"Dragon Ball Super" Series Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

[Nero<>Akira]

that SSB battle damaged Goku looks mighty fine.

[TheSaiyanGod]

Not surprised at all that Goku may have to use SSJB again against Kafla. Kale in her SSJ Berseker form walked through a Kamehameha from SSJB Goku like it was nothing in Episode 100.

Apparently, in the next EP Goku will be able to face Kale (with his fully controlled Bersek form) and Caulifla SSJ2 at the same time. Nullifying this "impression" that Kale has the same level as the Goku SSB.

Anyway, people do not waste time and already criticize the Blue transformation, we do not even know if it will lose.
As I said on some other topics, this is the most hated transformation of all, anything is already a reason for this ...

Goku is still recovering (so theoretically the SSB is not in full power), and it is plausible Kefla to be at a level capable of at least rivaling Goku Blue, nothing wrong here

She's in her control Super Saiyan form when fighting with Cali against Goku in the NEP. In fact, the only scene with Berserk Kale is her pushing Goku back, Goku shooting her with his foot, pushing her back, and her reverting to her controlled Super Saiyan form.

No, apparently, the controlled Berserker form is the way we saw it in the preview. Look at the image below.

[spoiler][/spoiler]

In this image (EP 113) Kale is in his regular SSJ form, and his hair is looking more yellow than green.

But in the two images below, her hair is green, just like when it stays in the Berseker state (shown in EP 100). Goku is also saying that she has completely controlled this transformation (in the synopsis the same thing is said).

[spoiler]
[/spoiler]

Coincidentally, in VJUMP I think (a few months ago) Kale herself was shown with her hair just like the preview of EP 114, green (not yellow like her regular SSJ transformation) and without being muscular and looking similar to the Broly.

[spoiler][/spoiler]

At no point in the preview is shown Kale Berserker with the appearance of broly

So we can only conclude that the form shown in the preview is Kale's controlled Berseker, since it is different from her SSJ form

[SansrivaaL]

You see in the NEP that she's only Berserk up to the point that Goku blast her with her foot and then she reverts. After that, she's clearly not in her Berserk form anymore when she's fighting with Cali. Which is usually the case when the NEP is hiding something.

She doesnt need to look like the berserk form visually, its Goku's claim that made it that way, he said she became a true legendary SSJ because she's now able to control that fierce power, basically she doesnt need to look like SSJ on steroids to maintain the power.

[HeroR]

Apparently, in the next EP Goku will be able to face Kale (with his fully controlled Bersek form) and Caulifla SSJ2 at the same time. Nullifying this "impression" that Kale has the same level as the Goku SSB.

Anyway, people do not waste time and already criticize the Blue transformation, we do not even know if it will lose.
As I said on some other topics, this is the most hated transformation of all, anything is already a reason for this ...

Goku is still recovering (so theoretically the SSB is not in full power), and it is plausible Kefla to be at a level capable of at least rivaling Goku Blue, nothing wrong here

She's in her control Super Saiyan form when fighting with Cali against Goku in the NEP. In fact, the only scene with Berserk Kale is her pushing Goku back, Goku shooting her with his foot, pushing her back, and her reverting to her controlled Super Saiyan form.

No, apparently, the controlled Berserker form is the way we saw it in the preview. Look at the image below.

[spoiler][/spoiler]

In this image (EP 113) Kale is in his regular SSJ form, and his hair is looking more yellow than green.

But in the two images below, her hair is green, just like when it stays in the Berseker state (shown in EP 100). Goku is also saying that she has completely controlled this transformation (in the synopsis the same thing is said).

[spoiler]
[/spoiler]

Coincidentally, in VJUMP I think (a few months ago) Kale herself was shown with her hair just like the preview of EP 114, green (not yellow like her regular SSJ transformation) and without being muscular and looking similar to the Broly.

[spoiler][/spoiler]

At no point in the preview is shown Kale Berserker with the appearance of broly

So we can only conclude that the form shown in the preview is Kale's controlled Berseker, since it is different from her SSJ form

I don't think she has a different form, especially when your evidence is different shading in her hair which happens when you have different artists. Like Blue has gone through several shades. The same with normal Super Saiyan which can be colored as blond, gold, or a bright yellow depending on the artist.

She doesnt need to look like the berserk form visually, its Goku's claim that made it that way, he said she became a true legendary SSJ because she's now able to control that fierce power, basically she doesnt need to look like SSJ on steroids to maintain the power.

The fact remains that we haven't seen Goku fight Berserk Kale in the NEP outside of the snippet I named. Goku's voice over is irreverent in this matter since the whole thing started because people wondered if Super Saiyan 2 Goku could handed Kale after Berserk Kale walked through a Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan's Kamehameha.

