"Dragon Ball Super" Series Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

[Doctor.]

The entire series he was portrayed as a guy with good intentions who ends up with bad results. I could definitely see Goku in an antagonistic role, but evil? No, that'd be terrible writing.

Just see Super as its own thing and then you'll see how it makes perfect sense, Goku might considered to be evil because then he would have nothing holding him back, he's just wanna grow stronger and fight stronger opponents, something that he can't acomplish being committed with Earth's safety.

You can't see Super as its own thing, it's a sequel. It doesn't make sense for Goku to turn evil at any point in the series.

That's a far-fetched scenario as Goku would never forfeit his friends' and the Earth's safety, but even if it was put to use, you could have Goku in an antagonist role, as in, everybody tries to reason with him, using force if necessary. Him having intentions that would put everyone in danger is different than him turning completely evil, he'd never kill innocent beings and that's what makes an evil character evil.

[kinisking]

You guys are kidding, right? I mean, I know Chiki was, but everyone else, you don't really think Goku turning evil would be a good twist, would you? That'd be awful.

Why? He's selfish guy who only cares about fighting, it makes senses that he was tempted with evil.

The fact that he cares only about fighting is actually what makes him so pure.

Pure things are the easiest to corrupt.

he'd never kill innocent beings and that's what makes an evil character evil

.
I feel in certain situations Goku could kill an innocent being. The reason might be debatable but Goku did threaten the Supreme Kai with a ki blast. What if the Supreme Kai didn't give up? Goku might have killed him.

[Sodhi]

Goku can be very selfish. However him being evil? thats Broly being inside magenta stuff. I only see one scenario of how goku can "become" evil, it would be if he got controlled by something or lost his mind and started killing people.

[ChaosLordBrandon]

Goku being evil is the most riduclous thing I ever heard of in my 20 years of life.

[Avok]

Goku being evil is the most riduclous thing I ever heard of in my 20 years of life.

Same, word for word.

I mean, we're talking about Toei and Toriyama, for God's sake. Black Goku is the closest thing to a evil Goku we'll ever see.

[Xeztin]

Goku being evil is the most riduclous thing I ever heard of in my 20 years of life.

Same, word for word.

I mean, we're talking about Toei and Toriyama, for God's sake. Black Goku is the closest thing to a evil Goku we'll ever see.

We've had so many evil Goku look a likes I wouldn't doubt Goku himself being evil at one point. I swear it feels like these Goku/Vegeta look-a-likes will be a running theme in Super from now on. If they adapt the video games there will be even more look a likes.

[GodKaio-Ken]

Goku being evil is the most riduclous thing I ever heard of in my 20 years of life.

Same, word for word.

I mean, we're talking about Toei and Toriyama, for God's sake. Black Goku is the closest thing to a evil Goku we'll ever see.

We've had so many evil Goku look a likes I wouldn't doubt Goku himself being evil at one point. I swear it feels like these Goku/Vegeta look-a-likes will be a running theme in Super from now on. If they adapt the video games there will be even more look a likes.

I'm not really sure what you mean. Copy Vegeta was just a piece of filler that isn't important to the story at all and that just leaves Black. I don't see it as a theme unless I'm forgetting something?

[TheShadowEmperor8055]

There’s how, basically, Son Goku from Dragon Ball doesn’t fight for the sake of others, but because he wants to fight against strong guys. So once Dragon Ball got animated, at any rate, I’ve always been dissatisfied with the “righteous hero”-type portrayal they gave him. I guess I couldn’t quite get them to grasp the elements of “poison” that slip in and out of sight among the shadows.

Keeping this quote in mind, while we know Toriyama didn't necessarily want to portray Goku as a total hero, companies like Toei and FUNimation have been portraying Goku as such for decades (for instance, this is an example; wonder when Goku discovered all of that about himself). Portraying Goku as a villain all of a sudden would be a complete 180 from that.

