Do you think DBS is a worthy continuation of DB and DBZ?

[sintzu]

Both are official continuations, liking one over the other doens't change that.

Oh give me a break, a Toei fan-fiction still is a fan-fiction lol

Super is filled with way more fan fiction ideas than GT ever was. GT is a very flawed show but at the very least it tried to be original. It also tried to tell a story first and sell merchandise second which is the opposite of Super.

[PsionicWarrior]

Super is filled with way more fan fiction ideas than GT ever was.

Well not really since Toriyama didn't write anything in GT lol

[sintzu]

Well not really since Toriyama didn't write anything in GT lol

So it has nothing to do with GT's content but rather the name attached to it ? That's a very small and limited way of looking at things.

[PsionicWarrior]

Like you said earlier, there is what you think and there is facts. In the facts, Toriyama writes in Super and he didn't in GT. Therefore GT is the fanfiction, even if it was better than the original (and it certainly isn't) it would still be a fanfiction lol

[TheMikado]

Super is filled with way more fan fiction ideas than GT ever was.

Well not really since Toriyama didn't write anything in GT lol

Toriyama made all initial character designs and wrote detailed notes on some. Further he must have had a concept of the story and direction as he specifically named it GT for grand tour implying it was either his idea to do the adventure aspect or he was at least aware of it in preproduction when he named and designed the logo, further he made location art, some of which ended up in GT. How much he know or was involved is constantly debated, but at the very least he was aware of concepts, derivations and did designs in preproduction in addition to his detailed notes.

[PsionicWarrior]

@Mikado

What notes did he write? Never heard of that. I knew of the designs but the designs isn't the story and lore lol

[sintzu]

Toriyama writes in Super and he didn't in GT. Therefore GT is the fanfiction.

GT is an official product with Toriyama's OK so it's anything but fan fiction. That term is just used for things made by fans.

[PsionicWarrior]

GT is an official product with Toriyama's OK so it's anything but fan fiction. That term is just used for things made by fans.

Well wasn't GT made by fans lol
I see we're arguing on semantics, Toriyama giving his OK didn't make him write it lol

[sintzu]

Well wasn't GT made by fans ?

It was made by the company that made the previous 2 shows. how does that = being made by fans ?

[PsionicWarrior]

It was made by the company that made the previous 2 shows. how does that = being made by fans ?

How does not written by original author =/= to fanfiction lol

[TheMikado]

@Mikado

What notes did he write? Never heard of that. I knew of the designs but the designs isn't the story and lore lol

It's in GTs production page of this site.

Toriyama designed the spaceship which Goku and company use to hunt for the Dragon Balls throughout the universe. Like his Giru design, Toriyama’s spaceship drawings were printed in Weekly Shōnen Jump No. 52, 1995, and later reprinted in Daizenshuu 7 and the GT Perfect File Vol. 1. They include fairly detailed notes, which unfortunately are left out of the Perfect Files reprint.

[precita]

Super is the bees knees. While it's still worse than every arc in DBZ, it's still a worthy continuation. People don't realize how good they have it.

[PsionicWarrior]

@Mikado
Thanks, but notes about what, none of GT's plot is Toriyama's design lol

[TheMikado]

@Mikado
Thanks, but notes about what, none of GT's plot is Toriyama's design lol

This looks like notes on the spacecraft, I don't know if he wrote others but I use that as an example that Toriyama did write notes and had some involvement with the lore to some degree and it didn't make it into the GT perfect files for whatever reason. Just like Vegetas mustache and other things Toriyama was involved to some degree at least initially.

[Asura]

No. It's enjoyable fanfiction. I'm getting around to watching Kai TFC now and honestly it's like two completely different shows with completely different characters.

GT is more of a worthy continuation in my eyes. The show is plagued with problems but if nothing else they handled the characters much, much better than Super has, and the art, animation, etc. look like a continuation of Z rather than some neutered digital animation that "modernizes" the characters.

Super might be able to execute ideas better than GT has, but as a whole GT gives off much more of an old school DB/DBZ vibe than Super does.

One thing GT did better for sure was put an unquestionable end to Goku's adventures. As much as I don't like endings where the main character dies (according to Nozawa anyway), I thik it was the only way to end a story like DB that's written in a way that can go on forever so Goku dying and the DBs going with him put an end to everything.

Ironically enough that's the one thing I really hate about GT. I like an ending that implies Goku and friends will have many more adventures like the ending of Z (the Uub thing is its own separate problem). We don't need to see them having many more adventures, we don't need Super to show us all these adventures, just enough to know that at the end of the day the show/manga/whatever might have ended but the implication that those character's stories haven't is nice. I don't like how GT basically just makes it all end and kills off Goku for a depressing melancholy ending. Dragon Ball was a story started on adventure, and I don't think there should ever be a conclusion to that adventure. That's not to say the show shouldn't end, just that the ending implies there will always be more adventures for the characters to go on even if we can't see or read it.

Super is the bees knees. While it's still worse than every arc in DBZ, it's still a worthy continuation. People don't realize how good they have it.

