Kai Episode 80 (7th November 2010)

[Deity]

Super Vegeta's most powerful kick to Cell's vital spot didn't do anything, so why should Kuririn's kienzan decapitate him ? Wouldn't it be the ultimate tecnique if it could slice through anyone, no matter how much stronger the foe was ?

It actually is unless your opponent is able to regenerate, which was supposed to be a surprise for Vegeta(after thinking he beat Cell with his Final Flash). That is why Kuririn didn't use it in the manga, it was PIS. Just think about how easy it would have been to defeat every opponent who can't use regeneration. Kuririn could have killed all the androids, if they weren't fast enough to evade it, but since the plot requires that humans are close to useless, when it comes to defeating new villains, their best techniques were only used, when the power difference was so big, that it was unable to defeat the main villain anyway.
Tenshinhan's fully powered Shin Kikoho was able to render second form Cell unable to move, so why didn't Ten use this attack on the androids when Trunks attacked #18?

Yeah sure it is, in a normal situation. Heck, Freeza was defeated by his own "kienzan" so it is super effective.
All I'm saying is that the difference of power should come to the equation, at least for me it does. Remember when Vegeta saw Dende's healing power and asked Kuririn to render him half dead, Kuririn said he didn't have the power to do it and Vegeta said he would lower his ki/energy/battle power whatever he said low enough so that Kuririn's ki blast would pierce him. So why would the reverse wouldn't work ? Meaning someone being so powerful that his ki/energy/battle power doesn't let a kienzan from a weakling like Kuririn cut him ?
(I hate to bring GT to the equation but Buu is the ultimate regenerator, so...) I haven't seen GT in a while so I don't quite remember, but the last enemy the 1-star Dragon didn't have regeneration abilities as far as I can remember, and I find it very hard to believe that Kuririn's kienzan could do anything to him.

And the argument that "everytime we have seen it being used, it worked" is kind of....weak to say the least.

[T Pac]

That's not really proof at all. Cell was many, many times stronger than Freeza -- and that was the point of seeing the Kienzan fail. I personally also liked it because it did show that the Kienzan was not some sort of ultimate attack, which would be pretty dumb (especially considering how rarely it was used).

[dbgtFO]

That's not really proof at all. Cell was many, many times stronger than Freeza -- and that was the point of seeing the Kienzan fail. I personally also liked it because it did show that the Kienzan was not some sort of ultimate attack, which would be pretty dumb (especially considering how rarely it was used).

And Super Buu(Gotenks and Piccolo absorbed) was(if we follow SEG's multipliers) more than 800 times stronger than base Goku and yet a kienzan from the same Goku was able to cut him in half. Unless Krillin is more than 800 times weaker than initial Perfect Cell, then it should have the same effect IMO.
And as I already stated previously the earthling characters didn't get to do anything, as the story now revolved around the saiyans and their quest for achieving new ultra transformations.

[Deity]

As you said it, a Kienzan from Goku...

[rereboy]

That's not really proof at all. Cell was many, many times stronger than Freeza -- and that was the point of seeing the Kienzan fail. I personally also liked it because it did show that the Kienzan was not some sort of ultimate attack, which would be pretty dumb (especially considering how rarely it was used).

And Super Buu(Gotenks and Piccolo absorbed) was(if we follow SEG's multipliers) more than 800 times stronger than base Goku and yet a kienzan from the same Goku was able to cut him in half. Unless Krillin is more than 800 times weaker than initial Perfect Cell, then it should have the same effect IMO.
And as I already stated previously the earthling characters didn't get to do anything, as the story now revolved around the saiyans and their quest for achieving new ultra transformations.

Buu doesn`t exactly have a normal body. Its not that solid. Its heavily dependent on its regeneration and shapeshifting. Piercing or slicing his body didn`t seem that hard to do. So, a kienzan shouldn`t have much trouble. What was really hard was to obliterate him completely.

[dbgtFO]

That's not really proof at all. Cell was many, many times stronger than Freeza -- and that was the point of seeing the Kienzan fail. I personally also liked it because it did show that the Kienzan was not some sort of ultimate attack, which would be pretty dumb (especially considering how rarely it was used).

And Super Buu(Gotenks and Piccolo absorbed) was(if we follow SEG's multipliers) more than 800 times stronger than base Goku and yet a kienzan from the same Goku was able to cut him in half. Unless Krillin is more than 800 times weaker than initial Perfect Cell, then it should have the same effect IMO.
And as I already stated previously the earthling characters didn't get to do anything, as the story now revolved around the saiyans and their quest for achieving new ultra transformations.

Buu doesn`t exactly have a normal body. Its not that solid. Its heavily dependent on its regeneration and shapeshifting. Piercing or slicing his body didn`t seem that hard to do. So, a kienzan shouldn`t have much trouble. What was really hard was to obliterate him completely.

I knew this would be brought up, but we actually don't see anyone around Goku's base level being able to easily rip Buu's body apart, the biggest difference is probably when Dabra throws a spear through him... oh wait a minute I completely forgot about mere bullets actually being able to penetrate him! So yeah the buu example can't be used.DAMMITT!!!