[SansrivaaL]

Our Goku becoming evil is the last thing I'll expect from this series, true that Toriyama may not like how Toei lumps Goku with the heroic type of MC but I dont think he would go that far into proving a point that Goku is not a hero, from a guy that only wants to test his limits and fights powerful beings to a guy thats obsessed with wiping out mortals in the universe is a way too much flip even for me.

[MCDaveG]

Trunks' voice actor says Kid Trunks grows as a character this arc.

Mais' VA says she has a big role... unless screen time equates to a big role.

Yea, the same way Freeza's VA said in RoF: "Freeza lost the battle, but won the war" and was not like that at all, I advise you to not to take seriously VA's statements, they tend to be full of bullshit to promote the show.

That statement with Freeza was true, only that Whis cheated right after with time rewind
Yeah, it was truly a statement like with Kahn in Star Trek movie...

[PMD]

Goku being evil is one of the worst theories I read/heard in my life following DB Universe. Literally the worst. By far. Not even close.

[Pannaliciour]

My theory about Shu might have been false but here is what I honestly think will be true.

Future Goku = Goku Black. Future Goku faked his heart virus and was evil all along, biding his time to get stronger until he could conquer the universe with no one to stop him. He faked his heart virus, acted dead and left Earth to train under Zamasu, his real father, and become a Kaioshin, which is why they have similar ki. Goku has also been faking his ki all this time, it's actually the same as Zamasu's except more evil.

Present Goku was unable to fake his death because Trunks gave him medicine. He was waiting to reveal his evil nature much longer as a result. Goku is going to reveal his evil nature in the next couple eps against Black, since there can only be one evil Goku around.

There's a mountain of evidence for the fact that Goku is evil:

1. Goku beating the shit out of Chichi and breaking all her bones after coming back to Earth after the Frieza saga.
2. Goku's ridiculous and exaggerated "I WANT TO FIGHT!!!! TRAIN!!!" act is obviously fake.
3. Goku watched Cell beat the shit out of his son, Gohan, with a smile on his face. He even gave him a Senzu to do it better.
4. Goku let Vegeta and Frieza escape so that they could destroy Earth. Not like he gave a fuck.
5. Goku didn't kill Buu with SSJ3 so he could destroy Earth, not because he wanted the kids to have a chance at doing it.

Thoughts?

That'd be kind of amazing and one hell of a twist. I think Black does somehow have Future Goku's body though, or at least a Goku from one of the other timelines.

Great thinking but you forget the fact that Goku could stand on the cloud (Nimbus). Only pure hearted people could do that.

[sophitia]

My theory about Shu might have been false but here is what I honestly think will be true.

Future Goku = Goku Black. Future Goku faked his heart virus and was evil all along, biding his time to get stronger until he could conquer the universe with no one to stop him. He faked his heart virus, acted dead and left Earth to train under Zamasu, his real father, and become a Kaioshin, which is why they have similar ki. Goku has also been faking his ki all this time, it's actually the same as Zamasu's except more evil.

Present Goku was unable to fake his death because Trunks gave him medicine. He was waiting to reveal his evil nature much longer as a result. Goku is going to reveal his evil nature in the next couple eps against Black, since there can only be one evil Goku around.

There's a mountain of evidence for the fact that Goku is evil:

1. Goku beating the shit out of Chichi and breaking all her bones after coming back to Earth after the Frieza saga.
2. Goku's ridiculous and exaggerated "I WANT TO FIGHT!!!! TRAIN!!!" act is obviously fake.
3. Goku watched Cell beat the shit out of his son, Gohan, with a smile on his face. He even gave him a Senzu to do it better.
4. Goku let Vegeta and Frieza escape so that they could destroy Earth. Not like he gave a fuck.
5. Goku didn't kill Buu with SSJ3 so he could destroy Earth, not because he wanted the kids to have a chance at doing it.

Thoughts?

That'd be kind of amazing and one hell of a twist. I think Black does somehow have Future Goku's body though, or at least a Goku from one of the other timelines.

