The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread

[dbgtFO]

Can anyone figure this out, by the way? Less a specific versus question but it's based on the same kind of "who beats who" logic process, so I thought this was the best place to ask.

-Trunks and Goku's SSJ2 forms were about even, in fact Trunks might even have been slightly stronger (Goku was being overwhelmed a bit towards the end, as I think Piccolo commented on?)

-Trunks says his SSJ2 was no match for Black, and when Goku demonstrates SSJ3, Trunks says Black is as strong as that, maybe even stronger.

-Goku uses SSJ2 against Black and the two fight pretty back-and-forth, neither having a massive advantage.

-Trunks says that Black there was quite a bit stronger than he ever was in the future.

So... Black (Future) >= SSJ3 Goku > SSJ2 Trunks >= SSJ2 Goku ~ Black (Present) ...but also Black (Present) > Black (Future)?

Huh?! Am I missing something?

Trunks said Black was stronger in the future, Herms made a mistake in his initial translation.

[Khin]

I don't think Goku and Trunks are equals in the same form/state. Look at how Goku casually blocked Trunks' punch when he woke up. I think the scene you're talking about is a similar case between Cabba and Vegeta, where even though Vegeta is much stronger than Cabba, Piccolo said Cabba is pushing him back. Goku probably just let Trunks attack him like that to have a perfect grasp for Trunks' power. Oh, and its Present Trunks who said Future Trunks is pushing Goku back, not Piccolo. Picc wasn't there during the sparring match.

When Trunks said that Black is equal or stronger than SSj3 Goku, i assume Trunks is referring to the Black he last encountered.

When Goku asked Trunks how Black's power was compared when Trunks fought him on the Future, Trunks said this....
[spoiler][/spoiler]
So..

SSj2 Trunks << SSj2 Goku ~ Black (Present) < Black (Future) ~ SSj3 Goku

[Captain Space]

Trunks said Black was stronger in the future, Herms made a mistake in his initial translation.

When Goku asked Trunks how Black's power was compared when Trunks fought him on the Future, Trunks said this....
[spoiler][/spoiler]
So..

SSj2 Trunks << SSj2 Goku ~ Black (Present) < Black (Future) ~ SSj3 Goku

Oh! Thanks, guys! I must not have been paying as much attention as I thought XD (I wasn't even going by Herms, just my memories of the episode itself, haha...)

I don't think Goku and Trunks are equals in the same form/state. Look at how Goku casually blocked Trunks' punch when he woke up. I think the scene you're talking about is a similar case between Cabba and Vegeta, where even though Vegeta is much stronger than Cabba, Piccolo said Cabba is pushing him back. Goku probably just let Trunks attack him like that to have a perfect grasp for Trunks' power. Oh, and its Present Trunks who said Future Trunks is pushing Goku back, not Piccolo. Picc wasn't there during the sparring match.

Eh...maybe? There's nothing to indicate Goku was necessarily holding back fighting Trunks. The base thing was just one punch, especially considering Trunks literally just woke up.

I do see Cabba and Vegeta as equal. After all, they were equal in their base forms, so why not SSJ1? The whole thing with 'mastering' SSJ1 was in order to make it easier, so that you could get to higher levels of /overall/ power, base and SSJ. Cabba is already crazy powerful in base, so when he transforms, he gets up there.

[Khin]

Eh...maybe? There's nothing to indicate Goku was necessarily holding back fighting Trunks. The base thing was just one punch, especially considering Trunks literally just woke up.

Trunks just ate a senzu, so he should be at his full strength, i don't think he would hold back against a guy whom he though was Black. In the sparring match, i assume Goku let Trunks attack him like that to have a full grasp of his strength, since after those attacks, Goku easily blocked his punches while at the same time saying "you ain't half bad".

I do see Cabba and Vegeta as equal. After all, they were equal in their base forms, so why not SSJ1? The whole thing with 'mastering' SSJ1 was in order to make it easier, so that you could get to higher levels of /overall/ power, base and SSJ. Cabba is already crazy powerful in base, so when he transforms, he gets up there.

Vegeta literally tanked Cabba's punch in the forehead. Vegeta also called Base Cabba so weak that he shouldn't bother to enter the tournament. Cabba got exhausted by just fighting Vegeta for a bit. The manga also heavily implies that Cabba is weaker than Vegeta.

[Captain Space]

Eh...maybe? There's nothing to indicate Goku was necessarily holding back fighting Trunks. The base thing was just one punch, especially considering Trunks literally just woke up.