[SansrivaaL]

The fact remains that we haven't seen Goku fight Berserk Kale in the NEP outside of the snippet I named. Goku's voice over is irreverent in this matter since the whole thing started because people wondered if Super Saiyan 2 Goku could handed Kale after Berserk Kale walked through a Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan's Kamehameha.

You do know the ending of ep 113 was Kale in her berserk form right? she wants to get stronger, she voluntarily went SSJ Berserk/LSSJ, it makes no sense for her to drop back to plain old SSJ if she was going for something higher, and its not like they have that much of a time to have Kale power down again and slowly control that berserk power as Kefla's coming out.

[perucho1990]

From Takahashi twitter



Hyping the upcoming episode 114.

[Michsi]

From Takahashi twitter
*snip

Hyping the upcoming episode 114.

Actually really like how Kale looks in this drawing. Wish they'd drop the lipstick part of her design. It looks fine in her regular form, but just off when she transforms.

[BlueBasilisk]

You see in the NEP that she's only Berserk up to the point that Goku blast her with her foot and then she reverts. After that, she's clearly not in her Berserk form anymore when she's fighting with Cali. Which is usually the case when the NEP is hiding something.

I'm not sure she's berserk in any of the NEP shots. She's not big enough:
[spoiler][/spoiler]

The hair color is different from what her controlled form had in this episode, but I wonder if that might be some weird color discrepancy. When she powers up into her Berserk form, it's the proper green in the recycled rotating shot, but in the new close-up, it's the same pale green as her controlled form:
[spoiler]
[/spoiler]

[HeroR]

You see in the NEP that she's only Berserk up to the point that Goku blast her with her foot and then she reverts. After that, she's clearly not in her Berserk form anymore when she's fighting with Cali. Which is usually the case when the NEP is hiding something.

I'm not sure she's berserk in any of the NEP shots. She's not big enough:
[spoiler][/spoiler]

The hair color is different from what her controlled form had in this episode, but I wonder if that might be some weird color discrepancy. When she powers up into her Berserk form, it's the proper green in the recycled rotating shot, but in the new close-up, it's the same pale green as her controlled form:
[spoiler]
[/spoiler]

Until stated otherwise, I don’t think it’s anything since Super Saiyan and Blue goes through several shades. And these can be ‘corrected’ before the epsoide airs.

[BlueBasilisk]

Until stated otherwise, I don’t think it’s anything since Super Saiyan and Blue goes through several shades. And these can be ‘corrected’ before the epsoide airs.

That's what I was saying, I think it's her controlled form throughout and the colors are just different since her hair changes shades between two cuts in the same episode. And if you look at Goku's hair in the 115 preview, it's way more neon blue than it was in 109.

[TheMikado]

From Takahashi twitter
*snip

Hyping the upcoming episode 114.

Actually really like how Kale looks in this drawing. Wish they'd drop the lipstick part of her design. It looks fine in her regular form, but just off when she transforms.

exactly, that drawing looks so much better its unreal.

[Whatever]

Exactly like that!

Bring Vegetto back was hot garbage.
The fusion expiration time was/is hot garbage.
SSBxKK is hot garbage.

of course everyone is entitled to their opinions but I expressed from the beginning I had no desire for them to rehash the potara fusion when you have a much more flexible and less permanent method of fusion.
Plus I hope we don't start a trend where we get a ton of "fusions" as this will start to feel more like Digimon than Dragonball. But that kind of stuff is popular with kids and selling toys so who knows...

Honestly the potara time limit was needed for that reason.'Why don't they just fuse' is a question that should not have been left lingering forever since the potara had only 1 drawback and a lot of positives and even that drawback could be undone by the dragonballs after they dealt with the big bad.
The fusion dance was already impractical enough the way it was,so the potara needed a nerf as well,so fusions would not be an easy solution to the problem.

Also considering Vegeto is a power-fantasy/overpowered type of character,i would be lying if i said i did not enjoy seeing M-Zamasu smashing his face in the anime version.

[MisteryOne]

Introducing more fusions is not going to make the series look more than Digimon that it already is. I don't get the point behind that.

I seriously hope they fix Kale's hair anyway. That dark green is way too different to what we have been seeing until now. Then again, it could be a third form, but in that case I have to ask why was the second one a thing at all.

[Noah]

Not surprised at all that Goku may have to use SSJB again against Kafla. Kale in her SSJ Berseker form walked through a Kamehameha from SSJB Goku like it was nothing in Episode 100.

That scene still makes little sense and it's probably one of the reasons many feel like Super Saiyan Blue isn't a threat but a joke. I disagree

How does it not make sense?

The same Kale you said 'walked through a Kamehameha from SSJB Goku' was effortlessly defeated by Jiren, who began to make movements more often and proceed to attack Goku when he became a SSJB.