[Son Wukong]

Surprised nobody has commented on Wakamoto's voice acting yet. Not that I was planning to.
I'd rather wait untill the Cell Games before I decide whether his voice acitng is better, worse or the same as before in DBZ.

[dan2026]

Surprised nobody has commented on Wakamoto's voice acting yet.

What is there to say?
It sounds the same as it ever did. (IE Awesome)

cause the only instance we see it being used supposed "killed" Cell, if wasn't for its regeneration.

The less said about Cell's plot hole regeneration the better.

[Son Wukong]

Surprised nobody has commented on Wakamoto's voice acting yet.

It sounds the same as it ever did.

I'm not sure about that. But like I said, I'm not going to say anything concrete about his voice acting untill Cell Games.

[Kendamu]

This episode felt a bit useless. It was 90% Triangle Crap and it's pretty much going for the same point to get across as next week's episode.

I knew that a little filler here and there was left in with Kai, but that was kinda ridiculous.

Kienzan should've been left out.

[crabshank1]

Surprised nobody has commented on Wakamoto's voice acting yet. Not that I was planning to.
I'd rather wait untill the Cell Games before I decide whether his voice acitng is better, worse or the same as before in DBZ.

His voice did change, he's speaking more like Semi-Perfect Cell by rolling his 'r's and his voice went a bit deeper and more grovelly. Compare it to Z if you don't believe me.

[Son Wukong]

Surprised nobody has commented on Wakamoto's voice acting yet. Not that I was planning to.
I'd rather wait untill the Cell Games before I decide whether his voice acitng is better, worse or the same as before in DBZ.

His voice did change, he's speaking more like Semi-Perfect Cell by rolling his 'r's and his voice went a bit deeper and more grovelly. Compare it to Z if you don't believe me.

I don't know what you mean by ''Semi-Perfect Cell" (his 2nd form I guess) but you're right about his ''r'' rolling. He still has this clammy sound to his voice that was present during his first en second form which I hoped would dissappear once he became perfect.
At the moment I just want to wait untill the Cell Games when we can hear him exert his full dynamic range.

[ThunderPX]

That's not really proof at all. Cell was many, many times stronger than Freeza -- and that was the point of seeing the Kienzan fail. I personally also liked it because it did show that the Kienzan was not some sort of ultimate attack, which would be pretty dumb (especially considering how rarely it was used).

And Super Buu(Gotenks and Piccolo absorbed) was(if we follow SEG's multipliers) more than 800 times stronger than base Goku and yet a kienzan from the same Goku was able to cut him in half. Unless Krillin is more than 800 times weaker than initial Perfect Cell, then it should have the same effect IMO.
And as I already stated previously the earthling characters didn't get to do anything, as the story now revolved around the saiyans and their quest for achieving new ultra transformations.

Buu doesn`t exactly have a normal body. Its not that solid. Its heavily dependent on its regeneration and shapeshifting. Piercing or slicing his body didn`t seem that hard to do. So, a kienzan shouldn`t have much trouble. What was really hard was to obliterate him completely.

Actually, considering how much Cell likes to talk about how perfect his body is, is it possible it might be extraordinarily resilient to attack, even without factoring in his "normal" strength and ki?

[crabshank1]

Surprised nobody has commented on Wakamoto's voice acting yet. Not that I was planning to.
I'd rather wait untill the Cell Games before I decide whether his voice acitng is better, worse or the same as before in DBZ.

His voice did change, he's speaking more like Semi-Perfect Cell by rolling his 'r's and his voice went a bit deeper and more grovelly. Compare it to Z if you don't believe me.

I don't know what you mean by ''Semi-Perfect Cell" (his 2nd form I guess) but you're right about his ''r'' rolling. He still has this clammy sound to his voice that was present during his first en second form which I hoped would dissappear once he became perfect.
At the moment I just want to wait untill the Cell Games when we can hear him exert his full dynamic range.

I mean the form after he absorbed #17 but before #18, just to clarify.

[Zep]

From the clips I've heard, it's as though Wakamoto is trying to play the part as more of a "freak", with all these strange creepy mannerisms. Particularly the way his voice gets extremely high while screaming and the strange insect-like noises he makes in his first form (I haven't seen many clips of his second form other than a comparison of his screaming for 18 part, where he's maybe starting to show his age). I dunno if it's really the best direction though, as it just makes the character seem goofier than he needs to be.

[Ashy-kun]

Indeed. All it really does is enforce the idea that he's not playing Cell but playing Wakamoto Norio (as he's perceived by fandom) playing Cell.

[JulieYBM]

Strange. I thought he had changed his first and second form voices to stop that perception of him playing "Wakamoto Norio playing Cell."

[Goku100xKamehameha]

This episode is the first Dragon Ball Kai episode to ever ranked in number 3 of Japan's TV animation ranking.
http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/20 ... vember-1-7

[AoiKageNoChikara]

Freaking One Piece!!! Why's it got to be first? XD

[Ashy-kun]

Because One Piece is also an awesome series.