Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

[ekrolo2]

I don't think Trunks and Mecha Freeza should be equals.

Chapter: 331 (DBZ 137), P9.1
Context: challenging Freeza and Cold
Trunks: “Come at me at full power right from the start. I’m not soft like Son Goku…”

If there was a fight I think you'd be right but the way it plays out is Freeza getting terrified of Trunks, firing a blast at him, dodging another aimed at him instead with Trunks pouncing on him from above and slicing him to pieces. If Freeza powered up to such a significant degree, I think some of the spectators would've mentioned it or Toriyama would've had Mecha-Freeza bulk up. I think the best he managed to do was go up to 50% or 70% before Trunks introduced him to his sword.

[ZombieVito]

King Cold - 5,000,000
Unseen max power - 170,000,000

Freeza was confirmed to be stronger than his father.

Was he? I remember the Kai dubbing having stated that his power was greater than Freeza's but that must've been in their relaxed states only.

http://web.archive.org/web/201110211707 ... #king_cold

[Kaboom]

Don't you have a DB BP list, Kaboom?

Nope, I pretty much just take the official pre-Raditz numbers at face value and don't worry about it. Like I've said a lot before, battles didn't depend almost entirely on power level for most of that part of the story, so I think it's kind of pointless to fuss over the numbers anyway.

I just have a mostly-serious DBZ list, a more fun-centered "movies and specials" list, a straight-up satirical GT list, and an "it's my story so I do whatever I want" GTR list.

[Blackstripe]

Was he? I remember the Kai dubbing having stated that his power was greater than Freeza's but that must've been in their relaxed states only.

Only if you're following the Daiz, mind you. If not, you can pretty much make Cold stronger or weaker at your discretion, since we have no idea on whether or not he had a final form. I personally have him stronger, since he was King Cold. Why would someone like Freeza ever defer such a title to someone weaker than himself? We know he had no true affection for him since he said they shouldn't revive him in RoF.

[Kamiccolo9]

Was he? I remember the Kai dubbing having stated that his power was greater than Freeza's but that must've been in their relaxed states only.

Only if you're following the Daiz, mind you. If not, you can pretty much make Cold stronger or weaker at your discretion, since we have no idea on whether or not he had a final form. I personally have him stronger, since he was King Cold. Why would someone like Freeza ever defer such a title to someone weaker than himself? We know he had no true affection for him since he said they shouldn't revive him in RoF.

It'd be a bit odd for him to call a guy who could beat Freeza the "strongest in the universe," if he himself was already stronger than Freeza. And he doesn't object when Freeza calls himself the "strongest in the universe."

[Darkron2151]

How strong do you all have the following characters in DB Super?

• Pre-god Goku (Base-SS3)
  Gohan (Ultimate)
  Vegeta (Raging)
  SSG Goku
  Beerus
  Whis
  Post-god Goku (Base-SS1)

[ZombieVito]

Pre-god Goku (Base-SS3)
Base: 90,000,000
SSJ3: 36,000,000,000

Gohan (Ultimate): 90,000,000,000 or 120,000,000,000 (depends on Goku's base after the god power up).
Vegeta (Raging): 600,000,000,000
SSG Goku: 6,000,000,000,000
Beerus: 10,000,000,000,000
Whis: 15,000,000,000,000

Post-god Goku (Base-SS1)
Base: Undecided. I'm juggling with x10 or x50 as a multiplier for his Super Saiyan form.
SSj1: 6,000,000,000,000

[Darkron2151]

Post-god Goku (Base-SS1)
Base: Undecided. I'm juggling with x10 or x50 as a multiplier for his Super Saiyan form.
SSj1: 6,000,000,000,000

I'm just confused on how Super Saiyan Blue fits into his new power and how it replaces regular Super Saiyan, as Goku is shown to still be able to transform into it after his fight with Beerus. I'm also confused on how strong his new Base form is with god power. Would it be the one just as strong as SSG or would it be Super Saiyan?

[RandomGuy96]

Was he? I remember the Kai dubbing having stated that his power was greater than Freeza's but that must've been in their relaxed states only.

Only if you're following the Daiz, mind you. If not, you can pretty much make Cold stronger or weaker at your discretion, since we have no idea on whether or not he had a final form. I personally have him stronger, since he was King Cold. Why would someone like Freeza ever defer such a title to someone weaker than himself? We know he had no true affection for him since he said they shouldn't revive him in RoF.

