Official On-Going DBZ 2015 Movie Thread: "Resurrection 'F'"

[TheDevilsCorpse]

Speaking about the time period of BoG, Goku is 41 at that time right (well, 41 but his body is that of a 33 year old since bodies don't age in the afterlife; not counting the whole Saiyans retain their youth longer line from Vegeta)? Cuz I was thinking about this and Beerus didn't know Freeza blew up Planet Vegeta until Whis told him he did it while he was eating in the movie at the start. That means that if he slept for 39 years, he did it 2 years after Goku was sent from Planet Vegeta if he's 41 in the movie.

Goku was sent to Earth when he was 3. Planet Vegeta was destroyed one month later.

Yes. Battle of Gods was written to tie together with Jaco, which was going to be released alongside the film (if it wasn't for Toriyama's health from working on the manga). Goku was sent to Earth in AGE 739, almost 3 years after his birth (I'm assuming something like January of AGE 737, so a full 737, then 738 and most of 739). He is choosing to ignore previously accepted material like the Bardock TV Special.

[Cetra]

The only really believable power up for Freezer is his men doing research and forcing his cells to mutate more. Freezer is a mutant.

[Tennessaiyan]

Wait, everyone's getting worked up over the fact that Freeza says he'll be able to defeat Goku after four months of training? We haven't actually seen him do this yet, though.

http://fc05.deviantart.net/fs71/f/2014/ ... 89085a.png

Vegeta will probably step in after this and take him down.

That would be just so predictable though...

I mean, I would LOVE to see that happen, but I seriously doubt that Vegeta alone will be the one to take Frieza down (if Frieza actually dies in the movie.) I think that how the movie ends will come completely out of left field. You know, 'cause that's Toryiama for you.

[Cold Skin]

First, I don't understand the months announced for this Jump preview manga: it says April, May and June. But by that time, the movie will have been released already in April.
So it kind of spoils the value of this preview manga supposed to give us a taste BEFORE anyone could even see the movie and tell about its story.

Second, is it clearly stated when Freezer was brought back? Because it's after Majin Boo (since they mentionned Goku defeating him) but it might be not too long after Majin Boo, with Freezer announcing he will train and actually training for whole years before the movie events, before even Battle of Gods (which would be ironic given that Beerus and Whis would talk about his demise unaware that he's very much alive, hidden in a corner of the universe and training hard, catching up with all the training Saiyans went through for years too).

[Doctor.]

Have we established exactly what this is yet?

[Rozay]

I didn't mean to say plothole, I meant to say asspull, sorry. Even so, even if he doesn't know Beerus and Whis' powers, and stops training when he thinks he has reached a new level. How can you not say him probably, for all we know now (and I can't stress that part enough when discussing this, as I do recognize we don't know the whole plot yet) reach God Ki with only four months of regular training is not too ridiculous, even if he is a prodigy? He seemed on the trailer to be on par with Goku, who has God Ki now. I mean, at least that's my guess. I think God Ki is such a shitty concept for DBZ, by the way, especially introduced this late when we had so many other "gods" along the way. But this would even devalue how meaningful God Ki was made to be in the last movie, if he can reach it that easily.

If he reaches God Ki after just four months of regular training, with no other special reasons, it would be one of the biggest asspulls in DBZ history. I seriously hope there's more to it.

[Darkprince410]

That tends to imply something other than a transformation though, especially since it was changed from "transformation" to "evolution" in the newer versions of that dialogue. It was originally released as "Allow me to show you my further transformation", but then more recent releases of that line changed it to evolution, which implies that it's just further advancement of his existing form rather than busting out a brand new transformation. Why would the dialogue be changed otherwise?

I don't know. But taking Digimon as an example... "Evolution" indeed means another form.

You can't really use one franchise's example to explain another's, because the two aren't connected in any real way. Given that the dialogue was changed specifically from transformation to evolution, it seems rather unlikely that it'll be a new transformation. Obviously, we'll need to wait and see, but just given that change in dialogue, I'm more inclined to believe it's just an advancement of his existing strength rather than a new form.

So dead people get to keep their bodies now? I was under the impression that was only anime filler. This now raises the question; why didn't Vegeta get to retain his body, but Freeza somehow can?

We know very little about the actual workings of Dragon Ball's Hell, so we don't know if it's legitimately inconsistent or not. Since those that have proven themselves good in life and worthy of it are allowed to retain their bodies in Heaven, it's possible that those that have proven to be evil enough in life are forced to keep their bodies in Hell for torture and punishment. When Piccolo told Vegeta that he wouldn't be keeping his body in the afterlife, Vegeta had spent several years on Earth, raising a family and sort of settling in. Piccolo probably knew that would muddy Enma's judgment enough that he'd just be stripped of his body to await cleansing and reincarnation in the afterlife. Freeza though had slaughtered millions (if not billions) and subjugated and conquered even more. He likely had no good deeds on his record when he went to get judged by Enma, and I could see Enma having a special place in Hell for the truly evil (similar to the levels of Hell system described in Dante's "Divine Comedy").

