The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread

[PerfectFreeza]

My bad...
Still, Daizenshuu 7 lists Tenshinhan as an alien descendant.So perhaps he might have more potential, than Kuririn and Yamcha?

[Kamiccolo9]

My bad...
Still, Daizenshuu 7 lists Tenshinhan as an alien descendant.So perhaps he might have more potential, than Kuririn and Yamcha?

It still considers him an Earthling. And Toryama said that Krillin was the strongest Earthling, both with Yamcha's quote in the manga, and in a separate interview.

[TheMightyOzaru]

Salza vs Krllin (end of Z)

The strongest Earthling vs the strongest soldier in Cold's empire.

Krillin owns the crap outta him.

[RandomGuy96]

You have Krillin in the millions by the end of Z? Why?

[TheMightyOzaru]

You have Krillin in the multi millions by the end of Z? Why?

I don't. I don't abide by your Armored squad in the millions, disregard of official numbers, theory. Krillin maxes out at 380,000 IMO and Salza is 170,000.

[RandomGuy96]

Oh well then, I guess Cooler is at 470,000,000.

Question: do you think Captain Ginyu can make someone in the multi-millions struggle to deflect a one handed casual blast? Do you think he can deflect blasts, dodge, and shrug off hits from another person in the multi-millions? Do you think he can even give someone in the multi-millions a paper cut? Do you think he can effortlessly one shot someone in the multi-hundred thousands?

Do you think Krillin can do any of that?

[TheMightyOzaru]

That's a Budokai 3 promotion, they aren't the same. There is a simple explanation for that. I don't know, Piccolo could have been toying with Salza... I mean I know that sounds crazy! But it's certainly possible. You don't see Piccolo putting forth any, and I mean any effort, against Dore and Neizu so they clearly aren't strong.

[RandomGuy96]

That's a Budokai 3 promotion, they aren't the same. There is a simple explanation for that. I don't know, Piccolo could have been toying with Salza... I mean I know that sounds crazy! But it's certainly possible. You don't see Piccolo putting forth any, and I mean any effort, against Dore and Neizu so they clearly aren't strong.

I see him putting towards effort with Salza. If he could just effortlessly one shot all of them, he would. There's no reason he wouldn't. He was saving Gohan; why would he toy with them (which is really out of character BTW) and then send Gohan off alone and unprotected?

And why did he "toy" with Salza when that doesn't fit the circumstances? Why'd he do that when he had just previously killed Neiz and Doore? Why does he even try to split up the squad and take them by surprise at all if they're so weak? Also, Doore, Salza, and Neiz could actually make Goku struggle.

Both numbers (Cooler's 470,000,000 and Salza's 170,000) come from Shonen Jump. Both were stated in articles hyping up the newest Dragon Ball product. Both make no sense. Both are completely incompatible with the number listed right next to them. Why do you hold one in so much higher esteem than the other?

[TheMightyOzaru]

Why? You clearly see that Piccolo likes messing with these guys when he lets Neizu hit him. No, Cooler's level is from a Budokai 3 promotion. Salza's is not. It's also ridiculous to assume these guys even come close to Freeza's first form. You honestly expect me to believe that 3 nobodies are stronger than the strongest being in the known Galaxy? You also have to remember that Toei can wank and downplay anyone at a moments notice. Oh Paikuhan can own Super Perfect Cell yet has trouble with FPSSJ Goku... Makes sense...

[RandomGuy96]

It seemed to be that he was trying to split up the squad. Since he proceeds to only reveal his trick after Salza runs then tries to take him by surprise.

Again, why would he toy with Salza and only Salza? Why would he let himself get cut? Why would he throw blasts that apparently less than 10% of his power at his opponent? Why wouldn't he one-shot the entire squad instead of sending Gohan off alone? And how does their performance against Goku make sense? He clearly wasn't toying with them. Look at his face, he's clearly struggling. Dore caught his kick and got him into a hold that he struggled to break out of and Salza fired a blast that pushed him back and he had trouble deflecting.

Like I said: Both numbers (Cooler's 470,000,000 and Salza's 170,000) come from Shonen Jump. Both were stated in articles hyping up the newest Dragon Ball product. Both make no sense. Both are completely incompatible with the number listed right next to them. Why do you hold one in so much higher esteem than the other?

