week of training. From what I know so far there is no fusion multiplier or some type of formula for fusion dance so where is everyone getting these fan calculations for it?

http://www.kanzenshuu.com/battle-power/list/ This list of official power levels shows the formula/multiplier for Potara fusion.

[miguelnuva1]

Vegito is not stronger than Gokhan, he only had thw stronger potara fusion increase.

We can't know that for sure. The way I interpret Rou Kaioshin's statement implies, IMO, that Vegetto is stronger than "Gokhan" would have been.

Chapter: 504 (DBZ 310), P9.2-3
Context: as Vegetto beats up on Gohan-absorbed Boo
Kaioshin-Kibito: “H-he’s strong!!! Majin Boo there is helpless!!! To think that merging with the Potara would be this incredible…!!”
Elder Kaioshin: “Idiot, it’s because it was those two that they were able to go so far. Two of the top 3 masters in both the living world and afterlife have merged, after all. What’s more, two rivals have joined together. That’s definitely strongest.”

Vegito isntantly with ssj in the manga to fight Buuhan, all Gokhan has to do is double Gohan's power and their base form destroys Nuuhan.

[Khin]

Why are you guys saying Gogeta is around Gotenks level that is absurd.Trunks and Goten were in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber for a week you guys really think they are close to their fathers? If you use that type of logic Goku and Gohan would be Buu level when they were in there for year since you guys think Goten and Trunks are close to their fathers after a week of training. From what I know so far there is no fusion multiplier or some type of formula for fusion dance so where is everyone getting these fan calculations for it?

The thing is i dont think Goten receive massive gains in the ROSAT but instead he was already narutaly strong since he was born.For Trunks,Bulma said that Vegeta trained him even since he learned how to walk so obviously he will also be ridiculously strong.There was also some things that hints Goten and Trunks was already that strong even before they enter the ROSAT.for example:

-Piccolo stating that Goten and Trunks are the only warriors left that can the save the Earth(this is before Piccolo know about fusion so this hints Goten/Trunks > Piccolo).
-Gohan choosing Goten as his sparring partner(Gohan could just ask Piccolo to be his partner but instead he chose Goten).
-Trunks able to punch Vegeta and doesnt get obliterated when Vegeta punch him back.
-Android 18 finishing the fight quickly once he realized that Mighty Mask is Goten and Trunks.

[Kamiccolo9]

Vegito is not stronger than Gokhan, he only had thw stronger potara fusion increase.

We can't know that for sure. The way I interpret Rou Kaioshin's statement implies, IMO, that Vegetto is stronger than "Gokhan" would have been.

Chapter: 504 (DBZ 310), P9.2-3
Context: as Vegetto beats up on Gohan-absorbed Boo
Kaioshin-Kibito: “H-he’s strong!!! Majin Boo there is helpless!!! To think that merging with the Potara would be this incredible…!!”
Elder Kaioshin: “Idiot, it’s because it was those two that they were able to go so far. Two of the top 3 masters in both the living world and afterlife have merged, after all. What’s more, two rivals have joined together. That’s definitely strongest.”

Vegito isntantly with ssj in the manga to fight Buuhan, all Gokhan has to do is double Gohan's power and their base form destroys Nuuhan.

The old Kaioshin said that Goku and Vegeta's fusion was "the strongest," and Vegetto later admitted that he didn't know his own power. That doesn't really prove anything.

And if you're basing Gogeta's power off of a movie, then you might as well drag the filler in where Vegetto was kicking Buu's ass in base.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

We can't know that for sure. The way I interpret Rou Kaioshin's statement implies, IMO, that Vegetto is stronger than "Gokhan" would have been.

But Rou Kaioshin also said that a fusion of Goku and Gohan wouldn't need anything other than base form. While Boohan is stronger then Bootenks I don't think it was by a massive degree. I mean if you believe Gohan's base form is basically the power he was showing right now then Base Gokhan should be much stronger than SSJ Vegetto. I mean if we put out some numbers and the maths, something like this:

Goku: 1
Vegeta: 1
Base Vegetto: (1+1)*25 = 50
Evil Boo: 800
Gohan: 1,000
Bootenks: 1,600
Boohan: 1,800
SSJ Vegetto: 2,500
Base Gokhan: (1,000 + 1)* 25 = 25,050

So I put 2,500 first for SSJ Vegetto and then worked backwards but lets say for arguments sake the Potara give their combined battle powers a 25x multiplication. These are just low-ball figures here. I've always thought about 25% is needed to thoroughly wreck an opponent in Dragon Ball. Also I don't think Evil Boo was only twice as strong as SSJ3 Goku. But the boost should look something like this I imagine. As you can see Rou Kaioshin's statement about them not needing to transform would hold up if we treat Gohan's power as his new base. And if you want to believe their battle powers are actually multiplied I would think that whatever huge number Gohan has a battle power multiplied by Goku's base battle power would provide a much higher battle power than just multiplying Goku and Vegeta's together.