It'd be a bit odd for him to call a guy who could beat Freeza the "strongest in the universe," if he himself was already stronger than Freeza. And he doesn't object when Freeza calls himself the "strongest in the universe."

Also, the only thing Freeza said about his father's strength (besides indirectly saying "he's weaker than me" by calling himself the strongest guy in the world while standing five feet away from Cold) was that Cold was able to get dust on him, which doesn't sound like he holds his strength in high regard. Well, that and that he'd be valuable back-up against Goku... which again directly implies that Freeza's stronger, since he continually orders Cold around and treats him like a sidekick.

[ZombieVito]

Post-god Goku (Base-SS1)
Base: Undecided. I'm juggling with x10 or x50 as a multiplier for his Super Saiyan form.
SSj1: 6,000,000,000,000

I'm just confused on how Super Saiyan Blue fits into his new power and how it replaces regular Super Saiyan, as Goku is shown to still be able to transform into it after his fight with Beerus. I'm also confused on how strong his new Base form is with god power. Would it be the one just as strong as SSG or would it be Super Saiyan?

There's no way his base is as strong as SSG.

I just treat SSB = SSJ [post god power up]. I really hope they clear this though.

[ekrolo2]

It kind of feels a little silly to do the standard power levels anymore lol. The Bog scale feels a lot better now that the PLs have gotten ridiculously high.

[LightBing]

Using the "God Scale":

SSJ3 Goku - 0,20 (20)
Gohan - 0,52 (52)
Mutated Vegeta - 0,75 (75)
SSJG Goku - 6 (600)
Beerus - 10 (1000)
Whis - 15 (1500)
Post-God Goku - Not sure... It should be the same as SSJG Goku, with no noticeable difference between SSJ and base. It was said Goku retained the same level after the time limit passed, while fighting Beerus. Also in Super's last episode both him and Vegeta survived a blast from Beerus. I'm gonna wait for the next episodes to draw a conclusion.

[ekrolo2]

Well, I guess I might as well throw my numbers into the God Scale race.

SSJ3 Goku - 0.001
SSJ3 Gotenks - 0.004
Gohan - 0.005
LAWLRAGETA - 0.5
Super Saiyan God/Demi-God Goku - 6
Hypothetical SSJ3 Vegetto - 7.5
Beerus - 10
Whis - 15

[Noah]

I don't think that SBG Goku/Vegeta have the same power as a SSJG, if I put this in Toriyama scale would be something like:

Saiyan Beyond God: 5
SSJG: 6
SSGSS: 7.5

[ahill1]

Okay, I'll make a list of battle powers based in Daizenshuu and complying Freeza> Saiyans base.

Raditz arc

Roshi 139

Chaozu 150

Yajirobe 160

Yamcha 177

Kuririn 206

Tenshinhan 250

Mr. Popo 300

Kami 330

Piccolo ( Weighted ) 322
~ W/ o Weights 408
~ Makankôsappô 1,330

Son Goku ( Weighted ) 334
~ W/ o Weights 416
~ Kamehameha 924

Son Gohan 1
~ Spaceship Level 710
~ Enranged 1.307

Raditz 1,500

Enma 2,500

Kaio-sama 3,500


Vegeta arc

Chaozu 610

Yajirobe 970

Saibaiman 1,200

Son Gohan 1,307

Yamcha 1,480

Kuririn 1,770

Tenshinhan 1,830

Son Gohan ( Enranged + Masenko ) 2,800

Piccolo 3,500

Nappa 4,000

Son Goku 8,000
~ Kaioken 16,000
~ Kaioken x3 24,000
~ Kaioken x4 32,000

Vegeta 18,000
~ Oozaru less than 180,000


Namek arc

Son Gohan 1,500

Kuririn ( Weighted ) 1,500
~ W/o Weights 1,830

Nameks Warriors ( Suppressed ) 1,000
~ Full Power 3,000

Cui 18,000

Dodoria 22,000

Zarbon 23,000
~ Transformed 30,000

Vegeta 24,000
~ Zenkai 30,000


Ginyu arc part 1

Gurd 9,000

Kuririn 13,000

Son Gohan 14,000

Vegeta 30,000

Recoome 40,000

Butta 40,000

Jheese 40,000

Ginyu 120,000

Son Goku 90,000
~ Kaioken 180,000


Ginyu arc part 2

Ginyu-Goku 23,000

Kuririn 23,000

Son Gohan 26,000

Jheese 40,000

Nail 42,000

Vegeta 52,500


Freeza arc prt 1

Kuririn 75,000

Piccolo ( Weighted ) 125,000
~ W/ o Weights 150,000

Son Gohan 200,000

Vegeta 250,000

Freeza ( 1st Form ) 530,000


Freeza arc part 2

Son Gohan 200,000
~ Enranged 1,000,000

Freeza ( 2nd Form Initial ) 1,060,000
~ Powered Up 1,200,000
~ Full Power 1,500,000

