GohanKid Buu wrote:Manga Future Gohan Vs. Mecha Freeza
The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread
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The Monkey King
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Re: The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread
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TheMightyOzaru
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Re: The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread
Gohan.Kid Buu wrote:Manga Future Gohan Vs. Mecha Freeza
King Vegeta vs Daiz.
Vegeta: "Funny... I seem to recall Kakarot being fed the same information right before he transformed; the distinct look on your faces when he went Super Saiyan didn't exactly inspire confidence. One does not predict or calculate power like ours."
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RandomGuy96
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Re: The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread
Normal Freeza wins. Mecha Freeza wins easier.Kid Buu wrote:Manga Future Gohan Vs. Mecha Freeza
The Monkey King wrote:It was actually Beerus disguised as Zarbon #StayWokeRandomGuy96 wrote:He's probably referring to the Bardock special. Zarbon was the one who first recommended destroying Planet Vegeta because the saiyans were rapidly growing in strength.dbgtFO wrote: Please elaborate as I do not know what you mean by "pushing Vegeta's destruction"
Herms wrote:The fact that the ridiculous power inflation is presented so earnestly makes me just roll my eyes and snicker. Like with Freeza, where he starts off over 10 times stronger than all his henchmen except Ginyu (because...well, just because), then we find out he can transform and get even more powerful, and then he reveals he can transform two more times, before finally coming out with the fact that he hasn't even been using anywhere near 50% of his power. Oh, and he can survive in the vacuum of space. All this stuff is just presented as the way Freeza is, without even an attempt at rationalizing it, yet the tone dictates we're supposed to take all this silly grasping at straws as thrilling danger. So I guess I don't really take the power inflation in the Boo arc seriously, but I don't take the power inflation in earlier arcs seriously either, so there's no net loss of seriousness. I think a silly story presented as serious is harder to accept than a silly story presented as silly.
Re: The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread
Any reasoning for your guys verdict?
Rocketman wrote:"Shonen" basically means "stupid sentimental shit" anyway, so it's ok to be anti-shonen.
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DBZGTKOSDH
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Re: The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread
Super Vegetto (and Gotenks for Goten/Trunks) counts as Goku in Daizenshuu 2 (Gogeta isn't there because that's a manga-based guidebook), and both Gogeta (SS & SS4) and Vegetto (base & SS) count as Goku in the Dragon Book of DBox GT.TheMightyOzaru wrote:I don't recall Guide books ever claiming Gogeta is a form of Goku.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
Re: The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread
Vegetto counts as "the result of Goku merging with Vegeta".DBZGTKOSDH wrote:Super Vegetto (and Gotenks for Goten/Trunks) counts as Goku in Daizenshuu 2
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TheMightyOzaru
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Re: The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread
Neither of these say they are forms of Goku. Like hleV said, Gogeta and Vegetto are the result of Goku and Vegeta fusing.
That's just how it scaled for me. I have SSJ Mirai Gohan at 170,000,000.Kid Buu wrote:Any reasoning for your guys verdict?
Vegeta: "Funny... I seem to recall Kakarot being fed the same information right before he transformed; the distinct look on your faces when he went Super Saiyan didn't exactly inspire confidence. One does not predict or calculate power like ours."
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DBZGTKOSDH
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Re: The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread
It's still a form of Goku. Not saying that God Goku > Gogeta & Vegetto is a fact, but it's a valid interpretation of the "God Goku is the strongest form of Goku" statement, since Vegetto & Gogeta can be counted as forms of Goku, since Goku & Vegeta merge and transform into Vegetto/Gogeta.hleV wrote:Vegetto counts as "the result of Goku merging with Vegeta".DBZGTKOSDH wrote:Super Vegetto (and Gotenks for Goten/Trunks) counts as Goku in Daizenshuu 2
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
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TheMightyOzaru
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Re: The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread
But they don't transform into Vegetto, the fuse into Vegetto.
Vegeta: "Funny... I seem to recall Kakarot being fed the same information right before he transformed; the distinct look on your faces when he went Super Saiyan didn't exactly inspire confidence. One does not predict or calculate power like ours."
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TheGmGoken
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Re: The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread
A fusion is not a form. A transformation is a form. A fusion is a result of a mixture so to speak. A mix of two beings with great power. The fusion can transform into their own forms. But is not a form of the two beings. Goku can't turn into Vegetto nor Gogeta at will and neither can Vegeta.DBZGTKOSDH wrote:It's still a form of Goku. Not saying that God Goku > Gogeta & Vegetto is a fact, but it's a valid interpretation of the "God Goku is the strongest form of Goku" statement, since Vegetto & Gogeta can be counted as forms of Goku, since Goku & Vegeta merge and transform into Vegetto/Gogeta.hleV wrote:Vegetto counts as "the result of Goku merging with Vegeta".DBZGTKOSDH wrote:Super Vegetto (and Gotenks for Goten/Trunks) counts as Goku in Daizenshuu 2
Re: The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread
It's not.DBZGTKOSDH wrote: It's still a form of Goku.
