The original Super Saiyan revealed!

[VegettoEX]

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[Captain Strawberry]

S-cells. Cells that are genetically inside Saiyans. There’s mothing to explain about them.

It does for me. It bothers me that the Saiyajin have completely different transformations that are nothing alike.

Does Vegeta's explanation of Bruits Waves back in the Saiyan arc not explain it enough?

That's more of the scientific explanation/observation, I'm looking more so towards the lore implication or origin.

What’s the problem that they have two different forms?

That they are different. I'd be somewhat fine if they are some sort of twisted mutation of "S" Cells but that's head canon. It's not very grounded for me and saying that, Toriyama could pretty much excuse himself with anything if there was no problem with them having two polar opposite transformations. Why do they have two distinct transformations? What's with their genes? Did one of them have a very old ancestor that had this ability (so mixed blood)? I'd be fine with that if it was just stated. But since it's not, it's just headcanon and since it's also not stated, I will say it's not very defining of what a Saiyajin's biology if that makes sense. I just want a bigger explanation, more information.

[BrolyKale]

Okay, guy.

The only Saiyan who is bloodthirsty is Vegeta when he was a bad guy, Goku never been bloodthirsty... at least I don't think so. He likes battle but that's about it, he never wants to kill people or destroy stuff.

Obviously you didn’t watch the Freeza Arc. I said “okay” because you missed out.

I watched it, even read the Manga. Goku isn't a bloodthirsty warrior. He didn't even want to kill Freeza and gave him his own energy... so how is he bloodthirsty??

[BlazingFiddlesticks]

I just realized that because Yamoshi was in continuous search for a new savior, that is the reason the ceremony is necessary. It summons Yamoshi's spirit. I guess that’s what Toriyama was saying.

That isn't a bad idea, really; it would provide something to differentiate it from Saiyans simply ki-injecting, while a wandering spirit idea is vague enough not to require any "logistics" to it.

[Captain Strawberry]

That isn't a bad idea, really; it would provide something to differentiate it from Saiyans simply ki-injecting, while a wandering spirit idea is vague enough not to require any "logistics" to it.

That makes sense. So it's like summoning his power?

[Meshack]

The only Saiyan who is bloodthirsty is Vegeta when he was a bad guy, Goku never been bloodthirsty... at least I don't think so. He likes battle but that's about it, he never wants to kill people or destroy stuff.

Obviously you didn’t watch the Freeza Arc. I said “okay” because you missed out.

I watched it, even read the Manga. Goku isn't a bloodthirsty warrior. He didn't even want to kill Freeza and gave him his own energy... so how is he bloodthirsty??

I just said that bloodthristy doesn’t necessarily mean that you wanna kill someone. Lookey here: https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/bloodthirsty

[Meshack]

That isn't a bad idea, really; it would provide something to differentiate it from Saiyans simply ki-injecting, while a wandering spirit idea is vague enough not to require any "logistics" to it.

That makes sense. So it's like summoning his power?

I’m getting that it summons the spirit of Yamoshi.

[Captain Strawberry]

I’m getting that it summons the spirit of Yamoshi.

I wish some of these ideas were mentioned in the actual story! Instead of waiting for answer in a interview

[BlazingFiddlesticks]

That isn't a bad idea, really; it would provide something to differentiate it from Saiyans simply ki-injecting, while a wandering spirit idea is vague enough not to require any "logistics" to it.

That makes sense. So it's like summoning his power?

I’m getting that it summons the spirit of Yamoshi.

To be clear, the only thing the text actually says is that Yamoshi was searching a group of Saiyans capable of producing a Super Saiyan God. We still do not know how the ritual works.

The presence of some seemingly immortal, ethereal Saiyan of the same mindset as the one that a Super Saiyan God is supposed to have simply provides a unique element to the form= why the thing is able to exist. I like the idea, but it isn't quite what Toriyama said.

[Captain Strawberry]

This reminds me of Tokyo Ghoul now that I think about it.

[Meshack]

That makes sense. So it's like summoning his power?

I’m getting that it summons the spirit of Yamoshi.

To be clear, the only thing the text actually says is that Yamoshi was searching a group of Saiyans capable of producing a Super Saiyan God. We still do not know how the ritual works.

The presence of some seemingly immortal, ethereal Saiyan of the same mindset as the one that a Super Saiyan God is supposed to have simply provides a unique element to the form= why the thing is able to exist. I like the idea, but it isn't quite what Toriyama said.