[Jigurashi]

That scene still makes little sense and it's probably one of the reasons many feel like Super Saiyan Blue isn't a threat but a joke. I disagree

How does it not make sense?

The same Kale you said 'walked through a Kamehameha from SSJB Goku' was effortlessly defeated by Jiren, who began to make movements more often and proceed to attack Goku when he became a SSJB.

Doesn't that just means he hadn't been fighting 100% seriously against Kale like he was with Jiren?

[BlueBasilisk]

The same Kale you said 'walked through a Kamehameha from SSJB Goku' was effortlessly defeated by Jiren, who began to make movements more often and proceed to attack Goku when he became a SSJB.

Who blindsided Kale but attacked Goku head on. Jiren went after Goku because Belmod told him to and effortlessly beat the shit out of him within seconds even with the advantage of Kaioken x20.

[Noah]

Doesn't that just means he hadn't been fighting 100% seriously against Kale like he was with Jiren?

Sure we can always use the "Holding Back" card

[TheMikado]

Exactly like that!

Bring Vegetto back was hot garbage.
The fusion expiration time was/is hot garbage.
SSBxKK is hot garbage.

of course everyone is entitled to their opinions but I expressed from the beginning I had no desire for them to rehash the potara fusion when you have a much more flexible and less permanent method of fusion.
Plus I hope we don't start a trend where we get a ton of "fusions" as this will start to feel more like Digimon than Dragonball. But that kind of stuff is popular with kids and selling toys so who knows...

Honestly the potara time limit was needed for that reason.'Why don't they just fuse' is a question that should not have been left lingering forever since the potara had only 1 drawback and a lot of positives and even that drawback could be undone by the dragonballs after they dealt with the big bad.
The fusion dance was already impractical enough the way it was,so the potara needed a nerf as well,so fusions would not be an easy solution to the problem.

Also considering Vegeto is a power-fantasy/overpowered type of character,i would be lying if i said i did not enjoy seeing M-Zamasu smashing his face in the anime version.

The occupied two separate realms.

Fusion Dance: Only available to those with similar body and power levels. Temporary. Time limit based on power exerted. Dance requires time and precision otherwise can result in improper fusion. Difficult to use mid battle.
Previous Potara: Permanent. Requires external mechanism to reverse. Rival boost. No time limit. No power limit. No limit on bodies/types/power levels. Requires Potara earrings. Otherwise flawless fusion.
Current Potara: Time limit. Available to anyone who has Potara earrings. Temporary. Time limit based on power exerted. Still flawless. Easy to use mid battle.

Why this sucks?
This is not added to the big long list of Deux Ex Machina available to Goku at anytime.

1) Beerus, thus far unbeatable.
2) Whis, temporal do-over
3) Zeno, God of All button
4) Super Dragonballs which grant any wish
5) Temporary Potara fusion any time they want.

If all these fail you can always pull the "holding back" card and have Goku suddenly win because he was just playing around before.

Like come on. We had the dragon radar and then the Namek dragonballs which people complained about. But now they can resolve pretty much any issue with any number of tools.
The "why" don't they fuse was impractical for several reasons.
1) to do the fusion dance, Goku and whoever it was would need to know it and time to perform it correctly, plus be similar size/power/type etc. It was only usable in specific circumstances.
2) The potara earrings required a Kaioshin and I believe they were destroyed originally. Now we've got at least 12 sets of them. Further the one drawback that made them an absolute last ditch effort has been removed so now. Going into any fight they are going to look like complete asshats. For instance. Why not have Vegeta and Goku fuse to defeat Jiren rather than a 10 person spirit bomb.
Shoot, They could have gone Vegetto Blue x KK x 20 and still do the spirit bomb if they wanted. Making this temporary didn't fix anything but rather made a ton of new holes.

Introducing more fusions is not going to make the series look more than Digimon that it already is. I don't get the point behind that.

I disagree
[spoiler][/spoiler]
[spoiler][/spoiler]

The point is getting fusion characters which don't exist as anything but temporary fusion characters.

[pacz360]

The same Kale you said 'walked through a Kamehameha from SSJB Goku' was effortlessly defeated by Jiren, who began to make movements more often and proceed to attack Goku when he became a SSJB.

Who blindsided Kale but attacked Goku head on. Jiren went after Goku because Belmod told him to and effortlessly beat the shit out of him within seconds even with the advantage of Kaioken x20.

doesn't matter kale got one shotted while ssjb goku put up more of a fight despite getting stompec

[SansrivaaL]

[spoiler][/spoiler]

What the hell are those supposed to be?
Beerus+Whis?
Arale+Towa? seriously? Towa? wth...
Goku and... Broly?
Piccolo and.. Pilaf? or Krillin and Piccolo?
Pan and... Videl? wtf...