Piccolo ( After Fused W/ Nail Weighted ) 1,250,000
~ W/ o Weights 1,500,000

Son Gohan ( Zenkai ) 400,000
~ Enranged 2,000,000

Freeza ( 3rd Form ) 2,000,000

Vegeta ( Zenkai ) 2,500,000

Freeza ( Final Form Initial ) 3,000,000
~ 50% 60,000,000
~ 70% 84,000,000
~ 100% 120,000,000

Son Goku 3,000,000
~ Kaioken x10 30,000,000
~ Kaioken x20 60,000,000
~ Super Saiyan 150,000,000

Piccolo ( Post Gohan and Kuririn Ki ) 1,975,000


Trunks arc

Chaozu 25,000

Yamcha 60,000

Tenshinhan 75,000

Kuririn 100,000

Son Gohan 400,000

Piccolo 2,800,000

Vegeta 3,000,000

King Cold 100,000,000

Mecha Freeza ( Hypothetical Full Power ) 140,000,000

Future Trunks 3,200,000
~ Super Saiyan 160,000,000

Son Goku 3,600,000
~ Super Saiyan 180,000,000


Androids arc

Yamcha 300,000

Tenshinhan 375,000

Kuririn 500,000

Son Gohan 4,000,000

Android #19 70,000,000
~ Post Absorptions 140,000,000

Android #20 100,000,000
~ Post Absorptions 160,000,000

Piccolo 190,000,000

Future Trunks 4,600,000
~ Super Saiyan 230,000,000

Son Goku 5,000,000
~ Super Saiyan 250,000,000

Vegeta 5,200,000
~ Super Saiyan 260,000,000

Android #18 340,000,000

Android #17 375,000,000


Cell arc

Imperfect Cell ( Ginger Town ) 300,000,000

Piccolo ( After Fused W/ Kami Weighted ) 340,000,000
~ W/ o Weights 380,000,000

Android #17 375,000,000

Imperfect Cell ( Post Humans Absorptions ) 500,000,000

Android #16 500,000,000

Semi Cell ( Initial ) 800,000,000
~ Full Power 900,000,000

Vegeta ( Post Rosat ) 16,000,000
~ Super Saiyan 800,000,000
~ Super Saiyan Grade 2 1,200,000,000

Future Trunks ( Post Rosat ) 15,000,000
~ Super Saiyan 750,000,000
~ Super Saiyan Grade 2 1,125,000,000
~ Super Saiyan Grade 3 1,650,000,000

Perfect Cell ( Warm Up ) 1,400,000,000

Son Goku ( Post Rosat ) 56,000,000
~ Super Saiyan ( 50% ) 1,400,000,000


Cell Games

Android #16 500,000,000

Piccolo 1,600,000,000

Trunks 36,000,000
~ Super Saiyan 1,800,000,000

Vegeta 36,000,000
~ Super Saiyan 1,800,000,000

Cell Jr. 1,800,000,000

Son Goku Super Saiyan ( Warm Up ) 1,400,000,000
~ Super Saiyan ( Full Power ) 2,800,000,000
~ Super Saiyan ( Tired ) 1,200,000,000

Perfect Cell ( Warm Up ) 1,400,000,000
~ Powered Up ( Vs Goku ) 3,100,000,000
~ Real Speed ( Vs Gohan ) 3,500,000,000
~ Full Power 5,600,000,000

Super Perfect Cell 8,350,000,000

Son Gohan 70,000,000
~ Super Saiyan 3,500,000,000
~ Super Saiyan 2 ( Enranged ) 8,750,000,000


Boo Saga

Son Gohan 70,000,000
~ Super Saiyan 3,500,000,000 ( Goha did not weaker according to Daizenshuu, only lost his "rage boost" )