I didn’t say that’s what Toriyama said if you read what I said. But let’s say they didn’t summon the spirit and the spirit is just wandering around. Why is the spirit looking for a savior? Toriyama said the ceremony/ritual is there to become God. Usually, rituals are done to summon something. Why would the ritual be necessary if it doesn’t do anything. It would be no different from everyone giving their energy to Gokuh.

[Meshack]

This reminds me of Tokyo Ghoul now that I think about it.

Me too. Maybe Kale has more S-cells than Gokuh and the others and her and Yamoshi had the same amount, thus creating the green Super Saiyan.

[BrolyKale]

This reminds me of Tokyo Ghoul now that I think about it.

Me too. Maybe Kale has more S-cells than Gokuh and the others and her and Yamoshi had the same amount, thus creating the green Super Saiyan.

"Maybe" but thats just pure speculation.

[Meshack]

This reminds me of Tokyo Ghoul now that I think about it.

Me too. Maybe Kale has more S-cells than Gokuh and the others and her and Yamoshi had the same amount, thus creating the green Super Saiyan.

"Maybe" but thats just pure speculation.

I didn’t say it was fact. It is something Tokyo Ghoul fans would catch onto.

[Bebi Hatchiyack]

I think S Cells are similar in both U6 and U7 but we need to keep safe regarding Kale

I think Kale transformation is akin to her Universe alone something only Univerrs 6 have.

[emi_b7]

At first I hated this "S cells" thing, but at the end of the day it doesn't really change much. You still need to be strong and kind hearted to become a SS, this is just an explanation of what happens in Saiyans' bodies when they meet those requeriments, so it's fine to me. It wasn't a needed explanation, but it is fine. This is not midichlorians folks, don't panic lol
Bonus points for explaining how Goten and Trunks become SS so easily (their S cells count was high at birth because they inherited them from their parents) and giving a backstory to the SSG ritual.

[BlazingFiddlesticks]

I’m getting that it summons the spirit of Yamoshi.

To be clear, the only thing the text actually says is that Yamoshi was searching a group of Saiyans capable of producing a Super Saiyan God. We still do not know how the ritual works.

The presence of some seemingly immortal, ethereal Saiyan of the same mindset as the one that a Super Saiyan God is supposed to have simply provides a unique element to the form= why the thing is able to exist. I like the idea, but it isn't quite what Toriyama said.

I didn’t say that’s what Toriyama said if you read what I said. But let’s say they didn’t summon the spirit and the spirit is just wandering around. Why is the spirit looking for a savior? Toriyama said the ceremony/ritual is there to become God. Usually, rituals are done to summon something. Why would the ritual be necessary if it doesn’t do anything. It would be no different from everyone giving their energy to Gokuh.

So I must confess, I know precisely what you said- and Herms translation has the Tori-bot bubble read "So that's why there is a ritual for Super Saiyan God". It checks out.

I'm just being overtly clear to do my small part in not letting speculation congeal with fact- something Dragon Ball fans are good enough at to convince the world that Toriyama wanted to the end the story with Freeza!

[Khandom101]

You know I wouldnt be surprised if Goku happened to be the descendent or reincarnation of that Yomoshi guy.
Who knows Toriyama may be taking some inspiration from the Naruto series.

[Lord Beerus]

I made these comments about the new lore in the main (Super) discussion thread and my stance stays the same:

I find the concept of S-Cells it quite interesting and unique, with the realm of Dragon Ball, to be honest. Yeah, they are basically Midichlorians 2.0, but it at least explains why the likes of Goten, Trunks, Cabba, Caulifla and Kale could become Super Saiyans as easily as they did. No harm, no foul. As far as I'm concerned.

I'm really happy that the Namekian Book of Legends wasn't a throwaway line. It actually has some meaning in terms of lore. Cool beans.

Everything surrounding Yamoshi sounds incredibly intriguing. I find it very compelling that the Original Super Saiyan, as well as the Original Super Saiyan God, are tied together in some way. I would love to see an OVA or TV special expand on that bit of lore. It could tell a potentially great story.

[AvatarReiko]

I don't understand the idea behind "his spirit wandering to find 6 righteous saiyans". What exactly was his involvement in SSGod? And why 6? How'd the ritual came to be? It doesnt explain anything about SSGod actually.

Six because Yamoshi and his comrades were a group of six. Presumably, Yamoshi's spirit is the reason why one can become a Super Saiyan God.

I think the better question is why Yamoshi's spirit didn't go straight to the checking station