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DBZGTKOSDH
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Re: The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread
Different interpretations then.hleV wrote:It's not.DBZGTKOSDH wrote: It's still a form of Goku.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
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TheGmGoken
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Re: The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread
How did you interpret that it was a form of Goku?DBZGTKOSDH wrote:Different interpretations then.hleV wrote:It's not.DBZGTKOSDH wrote: It's still a form of Goku.
SUPER VEGETTO
First Appears: Vol. 42+
The Super Saiyan version of "Vegetto", the result of Goku merging with Vegeta through the potara in order to oppose Majin Buu, who had absorbed many warriors. His power is greater than Super Saiyan 3.
Vol. 42 / Chp. 503
Goku made Vegeta use the potara against his will.
Vol. 42 / Chp. 503
Vegetto immediately after the merge. He soon became Super Vegetto.
Last edited by TheGmGoken on Sun Nov 03, 2013 1:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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DBZGTKOSDH
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Re: The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread
Goku & Vegeta mix & take the form of Vegetto/Gogeta. They use a combined transformation. That's how I see it.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
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TheGmGoken
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Re: The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread
But that's not a transformation. It's a fusion. Also Vegetto is under Goku NOT Vegeta. Does that mean Vegetto is not a form of Vegeta? But only a form for Goku?DBZGTKOSDH wrote:Goku & Vegeta mix & take the form of Vegetto/Gogeta. They use a combined transformation. That's how I see it.
Re: The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread
So it's not a form of Goku? It's a form of Goku & Vegeta's combination?
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TheGmGoken
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Re: The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread
According to Daizenshuu(he link he posted) It's a "Form" of Goku not Vegeta.hleV wrote:So it's not a form of Goku? It's a form of Goku & Vegeta's combination?
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DBZGTKOSDH
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Re: The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread
Goku disagrees.TheGmGoken wrote:But that's not a transformation. It's a fusion.DBZGTKOSDH wrote:Goku & Vegeta mix & take the form of Vegetto/Gogeta. They use a combined transformation. That's how I see it.
Fusion [#BO2#FUS]
Chapter: 469 (DBZ 275), P6.1-7
Context: after Goku laments that Gohan and Vegeta are dead
Goku: “I coulda used Fusion…”
Dende: “Fusion…! Merging together, right? That’s the specialty art of the people of Planet Metamor!”
Goku: “So you know about it, Dende…! That’s right, some people from Metamor who I met in the afterlife taught me that art…It’s a merging technique which can only be performed if two people are fairly close in both power and body size…In other words, by having two people merge into one, they’re able to become a single, new human with amazing power which either of them on their own absolutely wouldn’t be capable of. It really is incredible! Those two from Metamor were completely weak and gentle on their own, but by using Fusion they transformed into a substantial warrior! [ ] …I was just taught the art, but I ain’t never tested it out…There wasn’t anybody on par with me in the afterlife…”
It's a form of both Goku & Vegeta of course. I didn't mention him because we are talking about Goku now. Daizenshuu probably forgot to mention Vegetto under Vegeta.TheGmGoken wrote:Also Vegetto is under Goku NOT Vegeta. Does that mean Vegetto is not a form of Vegeta? But only a form for Goku?
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
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TheGmGoken
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Re: The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread
DBZGTKOSDH wrote:Goku disagrees.TheGmGoken wrote:But that's not a transformation. It's a fusion.DBZGTKOSDH wrote:Goku & Vegeta mix & take the form of Vegetto/Gogeta. They use a combined transformation. That's how I see it.
Spoiler:It's a form of both Goku & Vegeta of course. I didn't mention him because we are talking about Goku now. Daizenshuu probably forgot to mention Vegetto under Vegeta.TheGmGoken wrote:Also Vegetto is under Goku NOT Vegeta. Does that mean Vegetto is not a form of Vegeta? But only a form for Goku?
I'm talking about Vegetto not Gogeta. Vegetto is potara not fusion dance. Vegeta doesn't have Vegetto underhim so I guess it's not a form for Vegeta then. Seeing as BOTH Goten and Trunks have Gotenks.
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DBZGTKOSDH
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Re: The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread
And the difference is...? Even though they look different and have different power, it's the same thing.TheGmGoken wrote:I'm talking about Vegetto not Gogeta. Vegetto is potara not fusion dance.
Are you serious now?TheGmGoken wrote:Vegeta doesn't have Vegetto underhim so I guess it's not a form for Vegeta then.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.