So its been many years, are alternate hair colors for Super Saiyan transformations a good or bad idea

[Thanos]

I don't have an issue with it, as I'm not sure what the alternatives would be. Something absurd like SSJ3 or SSJ4? SSJ4 is a cool design in a vacuum, but as a Super Saiyan transformation it doesn't make a hell of a lot of sense or fit the trend. SSJ3 is just ridiculous... your eyebrows disappear and then instantly regrow when you go back to base form. Okay?

I guess maybe different hairstyles (like how SSJ2 is a bit different from SSJ1) and levels of bulk/disappearing pupils would make sense... or even more unique auras/effects. I liked Rose in that regard, the aura and effects around it make it truly seem like an evil, corrupt god version of Blue.

[Desassina]

Different hair colors are a good idea, but not to the extent that fans are taking them, specially with regards to orange and purple in the waiting line, because the trope is not that they need to complete the rainbow, only that each color needs to represent the state that these characters are in.

I don't agree with the notion that Super Saiyan God was when Toriyama thought that he could subvert expectations through color, because the former was due to his skinny and soft, whismical appearance. He created some confusion in the movie that it was introduced in by letting Goku revert and transform into Super Saiyan, which was the prototype of SSGSS without the blue color that showed up in Resurrection of F.

After that, the anime went its own way of referencing other characters and their colors from the past, mixing old techniques and combining auras just like Kaioken and Trunks's. The manga is slightly worse in this new development, because it can't represent color transformations intuitively, and needs exposition to explain their differences, since they don't change shape like the grades and numbered forms in the original manga.

I think that what counts as Toriyama's innovation is in movie form, since he's trying to target a wider audience by simplifying these tropes, and presenting them in a sequence that is less subject to scrutiny. Take DBS: Broly's concept art and script writing against the animators choices of color to see that studios have something to say in spite of his authority. Toyotaro in his manga as well.

[Yuli Ban]

<Large Images Snipped>

Those pics are funny but I'm pretty sure the reaction wasn't so positive when Future Trunks' return or Goku Black were first revealed. It's just that Super genuinely made these cliché ideas work, and so even if Goku Black literally sounds like a DeviantArt OC, Toriyama's genius made him work as an actual character in a way that an amateur fanfic writer wouldn't have been able to. I don't see anything wrong with taking an overused idea and executing it well.

I agree.
In fact, without a care, Toriyama went even edgier than most fanfic writers would dare

[Yuji]

I liked most of the transformations we've seen and how they were utilized in the manga (mostly). I agree the anime went a bit overboard and made several forms redundant, however.

Dragon Ball is fan fiction, too. Everything is basically fan fiction. The distinction as if it is an inherently inferior format is really bothersome. Fan fiction is more often than not better than commercial works and have limitless potential that capitalism otherwise makes impossible.

That's just NOT true at all. Fan fiction is mostly terrible, and rarely better than original works practically by its nature given that it's an imitation.

All art is imitation.

[ABED]

I liked most of the transformations we've seen and how they were utilized in the manga (mostly). I agree the anime went a bit overboard and made several forms redundant, however.

Dragon Ball is fan fiction, too. Everything is basically fan fiction. The distinction as if it is an inherently inferior format is really bothersome. Fan fiction is more often than not better than commercial works and have limitless potential that capitalism otherwise makes impossible.

That's just NOT true at all. Fan fiction is mostly terrible, and rarely better than original works practically by its nature given that it's an imitation.

All art is imitation.

Imitation of life, not someone else's voice, perspective, interests, and idiosyncrasies.

[Dragon Ball Ireland]

Fan fiction can be good, the problem is that a lot of them are lazily written and don't capture the original author's style very well.

Dragon Ball is an interesting case. It's so loosely based on Journey to the West, and the further you go into the story the more it becomes its own thing. Toriyama's humour also helps give his stories their own flavour regardless of their originality.

[JulieYBM]

Fan fiction can be good, the problem is that a lot of them are lazily written and don't capture the original author's style very well.

Dragon Ball is an interesting case. It's so loosely based on Journey to the West, and the further you go into the story the more it becomes its own thing. Toriyama's humour also helps give his stories their own flavour regardless of their originality.

Why would you want to copy a style you're unfamiliar with instead of writing in your own style and delivering better work? Speaking as a fan fic writer myself I'd hate to artificially stick to just Toriyama's style because that isn't any fun at all.

[Dragon Ball Ireland]

Fan fiction can be good, the problem is that a lot of them are lazily written and don't capture the original author's style very well.

Dragon Ball is an interesting case. It's so loosely based on Journey to the West, and the further you go into the story the more it becomes its own thing. Toriyama's humour also helps give his stories their own flavour regardless of their originality.

Why would you want to copy a style you're unfamiliar with instead of writing in your own style and delivering better work? Speaking as a fan fic writer myself I'd hate to artificially stick to just Toriyama's style because that isn't any fun at all.

I don't mean copying another author or artist's style, I mean emulating it. Toyataro emulates Toriyama when it comes to his art, it looks like it could have come from Toriyama but not strictly so.

[Matches Malone]

This is the problem with continuing the works of others. If your style is different it may not fit with the author's, and if it's too similar it can be looked at as an unoriginal copycat. Authors who come back to their work years later can also deal with this.

[SupremeKai25]

I agree.
In fact, without a care, Toriyama went even edgier than most fanfic writers would dare

Makes sense, Zamasu is basically God Hitler. Also he is a God, so it makes sense that he would dress elegantly in fine clothes, like all Gods do. Meanwhile that Fanfic Evil Goku is dressed like a hobo, like the ningen saiyans are. Toriyama continues to surprise with his subversions, I guarantee you that if Black was written by the fandom then he'd have been a stupid Turles rehash.

[Yuli Ban]

Maybe, but if Evil Goku were a Nazi, we'd never hear the end of it about how this was the edgiest fancharacter in Dragon Ball until Columbine Gohan

[pepd]

Spoiler:

Fan fiction can be good, the problem is that a lot of them are lazily written and don't capture the original author's style very well.

Dragon Ball is an interesting case. It's so loosely based on Journey to the West, and the further you go into the story the more it becomes its own thing. Toriyama's humour also helps give his stories their own flavour regardless of their originality.

Why would you want to copy a style you're unfamiliar with instead of writing in your own style and delivering better work? Speaking as a fan fic writer myself I'd hate to artificially stick to just Toriyama's style because that isn't any fun at all.

To make it feel like and fit with the original work.

[TheSaiyanGod]

The fanfiction argument is so weird. Transformations with different hair colors were envisioned in past fanfictions or theories just as much as long haired bulky forms a la Super Saiyan 4 (Super Saiyan 5 and its infamous variations are well known in fandom). But just one of them is attacked with this. I don't get this criticism alone

As I said in another thread, I don't see different colors as necessarily a problem. But the overload of new forms certainly undermines their impact on the story and that is a problem. But using the manga as an example, Super Saiyan Blue remained the main transformation of the Saiyan duo for 4 consecutive arcs. Not even in DB did the transformations remain relevant for more than 1 arc (Cell arc alone introduced 3 more variations for the Z Fighters). But I really don't think the forms of Kale and Broly are necessary. Kale was supposed to be a kind of canonical Broly and basically that was the reason why she had a completely unique form. So Broly is actually introduced and the same thing happens (with the difference that apparently Toriyama didn't even plan his green haired form, it was just fanservice)