Super would have been better off not existing in my opinion. It doesn't feel like something that's necessary and while it's constituted a revival for the series, I don't think it was a series that exactly needed reviving. Sometimes too much of a good thing isn't such a good thing after all and it's better to just preserve the legacy of what you already have instead of possibly tainting it, especially when said new series doesn't just add things but also retracts or revises things from the original series as well (Like Vegetto for instance).

In TV shows this is always a hotly contested topic. Where do you end the TV show? Do you just make it go on forever because people demand more, or do you actually write a conclusion somewhere that neatly wraps up everything in a bow? This is the problem that shows like Walking Dead face where they plan to make the show go on forever and have no ending. A great example of a show that ends where it's supposed to is Breaking Bad. Arguably one of the most popular TV shows ever, but the writers knew where to end it and not drag the story out just because people wanted more. It's actually quite relevant given Game of Thrones Season 7 just ended and I've already talked to people who are saddened and pissed at the fact that next season is the last one. I love GoT more than anyone but I'm happy they're going to end it where it should end and not drag it on. Of course people always want more of what they enjoy but sometimes if you don't have a solid ending the rest of the show starts to suffer as a result.

[PsionicWarrior]

This looks like notes on the spacecraft, I don't know if he wrote others but I use that as an example that Toriyama did write notes and had some involvement with the lore to some degree and it didn't make it into the GT perfect files for whatever reason. Just like Vegetas mustache and other things Toriyama was involved to some degree at least initially.

Mate he completely ignored anything GT with Battle of Gods and Super goes from there and that is the only official continuation there is, what are you on about he wrote a note on whatever spacecraft or other cosmetics lol

[TheMikado]

This looks like notes on the spacecraft, I don't know if he wrote others but I use that as an example that Toriyama did write notes and had some involvement with the lore to some degree and it didn't make it into the GT perfect files for whatever reason. Just like Vegetas mustache and other things Toriyama was involved to some degree at least initially.

Mate he completely ignored anything GT with Battle of Gods and Super goes from there and that is the only official continuation there is, what are you on about he wrote a note on whatever spacecraft or other cosmetics lol

Except that's not true at all, Super won't overtake GT despite what anyone would like to think. They did in fact have GT at least in their minds when discussing where to continue. In fact according to Toriyama it looks like he has no plans to continue past EoZ which we are soon approaching.

— The “Dragon Ball” kanzenban have brought in new readers, and I think that as fans it’s only natural that they’d want to see a new “Dragon Ball Z” title. What would you think about making a new anime work about once a year or so?

Toriyama: Oh, I’d like to see that.
Nakatsuru: But by the final chapter, Goku had gotten pretty old. And even after that he was the main character for the anime-original “Dragon Ball GT”. If we’re going to be making stories left and right here, maybe we should rewind time a bit and make them stories set sometime in the past.
Toriyama: I think so too. Instead of continuing the story further and further into the future, it’d be better to do a separate episode style of story development where you go back in time and go “this sort of enemy was here, and this sort of story”. Just say “it wasn’t in the original work, but this sort of story happened”. Maybe that would be better.

Sorry mate

[Torturephile]

This looks like notes on the spacecraft, I don't know if he wrote others but I use that as an example that Toriyama did write notes and had some involvement with the lore to some degree and it didn't make it into the GT perfect files for whatever reason. Just like Vegetas mustache and other things Toriyama was involved to some degree at least initially.

Mate he completely ignored anything GT with Battle of Gods and Super goes from there and that is the only official continuation there is, what are you on about he wrote a note on whatever spacecraft or other cosmetics lol

Except that's not true at all, Super won't overtake GT despite what anyone would like to think. They did in fact have GT at least in their minds when discussing where to continue. In fact according to Toriyama it looks like he has no plans to continue past EoZ which we are soon appraching.

How so? Certain aspects of both shows aren't compatible with one another unless they redo GT.

[TheMikado]

Mate he completely ignored anything GT with Battle of Gods and Super goes from there and that is the only official continuation there is, what are you on about he wrote a note on whatever spacecraft or other cosmetics lol

Except that's not true at all, Super won't overtake GT despite what anyone would like to think. They did in fact have GT at least in their minds when discussing where to continue. In fact according to Toriyama it looks like he has no plans to continue past EoZ which we are soon appraching.

How so? Certain aspects of both shows aren't compatible with one another unless they redo GT.

It's already been discussed in another thread but they have essentially setup the narrative in such a way that literally all of Super could be contingent on Goku and Beerus meeting and that undoing of that one event would prevent Trunks timeline from being destroyed or the multiverses from fighting in the tournament. Plus the winner gets to make a wish on the Super Dragonballs wishing for anything they want and to which we don't know the limits of its power of it has any.

So the easiest answer wouldn't be to redo EoZ or GT, it would to be to undo Super.

[PsionicWarrior]

@Mikado
I'm sorry butI don't see how this makes GT either Toriyama's work or canon.