Son Goten 64,000,000
~ Super Saiyan 3,200,000,000

Present Trunks 66,000,000
~ Super Saiyan 3,300,000,000

Vegeta 75,000,000
~ Super Saiyan 3,750,000,000


25th Budokai

Yamcha 300,000

Kuririn 500,000

Android #18 340,000,000

Kamiccolo 1,800,000,000

Son Goten ( Post Training ) 68,000,000
~ Super Saiyan 3,400,000,000

Present Trunks ( Post Training ) 69,000,000
~ Super Saiyan 3,450,000,000

Son Gohan ( Post Training ) 72,000,000
~ Super Saiyan 3,600,000,000
~ Super Saiyan ( 2 ) 7,200,000,000


Babidi arc

Pui Pui 40,000,000

Yakon 96,000,000

East Kaioshin 3,100,000,000

Dabra 7,000,000,000

Son Gohan Super Saiyan ( 2 ) 7,200,000,000

Vegeta 80,000,000
~ Super Saiyan 4,000,000,000
~ Super Saiyan ( 2 ) 8,000,000,000


Fat Boo arc

Majin Vegeta 96,000,000
~ Super Saiyan 4,800,000,000
~ Super Saiyan ( 2 ) 9,600,000,000

Son Goku 96,000,000
~ Super Saiyan 4,800,000,000
~ Super Saiyan ( 2 ) 9,600,000,000

Gohan Super Saiyan 2 ( Hypothetical Enranged ) 9,000,000,000

Fat Boo 16,000,000,000 ( Roughly 2x stronger than Gohan SSJ2, since Gohan's energy restored almost half of his power )

Goku Super Saiyan ( 3 ) 38,400,000,000

Gotenks ( Pre Rosat ) 160,000,000
~ Super Saiyan 8,000,000,000 ( According to Daizenshuu Gotenks did not surpass Vegeta until he trained in the rosat )


Fusion arc

Fat Boo 16,000,000,000

Son Goten ( Post Rosat ) 80,000,000
~ Super Saiyan 4,000,000,000

Present Trunks ( Post Rosat ) 80,000,000
~ Super Saiyan 4,000,000,000

Gotenks ( Post Rosat ) 320,000,000
~ Super Saiyan 16,000,000,000
~ Super Saiyan ( 2 ) 32,000,000,000
~ Super Saiyan ( 3 ) 128,000,000,000

Super Boo 115,000,000,000

Mystic Gohan 150,000,000,000

Bootenks 243,000,000,000

Boohan 265,000,000,000

Vegetto 10,000,000,000
~ Super Saiyan 500,000,000,000

Buff Boo 140,000,000,000

Kid Boo 37,500,000,000

[ZombieVito]

Gap time.

Dabura and Gohan.

Who was stronger? Why? And by how much?

[SSJ2FutureGohan]

Gap time.

Dabura and Gohan.

Who was stronger? Why? And by how much?

Dabra was never able to even touch Gohan aside from sneak attacks, and never dared fighting hand to hand. Gohan is superior, by a noticeable amount. In numbers...

Gohan: 100.00
Dabra: 93.75

[RandomGuy96]

Gap time.

Dabura and Gohan.

Who was stronger? Why? And by how much?

Gohan came out on top of their only hand to hand exchange, and overpowered Dabra in their blade vs hand struggle. So he should be stronger. However, neither of their attacks did (visible) damage to the other, and Dabra was stated to be winning the fight, suggesting they weren't far apart. If Gohan is a 100, Dabra's an 88 or so.

[ahill1]

Gap time.

Dabura and Gohan.

Who was stronger? Why? And by how much?

Gohan came out on top of their only hand to hand exchange, and overpowered Dabra in their blade vs hand struggle. So he should be stronger. However, neither of their attacks did (visible) damage to the other, and Dabra was stated to be winning the fight, suggesting they weren't far apart. If Gohan is a 100, Dabra's an 88 or so.

88/100 is too much of a gap.

[ahill1]

Please show me your numbars for:

Piccolo ( Androids Arc/ Pre Kami )
Future Trunks SSJ ( Androids Arc )
Goku SSJ ( Androids Arc )
Vegeta SSJ ( Androids Arc )
Future #18
Future #17
Imperfect Cell ( Ginger Town )
Imperfect Cell ( Vs Future Trunks )