Trunks just ate a senzu, so he should be at his full strength, i don't think he would hold back against a guy whom he though was Black. In the sparring match, i assume Goku let Trunks attack him like that to have a full grasp of his strength, since after those attacks, Goku easily blocked his punches while at the same time saying "you ain't half bad".

I do see Cabba and Vegeta as equal. After all, they were equal in their base forms, so why not SSJ1? The whole thing with 'mastering' SSJ1 was in order to make it easier, so that you could get to higher levels of /overall/ power, base and SSJ. Cabba is already crazy powerful in base, so when he transforms, he gets up there.

Vegeta literally tanked Cabba's punch in the forehead. Vegeta also called Base Cabba so weak that he shouldn't bother to enter the tournament. Cabba got exhausted by just fighting Vegeta for a bit. The manga also heavily implies that Cabba is weaker than Vegeta.

Ah, curse my Toriyama-level memory XD All I remembered was Goku seeming to have trouble against some ki blasts Trunks was doing.

I thought Vegeta took the forehead-punch so nonchalantly because he was starting to summon up his SSB power...anyway, the other points are valid.

[Khin]

Ah, curse my Toriyama-level memory XD All I remembered was Goku seeming to have trouble against some ki blasts Trunks was doing.

I thought Vegeta took the forehead-punch so nonchalantly because he was starting to summon up his SSB power...anyway, the other points are valid.

Multiple stuff happened after Vegeta tanked Cabba's punch.

Cabba reverted back to base → Vegeta told Cabba to transform back to SSj → Cabba turned SSj quite easily and Vegeta complimented him for it → Vegeta turned SSjB and one shotted Cabba

I don't think Vegeta already had some of the of his SSjBlue power at those times.

[Captain Space]

Multiple stuff happened after Vegeta tanked Cabba's punch.

Cabba reverted back to base → Vegeta told Cabba to transform back to SSj → Cabba turned SSj quite easily and Vegeta complimented him for it → Vegeta turned SSjB and one shotted Cabba

I don't think Vegeta already had some of the of his SSjBlue power at those times.

Oh...uh...er...

Ah, curse my Toriyama-level memory XD

[apex_pretador]

Can anyone figure this out, by the way? Less a specific versus question but it's based on the same kind of "who beats who" logic process, so I thought this was the best place to ask.

-Trunks and Goku's SSJ2 forms were about even, in fact Trunks might even have been slightly stronger (Goku was being overwhelmed a bit towards the end, as I think Piccolo commented on?)

-Trunks says his SSJ2 was no match for Black, and when Goku demonstrates SSJ3, Trunks says Black is as strong as that, maybe even stronger.

-Goku uses SSJ2 against Black and the two fight pretty back-and-forth, neither having a massive advantage.

-Trunks says that Black there was quite a bit stronger than he ever was in the future.

So... Black (Future) >= SSJ3 Goku > SSJ2 Trunks >= SSJ2 Goku ~ Black (Present) ...but also Black (Present) > Black (Future)?

Huh?! Am I missing something?

- Goku never "fought" trunks in SS2. He just allowed trunks to try as hard as he could, and blocked him.

- oK

- Trunks said that black was a bit stronger IN THE FUTURE.

Black Future = SS3 suppressed goku > Black present >= SS2 goku >>>>>>>>> SS2 trunks

[Captain Space]

- Goku never "fought" trunks in SS2. He just allowed trunks to try as hard as he could, and blocked him.

- oK

- Trunks said that black was a bit stronger IN THE FUTURE.

Black Future = SS3 suppressed goku > Black present >= SS2 goku >>>>>>>>> SS2 trunks

Note that a couple people just spent like half a page explaining that to me XD

[Krillin1994]

Super Perfect Cell vs Future Trunks.

Kid buu vs Future Trunks

Hatchiyak vs Future Trunks

Tagoma (Ginyu) vs Future Trunks

[Lord Beerus]

Super Perfect Cell vs Future Trunks.

Kid buu vs Future Trunks

Hatchiyak vs Future Trunks

Tagoma (Ginyu) vs Future Trunks

You need to be more specific about which version of Future Trunks you are referring to.

[Krillin1994]

current Future Trunks from Super

[Lord Beerus]

current Future Trunks from Super

If Future Trunks can transform to his strongest form, SSJ2, then I'd reckon he'd take down Dabra, Hatchiyak and Tagoma (Ginyu) easily. He loses horribly against Kid Boo though.