Yes, because that's the only route that makes any sense. The very premise of this movie throws the "Freeza is the strongest being in the known Galaxy" concept out of the window anyway, and the henchmen actually felt confident that they could beat a guy who at least killed first form Freeza. And they're not nobodies, they're the personal elite of the actual strongest being in the known galaxy. Salza even knows what Freeza's final form looks like by virtue of working for Cooler, and knows Ginyu's original form as well. Who else knows that?

[TheMightyOzaru]

He let some of his shirt go... Such a big loss. No they are not from the same thing. Coolers is from a video game promotion. Even if they are in the same V-Jump, they are in separate categories.

[Draken]

Or how about this; Power levels are bullshit and Toei doesn't give a crap.

[RandomGuy96]

Or how about this; Power levels are bullshit and Toei doesn't give a crap.

That's basically what I'm saying. Whoever made these numbers doesn't give a crap, because they're clearly wrong. Like someone else in Shonen Jump saying that Broly is 1,400,000,000 and Gogeta is 2,500,000,000.

No they are not from the same thing. Coolers is from a video game promotion. Even if they are in the same V-Jump, they are in separate categories.

So a promotion is automatically 100% accurate, regardless of what's shown in the movie, just because it's promoting a different product?

[TheMightyOzaru]

They aren't wrong, you just over analyze things. No reason to assume they are wrong. If Salza hurt Piccolo or Goku, you would be on to something. Yet again you seem to be forgetting that the video game section is separate from the actual power levels.

[RandomGuy96]

The fact that he one-shotted Gohan, who is according to those levels a lot stronger than him, doesn't mean anything?

[TheMightyOzaru]

The fact that he one-shotted Gohan, who is according to those levels a lot stronger than him, doesn't mean anything?

3 well coordinated fighters vs 1 inexperienced Gohan isn't going to end well...

[Draken]

The fact that he one-shotted Gohan, who is according to those levels a lot stronger than him, doesn't mean anything?

3 well coordinated fighters vs 1 inexperienced Gohan isn't going to end well...

But since when has numbers ever prevailed over brute strength when brute strength was >>> every individual in those numbers?

[RandomGuy96]

The fact that he one-shotted Gohan, who is according to those levels a lot stronger than him, doesn't mean anything?

3 well coordinated fighters vs 1 inexperienced Gohan isn't going to end well...

Except that's not what happened. Gohan charges at Salza alone and Salza just backhands him.

And again, how are they different at all? They're both from Shonen Jump and they're both power levels created to hype up the newest product. You've trusted all the other numbers from V-Jump (like Vegeta's 250,000), why not this one? It doesn't even require as much stretching as Salza's 170,000 to work.

[Kaboom]

1st time Gohan fought the Armored Squad: They get the jump on him and go straight for his tail.
2nd time Gohan fought the Armored Squad: He takes hits while trying to protect the bag of Senzu.
3rd time Gohan fought Sauzer: He's still weakened and damaged from the last fight, not having eaten a Senzu himself.

Given the above, a trio of powers at almost 200,000 could certainly have a shot at someone between 200 to 300 thousand, especially when the target is inexperienced li'l fail-in-the-clutch Gohan.

[RandomGuy96]

1st time Gohan fought the Armored Squad: They get the jump on him and go straight for his tail.
2nd time Gohan fought the Armored Squad: He takes hits while trying to protect the bag of Senzu.
3rd time Gohan fought Sauzer: He's still weakened and damaged from the last fight, not having eaten a Senzu himself.

Given the above, a trio of powers at almost 200,000 could certainly have a shot at someone between 200 to 300 thousand, especially when the target is inexperienced li'l fail-in-the-clutch Gohan.

The first time: that wasn't really a fight, so okay.

The second time: he has one free arm, two free legs, and is a lot faster than all of them. Yet he just lets himself be beaten up? He doesn't even try to use his massively superior power to break out of Dore's grip when his skull is being crushed?

The third time: no, he wasn't. He took maybe three hits there from people a lot weaker than him. There's no way he should've sustained that much damage, if any at all. Yet you're saying that brought his power to less than half? Salza took more hits than Gohan, and from someone STRONGER than him, not weaker than him. Shouldn't he be more damaged than Gohan here? It doesn't make any sense.

And I still don't see why Cooler's 470,000,000 (which makes way more sense than it should, going by the statements in that movie...) and Broly's 1,400,000,000 (which CAN work on a conservative list that only makes him like Initial Perfect Cell level) aren't accepted when other similarly absurd numbers from the exact same magazine are. Sometimes, just because it's official, that doesn't mean it makes sense.