[TheDevilsCorpse]

Still super excited, but having slight issues with Freeza having a body in Hell and being resurrected as Mecha Freeza chunks. So I'm hoping this is stuff just from the manga (though I'm pretty sure it won't be).

Unless we're given a good explanation, Freeza, like all bad guys, should be a cloud spirit. Also, since he should be a cloud, I don't understand what his body has to do with anything. Shenlong seems capable of resurrecting people in a better state than Mecha Freeza chunks. Bora didn't have his wounds, all the people Vegeta killed at the 25th Tenka'ichi Budokai were resurrected into their normal bodies automatically. So why is Freeza's revival working this way with Shenlong? Does he realize Freeza is evil and he's just being a dick...?

[Dyno]

Yes. Battle of Gods was written to tie together with Jaco, which was going to be released alongside the film (if it wasn't for Toriyama's health from working on the manga). Goku was sent to Earth in AGE 739, almost 3 years after his birth (I'm assuming something like January of AGE 737, so a full 737, then 738 and most of 739). He is choosing to ignore previously accepted material like the Bardock TV Special.

736 + 739 + 10 = 749, this makes Kakarot being 13, rather than 12 as he stated. But, as we already discussed, this can easily be explained. Yet... Should we consider Kakarot took one year to arrive on Earth? Which would make him 4 years when Son Gohan found him (which coincidentally is the same age as the first appearance of Son Gohan, cool, isn't? ).

778 - 39 = 739, this makes Bills had gone to sleep in the same year, it can be explained that he went to sleep during a gap of days, weeks or months before the destruction. Something Wiss should have noted when Bills asked him what happened to planet Vegeta, I think.

[Avenged]

Still super excited, but having slight issues with Freeza having a body in Hell and being resurrected as Mecha Freeza chunks. So I'm hoping this is stuff just from the manga (though I'm pretty sure it won't be).

Unless we're given a good explanation, Freeza, like all bad guys, should be a cloud spirit. Also, since he should be a cloud, I don't understand what his body has to do with anything. Shenlong seems capable of resurrecting people in a better state than Mecha Freeza chunks. Bora didn't have his wounds, all the people Vegeta killed at the 25th Tenka'ichi Budokai were resurrected into their normal bodies automatically. So why is Freeza's revival working this way with Shenlong? Does he realize Freeza is evil and he's just being a dick...?

Well by reading this manga it states that Shenron didn't revive Freeza, only brought his body back to the living world. Freeza's henchmen then revived him with some sort of machine.

[Low Tone G]

Still super excited, but having slight issues with Freeza having a body in Hell and being resurrected as Mecha Freeza chunks. So I'm hoping this is stuff just from the manga (though I'm pretty sure it won't be).

Unless we're given a good explanation, Freeza, like all bad guys, should be a cloud spirit. Also, since he should be a cloud, I don't understand what his body has to do with anything. Shenlong seems capable of resurrecting people in a better state than Mecha Freeza chunks. Bora didn't have his wounds, all the people Vegeta killed at the 25th Tenka'ichi Budokai were resurrected into their normal bodies automatically. So why is Freeza's revival working this way with Shenlong? Does he realize Freeza is evil and he's just being a dick...?

Well by reading this manga it states that Shenron didn't revive Freeza, only brought his body back to the living world. Freeza's henchmen then revived him with some sort of machine.

Is that possible?

[TheDevilsCorpse]

736 + 739 + 10 = 749, this makes Kakarot being 13, rather than 12 as he stated. But, as we already discussed, this can easily be explained. Yet... Should we consider Kakarot took one year to arrive on Earth? Which would make him 4 years when Son Gohan found him (which coincidentally is the same age as the first appearance of Son Gohan, cool, isn't? ).

If you had read what I'd written, you'd see that hmi being born in 737 still works. Which means he is still be twelve. I don't think it took any significant amount of time for him to get to Earth. I actually think he arrived before Freeza blew it up, as Jaco didn't mention anything about the Saiyan's homeworld being destroyed while explaining about them to Omori and Tights. So he's still 2 and some change and works out just fine for his proper age during the series.

Well by reading this manga it states that Shenron didn't revive Freeza, only brought his body back to the living world. Freeza's henchmen then revived him with some sort of machine.

I'd still question why Shenlong would revive his body in shambles like that. Shenlong restored the people Vegeta blasted to smithereens at the 25th Budokai to their normal bodies when the wish was made, and Freeza does appear to have his "body" in hell since he obviously isn't a spirit. Said "body" even disappears when they wish to revive his body, but if the soul couldn't return without his body in one piece...what's up with the whole thing? (And how did Sorbet have Freeza's body reclaim his soul? Is that automatic after putting the Freeza puzzle back together?)