[Darkron2151]

DB Super Manga Matchups:

• Hit (Full Power) vs. Golden Freeza
  
  Freeza (True Form/100%) (ROF) vs. Frost (1st Form)
  
  Base Vegeta (ROF) vs. Base Cabba
  
  Piccolo (U6 Tournament) vs. Freeza (True Form/100%) (ROF)
  
  SSJ3 Goku (U6 Tournament) vs. SSGSS Vegeta (10% Power)

[Krillin1994]

DB Super Manga Matchups:

• Hit (Full Power) vs. Golden Freeza
  
  Freeza (True Form/100%) (ROF) vs. Frost (1st Form)
  
  Base Vegeta (ROF) vs. Base Cabba
  
  Piccolo (U6 Tournament) vs. Freeza (True Form/100%) (ROF)
  
  
  SSJ3 Goku (U6 Tournament) vs. SSGSS Vegeta (10% Power)

[In Brightest Day]

Fights!

- Aka vs. Future Trunks (base, vs. Imperfect Cell).
- SSJ Cabba vs. SSJ Future Trunks (Super).
- Cyborg Tao vs. Chi-Chi, Master Roshi and Chaozu (23rd Budokai).
- Imperfect Cell (pre humans absorbed) vs. SSJ Future Trunks (Android arc) and SSJ Future Son Gohan.
- Drum vs. Tenshinhan and Yajirobe (Daimao arc).
- Son Goku (arrival on Namek, no Kaioken) vs. Krillin (vs. Freeza).
- Kaioshin vs. Piccolo (ROF).
- Red Ribbon Army vs. Yamcha (22nd Budokai).

[DanielSSJ]

Fights!

- Aka vs. Future Trunks (base, vs. Imperfect Cell).
- SSJ Cabba vs. SSJ Future Trunks (Super).
- Cyborg Tao vs. Chi-Chi, Master Roshi and Chaozu (23rd Budokai).
- Imperfect Cell (pre humans absorbed) vs. SSJ Future Trunks (Android arc) and SSJ Future Son Gohan.
- Drum vs. Tenshinhan and Yajirobe (Daimao arc).
- Son Goku (arrival on Namek, no Kaioken) vs. Krillin (vs. Freeza).
- Kaioshin vs. Piccolo (ROF).
- Red Ribbon Army vs. Yamcha (22nd Budokai).

- I typically peg Aka as being around the same level as 50% Freeza. Future Trunks is at a bit of a disadvantage and would probably need Super Saiyan to win.
- Super, pass.
- Tao Pai Pai easily overpowers any of them individually, the three of them together will most likely be enough to beat the cyborg.
- If it were Goku and Vegeta I'd say they have a decent shot at winning, but Trunks and Gohan aren't quite as strong as their dads nor are they as skilled, and this version of Cell is very cautious and crafty and he'll be on guard with two opponents. Cell wins rather easily.
- The two humans together should be enough to beat Drum. If all else fails, Tenshinhan's Kikoho should suffice.
- Power Level wise, Goku is rocking a 90,000 and Kuririn maxes out at 75,000, so I'd say that Goku would probably win.
- If Piccolo isn't afraid of hitting a god anymore, He'd definitely give Kaioshin a very good fight. If Piccolo is still lacking in power, his vast advantage in combat skill should give him the win over his inept opponent.
- Yamcha's probably close to, if not exactly as strong as Goku was by that point, so the Red Ribbon Army is F'ed in the A.

[Hellspawn28]

DB Super Manga Matchups:

• Hit (Full Power) vs. Golden Freeza
  
  Freeza (True Form/100%) (ROF) vs. Frost (1st Form)
  
  Base Vegeta (ROF) vs. Base Cabba
  
  Piccolo (U6 Tournament) vs. Freeza (True Form/100%) (ROF)
  
  SSJ3 Goku (U6 Tournament) vs. SSGSS Vegeta (10% Power)

Hit would win. Goku is much stronger than he was in ROF and it took Goku with Kaioken to stand up against Hit.

Vegeta

Piccolo should able to win, but Freeza could catch him off guard though

Could go either way

[Grimlock]

In a 1 x 1 battle, Super Saiyan 2 Future Trunks vs:

Botamo.
Frost.
Magetta.
Cabba.

[Darkron2151]

Hit would win. Goku is much stronger than he was in ROF and it took Goku with Kaioken to stand up against Hit.

My match-ups were concerning the DB Super MANGA, not anime. In the manga, Kaio-Ken isn't used at all. The most Goku goes is regular Blue, and that's implied to be stronger than Hit.