The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread

[Draken]

And there is something wrong with that? Vegetto is an end game character so he can be that strong. It says like multiplication though so it doesn't have to be exact. I have base Vegetto at 1,000,000,000,000.

That's 1/6 of the weakest version of Vegetto if we go by something close to multiplication. Vegetto is strong, but not worlds and worlds above Gogeta.

[TheMightyOzaru]

And there is something wrong with that? Vegetto is an end game character so he can be that strong. It says like multiplication though so it doesn't have to be exact. I have base Vegetto at 1,000,000,000,000.

That's 1/6 of the weakest version of Vegetto if we go by something close to multiplication. Vegetto is strong, but not worlds and worlds above Gogeta.

Vegetto is IMO. He certainly would be if it was exact multiplication.

[Draken]

And there is something wrong with that? Vegetto is an end game character so he can be that strong. It says like multiplication though so it doesn't have to be exact. I have base Vegetto at 1,000,000,000,000.

That's 1/6 of the weakest version of Vegetto if we go by something close to multiplication. Vegetto is strong, but not worlds and worlds above Gogeta.

Vegetto is IMO. He certainly would be if it was exact multiplication.

I've already just pointed out it's near impossible for it to be multiplication. Your Buu saga levels place Vegetto at 1/6 the strength of a theoretical Freeza saga Vegetto. As said before, it's "closer" to multiplication (as in, more than Goku x 2), but it's probably not literally Goku x Vegeta.

[Kamiccolo9]

I'm always confused by Bojack's henchmens power.

And he's Kamiccolo I believe it is an anime line , I know Viz doesn't have that in there. You read Japanese I presume Kamiccolo?

Very little. I can read hiragana and katakana just fine and look up what the words mean, but my kanji skills are sadly lacking. I've read through the viz manga plenty of times though, and always watch the anime using the subtitles, but sometimes stuff gets mixed up. When possible, I use Herms' translations on the site, like the strength checker.
Regardless, it doesn't really change my views on the matter. I don't see there being much of a gap between the kids and the adults after Goten and Trunks train in the Room of Space and Time, so Gogeta, IMO, shouldn't be worlds above Gotenks. In the movies, sure, but that's Toei logic for you.

[Mjb1985]

I don't think boys are much weaker either but Gogeta should be enough to handle Buutenks based on Goku's statement imo.

[Kamiccolo9]

Buutenks, maybe. But this topic is Gogeta against Buuhan, who is far superior to Buutenks.

[Mjb1985]

Well if you can definitely beat Buutenks I would think you would be capable of fighting Buuhan.

[Kamiccolo9]

Well if you can definitely beat Buutenks I would think you would be capable of fighting Buuhan.

Well, Gohan was way stronger than Super Buu, who was, let's say equal, to Gotenks. So if Buu's fusions are additive, which most seem to believe, than Buutenks should be roughly twice as strong as Super Buu. And Gohan was weaker than Buutenks, but stronger than Super Buu, so let's put him in the middle. Then, he added Gohan to his power. When the fusion wore off, Goku thought that Gohan could beat Buuccolo, so Gohan was stronger here.
So,
Goten-1
Trunks-1
SSJ3 Gotenks-10
Super Buu-10
Piccolo-2
Gohan-15-17
Buutenks-22
Buuccolo-14
Buuhan-29-31

So Buuhan would have been roughly 3 times as strong as SSJ3 Gotenks. While Gogeta would probably be somewhat stronger, I don't see him being over 3x as strong as Gotenks, considering the relative closeness of the base forms of the kids and adults.

[Mjb1985]

I would probably do it like this

Buuhan 25
Buutenks 20
Gohan 15
Gotenks 10
Super Buu 10

I don't think Base Goten, Trunks or Piccolo would be more than a drop in the bucket at this level so I don't really factor them in.

So if Metamoran Gokan who may or may not be = to a Metamoran Gogeta ( if Vegeta retained his power up ) , then how strong would he have to be to definitely be able to beat Buutenks?

22 would probably be minimum right?

[Kamiccolo9]

I would probably do it like this

Buuhan 25
Buutenks 20
Gohan 15
Gotenks 10
Super Buu 10

I don't think Base Goten, Trunks or Piccolo would be more than a drop in the bucket at this level so I don't really factor them in.

So if Metamoran Gokan who may or may not be = to a Metamoran Gogeta ( if Vegeta retained his power up ) , then how strong would he have to be to definitely be able to beat Buutenks?

22 would probably be minimum right?

Around that seems about right. And I was referring to SSJ Trunks and Goten inside Buu. I think that he can access their dormant power when they are inside his body. But regardless, your numbers seem pretty good. But I feel that metamoran Gohan would be way stronger than Gogeta. SSJ3 Goku + Suppressed Ultimate Gohan would be far superior to SSJ2 Goku + SSJ2 Vegeta.

[Mjb1985]

Those are good points as well. We don't know how Metamoran works exactly.

How about this?

Goten and Trunks fuse as Super Saiyan. Then transform into Super Saiyan 3 as Gotenks.

A different version of Goten and Trunks have Super Saiyan 3. Same Base / Ssj power but they have access to Ssj3. Now if they fuse as Super Saiyan 3's , which version of Ssj3 Gotenks is stronger ?

[Kamiccolo9]

Those are good points as well. We don't know how Metamoran works exactly.

How about this?

Goten and Trunks fuse as Super Saiyan. Then transform into Super Saiyan 3 as Gotenks.

A different version of Goten and Trunks have Super Saiyan 3. Same Base / Ssj power but they have access to Ssj3. Now if they fuse as Super Saiyan 3's , which version of Ssj3 Gotenks is stronger ?