I dunno, it just doesn't feel like how Shenlong operated until Battle of Gods, when he made Pilaf and the gang too young. I originally felt like it was probably Pilaf's fault for the way he worded things, but now I'm starting to wonder if Shenlong isn't being a dick on purpose for being disturbed from his slumber so often. xD

Though this does seem to make things funnier that apparently technology has advanced enough in Freeza's absence that they can restore his normal body now when they could only turn him into a cyborg before.

[Lord Beerus]

Still super excited, but having slight issues with Freeza having a body in Hell and being resurrected as Mecha Freeza chunks. So I'm hoping this is stuff just from the manga (though I'm pretty sure it won't be).

Unless we're given a good explanation, Freeza, like all bad guys, should be a cloud spirit. Also, since he should be a cloud, I don't understand what his body has to do with anything. Shenlong seems capable of resurrecting people in a better state than Mecha Freeza chunks. Bora didn't have his wounds, all the people Vegeta killed at the 25th Tenka'ichi Budokai were resurrected into their normal bodies automatically. So why is Freeza's revival working this way with Shenlong? Does he realize Freeza is evil and he's just being a dick...?

Well by reading this manga it states that Shenron didn't revive Freeza, only brought his body back to the living world. Freeza's henchmen then revived him with some sort of machine.

Is that possible?

Anything is possible in Dragon Ball. This should be known by now.

[Low Tone G]

Of course it's known... But it doesn't make sense. If it's enough to have a body because that same soul can be produced like which is stuck in Hell, why would Sorbet and Tagoma need Shenlon's power to reconstruct Freeza's body, when it's more simple to create a clone of it?

[danielsan_190196]

Toriyama's probably working under the same logic of "gotta keep everyone young enough so they still look like they did in the Majin Buu arc!"

I don't know what's stopping him from just having Blooma and Chi-Chi wish to be young again after the twenty-eighth Tenka'ichi Budoukai arc.

Blooma?

[Doctor.]

Of course it's known... But it doesn't make sense. If it's enough to have a body because that same soul can be produced like which is stuck in Hell, why would Sorbet and Tagoma need Shenlon's power to reconstruct Freeza's body, when it's more simple to create a clone of it?

How could they have Freeza's DNA without the body

[Low Tone G]

Of course it's known... But it doesn't make sense. If it's enough to have a body because that same soul can be produced like which is stuck in Hell, why would Sorbet and Tagoma need Shenlon's power to reconstruct Freeza's body, when it's more simple to create a clone of it?

How could they have Freeza's DNA without the body

Just like Dr. Gero had it!

[Dyno]

If you had read what I'd written, you'd see that hmi being born in 737 still works. Which means he is still be twelve. I don't think it took any significant amount of time for him to get to Earth. I actually think he arrived before Freeza blew it up, as Jaco didn't mention anything about the Saiyan's homeworld being destroyed while explaining about them to Omori and Tights. So he's still 2 and some change and works out just fine for his proper age during the series.

For the time being, it is better to take word-by-word. If Gine said it has been three years, it has been exactly three years. Of course we can assume like that and I agree that must be that way, but I need to know first if Movie 15 actually takes place after those three years spoken by Wiss.
Hum... When planet Vegeta was destroyed, Jaco was already on Earth (losing contact with the HQ) or still on Space (but didn't have any method to get contact with the others, which I think it is most unlikely), that is why he didn't mention it.

[Dayspring]

Anybody else starting to think that Freeza is also a god like Boo, Beerus, Kaio and Kaioshin, just one of the weaker ones? It explains how Beerus, Kaio and Kaioshin knew who he was, as well as explains why the strongest mutant in the Universe is Ginyu, despite being 4.5x weaker than Freeza's weakest form.

Maybe Freeza's race is to Beerus as the Kaios are to the Kaioshin?

[RandomGuy96]

So Freeza gets to keep his body in Hell. He then surpass God level with four months of training. He always knew he could do this. Even though it was heavily implied that he'd trained already, he didn't do any notable training after getting Mecha'd, and he has been retconned into always knowing about guys way stronger than him.

I didn't think my expectations for this could get any lower, but there you go. Good thing it's just a movie.

Anybody else starting to think that Freeza is also a god like Boo, Beerus, Kaio and Kaioshin, just one of the weaker ones? It explains how Beerus, Kaio and Kaioshin knew who he was, as well as explains why the strongest mutant in the Universe is Ginyu, despite being 4.5x weaker than Freeza's weakest form.

Maybe Freeza's race is to Beerus as the Kaios are to the Kaioshin?

The Kaios and Kaioshin are of the same species. Beerus and Freeza clearly are not.