But why should SS Vegetto be so close to Gohan Boo? The gap can potentially be much greater.

I also don't see why there is such a small difference between Gotenks Boo & Gohan Boo. The difference between U. Gohan & Evil Boo was really big (even though the difference apparently wasn't x2), while the difference between SS3 Gotenks & Evil Boo was hard to notice. Gohan Boo should be even stronger than Gotenks Boo IMO.

I don't believe that SEG wanted to say that Vegetto's BP is Goku's & Vegeta's BPs multiplied together, so I don't go by that. And yes, I do view Ultimate Gohan as base Gohan. However, Goku & Vegeta are closer to each other in base than Goku & Gohan are, since there is barely a difference in the first, while there is a monstrous difference in the other, so IMO Vegetto got a greater boost, or rather, the greatest boost the Potara could offer, since Goku & Vegeta are rivals, with rivaling power. We have seen that when there is a huge gap in power, the smaller the boost gets; Kibitoshin didn't make it past SS2 level even though Kaioshin was, apparently, already above the Super Saiyans, and Gotan was supposed to be only slightly stronger than Goku, or maybe weaker than Goku.

Even base Vegetto can still be stronger than Gohan Boo, just not much stronger. Don't forget that Vegetto's plan was to humiliate Boo with his monstrous power in order to make him absorb him. It's possible that even though he was stronger than him in base, he wouldn't be able to humiliate him, which is what the anime shows. I don't usually follow filler, but I don't see any contradiction in the idea it presents.

[Darkprince410]

Why are you guys saying Gogeta is around Gotenks level that is absurd.Trunks and Goten were in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber for a week you guys really think they are close to their fathers? If you use that type of logic Goku and Gohan would be Buu level when they were in there for year since you guys think Goten and Trunks are close to their fathers after a week of training. From what I know so far there is no fusion multiplier or some type of formula for fusion dance so where is everyone getting these fan calculations for it?

The Daizenshuu establishes that Goten is every bit as powerful as his brother is, and we're shown in universe, through both dialogue and feats, that the boys are extremely close to the adults power wise. Gohan commented to himself, after his first sparring match against Goten, that the boys might outstrip him if he isn't careful, and Vegeta was shown to have considerable difficulty in defending himself from Trunks' blows. Likewise, despite being a reactive punch brought on by anger, Vegeta's punch back at Trunks only made his face sore for a bit, and he bounced back from it like it was no big deal. The boys were already bewilderingly strong before their time in the Room of Spirit and Time. It wasn't just due to their time in the Room that they got so powerful.

So, since the boys are shown to be quite close to their fathers strength wise, then a fusion between Goten and Trunks should be proportionally close to a fusion between Goku and Vegeta.

[Truhan]

Oh please, not this argument again... Trunks has less mass than Vegeta, which in a gravity room makes all the difference. While Trunks is allowed to move fast, Vegeta packs quite a punch and only gets scratched. As for Goten... Gohan meant exactly what he said: if he's not careful, the boys are going to surpass him, and yet, they haven't unlocked SSJ2 on their own. The 2008 special places Goku and Vegeta quite close to, if not above Gotenks on a similar form, and Vegeta took more of a beating than Gotenks could ever dream of in BoG, while explicitly saying: "you stand no chance". If a fused character's power splits, no matter the formula, then Goten and Trunks are nowhere close to their parents, as if the over reliance on fusion wasn't enough of an argument.

[SSJ2FutureGohan]

Goten is demonstrably on par with Gohan, barring any "holding back" excuses; so however far away you have Gohan from Goku, there should be a similar gap between Goku and Goten.

Also, nothing in the 2008 JSAT special places Goku or Vegeta above Gotenks.

[Truhan]

I really wish the Daizenshuu didn't exist... It's as if people reverse engineer their logic because of one "official" statement made by editors, no matter if under Akira Toriyama's supervision, however little.