Great thinking but you forget the fact that Goku could stand on the cloud (Nimbus). Only pure hearted people could do that.

That's why he never ride nimbus anymore.

[Krillin1994]

That theory has made me lose IQ points

[Chiki]

Great thinking but you forget the fact that Goku could stand on the cloud (Nimbus). Only pure hearted people could do that.

Pure evil or pure good? It's never specified. Goku can ride the Nimbus because he is pure evil.

Oh yeah, Goku also tried to let Golden Frieza get away in RoF, knowing that if he mastered the endurance issue of his Golden form Frieza would have wrecked both him and Vegeta.

Goku's apparent irresponsibility and recklessness can only be explained by the fact that he is secretly evil.

[Captain Space]

Great thinking but you forget the fact that Goku could stand on the cloud (Nimbus). Only pure hearted people could do that.

Pure evil or pure good? It's never specified. Goku can ride the Nimbus because he is pure evil.

Oh yeah, Goku also tried to let Golden Frieza get away in RoF, knowing that if he mastered the endurance issue of his Golden form Frieza would have wrecked both him and Vegeta.

Goku's apparent irresponsibility and recklessness can only be explained by the fact that he is secretly evil.

Toriyama does not plan that far ahead. Especially back in the day. Just doesn't happen. It can be explained just fine by "Goku's an idiot".

[Chiki]

Great thinking but you forget the fact that Goku could stand on the cloud (Nimbus). Only pure hearted people could do that.

Pure evil or pure good? It's never specified. Goku can ride the Nimbus because he is pure evil.

Oh yeah, Goku also tried to let Golden Frieza get away in RoF, knowing that if he mastered the endurance issue of his Golden form Frieza would have wrecked both him and Vegeta.

Goku's apparent irresponsibility and recklessness can only be explained by the fact that he is secretly evil.

Toriyama does not plan that far ahead. Especially back in the day. Just doesn't happen. It can be explained just fine by "Goku's an idiot".

He lied, simple. He's a cunning and intelligent man.

[HeroR]

I know it is popular around her to say and think that Goku is a selfish, amoral asshole who would sell the entire world for a good fight, but the idea of turning him evil is just pure character derailment.

Goku does love fighting. No one argues that, and he has put the Earth in danger for good and fair matches, not destroying the androids (although all the Z-Fighters all agreed with him) and given Cell a senzu. However, he would never turn against his friends and family for a good fight. This is the same person who told Raditz to fu** himself when he was told that he was supposed to be a murderous Saiyan and all the good battles they would have in space. The idea that he would kill people weaker than him, made him renounced being a Saiyan until the Freeza Saga. Even in Super, he got mad at Beerus for targeting the Earth just to bring out his full power, he despised Freeza's existence, and he wanted to save the U6's fighters from Champa.

There is a long way to go from being recklessness and selfish, to being evil. And to humor Chiki, if Goku was evil the Devilmite Beam would have exploded his heart.

[Chiki]

And to humor Chiki, if Goku was evil the Devilmite Beam would have exploded his heart.

Goku is only evil from our perspective, but not actually evil so the Devilmite Beam wouldn't work. As a demi-god he is actually not objectively evil at all. He does what he thinks is right, just like Black. When Black said "I will destroy mankind for the sake of justice" he is doing it because he thinks it's the right thing to do. He thinks he is a good person.

[HeroR]

And to humor Chiki, if Goku was evil the Devilmite Beam would have exploded his heart.

Goku is only evil from our perspective. As a demi-god he is actually not objectively evil at all. He does what he thinks is right, just like Black. When Black said "I will destroy mankind for the sake of justice" he is doing it because he thinks it's the right thing to do.

Nope, the Devilmite Beam doesn't work that way. It is said to take any evil in the person's heart and make them explode. And Black's ki is called evil by Whis, the same person who takes care of Beerus, so it doesn't matter that he's fight for justice. He's still evil. Beerus even called Black a cold heart.