GT had a good conclusion for Goku

[MasenkoHA]

as well as GT not being from the original author.

The same fans who probably enjoyed at least some of the movies and at least some of the anime exclusive plots

I'm mainly talking about Japanese fans from back in the 90's during the show's original run. I don't know what they liked or didn't, I'm just speculating with what little information we have.

I could be wrong but I’m pretty sure Kei or someone had info showing GT sold the best on home video in Japan (presumably because it didn’t have a manga equivalent)

Also its ratings weren’t bad just less good than the franchise best days

[ABED]

I don't see how it was too late just because there was a bad batch of episodes.

You only get one chance to make a first impression. I think what also played into GT's downfall was fans being burned out from the franchise during that period, as well as GT not being from the original author.

For the people that didn't stick with it, but if you do stay with it, which A LOT of people did then a few bad episodes at the beginning isn't too late. You act like it wasn't successful.

[Matches Malone]

You act like it wasn't successful.

I find it hard to believe they'd stop at 65 episodes if it was doing really well. I don't think it was an outright failure, but it was nowhere near as successful as the 2 shows before it. I don't know if the shorter episode count was a result of this lack of massive success, as the writers said they planned the ending from the start, so maybe it was planned to be shorter all along.

[MasenkoHA]

It’s 65 episodes preceding 444 episodes. It doesn’t exist in isolation.

[ABED]

That plus DB was already well into a downswing. It was on the air nearly every single week for a decade. Exhaustion has to set in at some point.

[LoganForkHands73]

I was thinking about the argument that GT doesn't have a tonally fitting ending for DB. I agree that it does lean too hard on the sap and sentimentality, but looking back at the original manga, Toriyama has tried his hand at poignancy too. Both of Vegeta's deaths, Piccolo Jr's first death, the lead-up to Goku's sacrifice against Cell, the Genki Dama against Kid Buu, the latter of which GT directly cribs from. So I don't think GT's ending is that egregious. Plus, GT is a sequel to the Z anime more than the manga, which was itself tended to be more melodramatic than Toriyama's first hand work.

[Matches Malone]

I was thinking about the argument that GT doesn't have a tonally fitting ending for DB. I agree that it does lean too hard on the sap and sentimentality, but looking back at the original manga, Toriyama has tried his hand at poignancy too. Both of Vegeta's deaths, Piccolo Jr's first death, the lead-up to Goku's sacrifice against Cell, the Genki Dama against Kid Buu, the latter of which GT directly cribs from. So I don't think GT's ending is that egregious. Plus, GT is a sequel to the Z anime more than the manga, which was itself tended to be more melodramatic than Toriyama's first hand work.

I think whatever shortcomings the ending may have is more than made up for in providing a clear definitive conclusion to the dragon ball story. It's something Toriyama didn't provide in the original manga, and something modern DB will never do.

[LoganForkHands73]

I was thinking about the argument that GT doesn't have a tonally fitting ending for DB. I agree that it does lean too hard on the sap and sentimentality, but looking back at the original manga, Toriyama has tried his hand at poignancy too. Both of Vegeta's deaths, Piccolo Jr's first death, the lead-up to Goku's sacrifice against Cell, the Genki Dama against Kid Buu, the latter of which GT directly cribs from. So I don't think GT's ending is that egregious. Plus, GT is a sequel to the Z anime more than the manga, which was itself tended to be more melodramatic than Toriyama's first hand work.

I think whatever shortcomings the ending may have is more than made up for in providing a clear definitive conclusion to the dragon ball story. It's something Toriyama didn't provide in the original manga, and something modern DB will never do.

True, and I think it's okay to prefer it even if you think it's not something Toriyama would've done. I know I do.

[Skar]

I think whatever shortcomings the ending may have is more than made up for in providing a clear definitive conclusion to the dragon ball story. It's something Toriyama didn't provide in the original manga, and something modern DB will never do.

Does modern DB need an ending if it's only meant to be a midquel? I don't think it needs a definitive ending like GT and it could just be a conclusion like the Buu saga with a timeskip to EoZ.