They should be the same. The metamorese fusion requires the fusees to be at equal strenth when they fuse, as seen with Goten and Trunks. But I don't see why the rest of Trunks' strength should have disappeared when he fused. As long as they are equal when they fuse, then the two Gotenks' should be even. IMO.
With Gogeta, you have essentually SSJ3 Goku and SSJ2 Vegeta.
With Gokan, you would have SSJ3 Goku and Ultimate Gohan. Since the parts are much stronger, the resulting fusion should be far superior.

Even if the suppressed energy doesn't count towards the Fusion, SSJ3 Goku and a Suppressed Ultimate Gohan is still >>>>>>>>> SSJ2 Goku and SSJ2 Vegeta.

[Saiyan Prince Vegeta]

Those are good points as well. We don't know how Metamoran works exactly.

How about this?

Goten and Trunks fuse as Super Saiyan. Then transform into Super Saiyan 3 as Gotenks.

A different version of Goten and Trunks have Super Saiyan 3. Same Base / Ssj power but they have access to Ssj3. Now if they fuse as Super Saiyan 3's , which version of Ssj3 Gotenks is stronger ?

They should be the same. It doesn't matter if Goten and Trunks fuse as SSJs or in their base form, his multipliers don't stack. It's like if they fuse in base both Gotenks will be equal, so even if Gotenks powers up to SSJ3, and the SSJ3 boys fuse it will be the same because both Gotenks base are equal, and the multipliers remain as 50x, 2x, and 4x.

I hope it makes sense.

[TheMightyOzaru]

I've already just pointed out it's near impossible for it to be multiplication. Your Buu saga levels place Vegetto at 1/6 the strength of a theoretical Freeza saga Vegetto. As said before, it's "closer" to multiplication (as in, more than Goku x 2), but it's probably not literally Goku x Vegeta.

No it's not. Vegetto has no rival, he can be greater than 6 Trillion and have the story make sense. Yeah I just think it's closer to multiplication instead of exact but even then I still have Vegetto 50x stronger than Gogeta.

[Draken]

I've already just pointed out it's near impossible for it to be multiplication. Your Buu saga levels place Vegetto at 1/6 the strength of a theoretical Freeza saga Vegetto. As said before, it's "closer" to multiplication (as in, more than Goku x 2), but it's probably not literally Goku x Vegeta.

No it's not. Vegetto has no rival, he can be greater than 6 Trillion and have the story make sense. Yeah I just think it's closer to multiplication instead of exact but even then I still have Vegetto 50x stronger than Gogeta.

Are you even looking at the powers? A Freeza saga Vegetto using your multiplication is already 6x stronger than your Buu saga Vegetto. That shows a vast difference from multiplication. Also, no equal/end game? Beers and Whis would make Vegetto their bitch . Arguably SSG Goku could as well.

[PerfectFreeza]

Vegetto can't be Goku x Vegeta. That even by using the Freeza saga Vegeta and Goku would make Vegetto too strong.
Base Vegetto immediately went Super Saiyan against Gohan Boo, so it's likely, that he couldn't be that much ahead of Gohan Boo in base, if at all.

[Kamiccolo9]

Vegetto can't be Goku x Vegeta. That even by using the Freeza saga Vegeta and Goku would make Vegetto too strong.
Base Vegetto immediately went Super Saiyan against Gohan Boo, so it's likely, that he couldn't be that much ahead of Gohan Boo in base, if at all.

All we know about Vegetto's power is that in Super Saiyan he is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Everything else in the series, short of the stuff in the new movie. There's no reason why he couldn't be that strong.

[PerfectFreeza]

He can be only over 50x stronger, than Gohan Boo, since the official multiplier is 50x Base.
And Base Vegetto can't be that far ahead of Gohan Boo, if at all, since he immediately went SSJ after being born. If he was already like 2x stronger than Gohan Boo, then there wouldn't be any need for him to transform and it would make Gohan Boo even more mad, since he would be handling him without transforming.

[Draken]

Vegetto can't be Goku x Vegeta. That even by using the Freeza saga Vegeta and Goku would make Vegetto too strong.
Base Vegetto immediately went Super Saiyan against Gohan Boo, so it's likely, that he couldn't be that much ahead of Gohan Boo in base, if at all.

All we know about Vegetto's power is that in Super Saiyan he is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Everything else in the series, short of the stuff in the new movie. There's no reason why he couldn't be that strong.

Because a Freeza saga Goku x Vegeta is already well above most people's power levels lists.

[Kamiccolo9]

He can be only over 50x stronger, than Gohan Boo, since the official multiplier is 50x Base.
And Base Vegetto can't be that far ahead of Gohan Boo, if at all, since he immediately went SSJ after being born. If he was already like 2x stronger than Gohan Boo, then there wouldn't be any need for him to transform and it would make Gohan Boo even more mad, since he would be handling him without transforming.

His goal wasn't to make Gohan mad. It was to make him desperate enough to absorb him. Vegetto also said that even he was surprised at how well the fusion turned out. Sounds to me like he didn't know how strong he would be in base, so he went straight to Super Saiyan.

Vegetto can't be Goku x Vegeta. That even by using the Freeza saga Vegeta and Goku would make Vegetto too strong.
Base Vegetto immediately went Super Saiyan against Gohan Boo, so it's likely, that he couldn't be that much ahead of Gohan Boo in base, if at all.

All we know about Vegetto's power is that in Super Saiyan he is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Everything else in the series, short of the stuff in the new movie. There's no reason why he couldn't be that strong.

Because a Freeza saga Goku x Vegeta is already well above most people's power levels lists.

So? I didn't say that it had to be straight multiplication, only that it still works if you do it like that. The anime manages just fine with this fight, and it doesn't contradict anything in the manga, so I don't see any problem with it.