"Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

[emperior]

Nice chapter. A bit slow but will probably be a nice one when going on a re-read, cause it was surely entertaining.

The training part was really cool and I am really freaking happy that they are actually going the direction I wanted them to go, which is that of Goku mastering Ultra Instinct in his normal state so that he won’t have to transform into it. And it seems like we got confirmation that the silver haired form is indeed a transformation, so it seems like Goku transforms when he uses his full power and enters the Ultra Instinct state of mind.
About Vegeta, I didn’t expect him to wear Beerus’ earring. It’s a nice subtle touch to signal his newly acquired skill, though I think he will still have to transform into Super Saiyan Blue while I would hope to see him too fight in his normal state.

I must say I am liking the Heeters a lot. They blend with the DB world really well, and are actually very cunning. I wonder what’s in store for Gas, as he will probably play a key part in all of this. The chapter has once again shown that Granolah is a good guy, when he was keeping an eye on the old Namekian, and Whis too said he’s unsure of this new one being an enemy.

I really cannot wait to see the interactions and fighting between Goku/Vegeta and Granolah actually start next chapter.

Will Granolah mistake Goku for Bardock?

[GalaxyBusterBuu]

Granolah is gonna be an ally unless he gets manipulated at the last second and turns on them, though he'll likely die by the end of the arc or sometime afterwards, as his wish will end up biting him in the ass because it cut off his life-span by a large margin. Assuming they can't add more years onto him through other means, he'll probably die sooner or later.

[Krillin1994]

This was one of my fave dragonball super chapters in a long time.

Love that Beerus has been active in teaching Vegeta and tying his pride to him and throwing down the gauntlet to Whis. Always enjoy seeing training in DB, Whis using his staff in this training session makes it feel fresh (Anime just felt any time Goku and Vegeta trained with whis it was always the same)

Macki was enjoyable this chapter (but guess Bulma wasn't fiery enough for Zuno) - her calling out Zuno was good, and her hammy acting on earth. Heeters in general with this brand of villainy is cool. I like how assured they are at having the resources to facilitate their plans.

anyone want to speculate the 10 questions? Love that they are using knowledge to exploit Goku and Vegeta working out their weakness etc

Biggest role Chi Chi has played in the manga - wouldn't have expected her to appear in anything beyond background of a panel.

Gas having the potential to be stronger than frieza already kinda makes me feel the wish wouldn't just be to make him stronger. Especially since we've just had that wish on the Cerealian DBs

I'm gonna throw a prediction with how these Dragonballs work with not turning to stone, and with Granolah watching Monaito who seems a bit frailer to me than before. Instead of turning to stone each usage drains his life force. Which is why he didn't want Granolah to use them. Heeter gang using them could cause his death as a result. Would also make it tragic that Granolah has caused them to both have less lifespan, and he's wasting remaining time with him on his grudge only watching from afar - could make for a bitter sweet farewell

With only limited life remaining I can see granolah doing something self sacrificial at the end of the arc.


People calling this chapter filler is surprising me, honestly the setup for this just feels great. Unsure if it is because for other arcs we had the Anime out for it, and then any changes in manga felt jarring. But the Moro arc and this one are shaping up to be the best Super has and just makes me want to be able to see it animated.

[DiscountDabi]

Something I only just considered.

So for all intents and purposes, Granolah is around 50 years old. Lets take all these numbers at face value and ignore how much it contradicts for a second

If Granolah is 50, and the Saiyans Attacked 40 years ago, then Granolah would have been 10 years old at the time.

And the Heeters said last chapter that they had gotten the frieza force to attack Planet Cereal and then Immediately after swooped in to sell it. That was probably the first time Granolah met them.


It makes sense that Granolah has been working for the Heeters for most of his life which is why he blindly trusts them so much.

[GalaxyBusterBuu]

Damn DiscountDabi's theory makes sense. Still, imagine how pissed Granolah is going to be when he finds out what the Heeters did. He's gonna lose his shit when he realizes he's been played.

[Lord Beerus]

Random and scattered thoughts of Chapter 71:

- Whis: "Tell me... what is the decsisive difference between us and angels, Goku?"
Goku: "Uh... I don't have a halo thingy?"
One of the rare occasions where "simpleton Goku" can be quite funny.

- I don't like the "horny old man" vibes emanating from Zuno. It's such a tired and old trope that I wish would just die already. I like it before when he was nonplussed about getting kissed on cheek. That was the point of the gag. Now he he has "types" he prefers. Ugh...

- The sequence of Goku and Vegeta training was fantastic. There was no dialogue to interrupt the flow of the movement of the character and it managed present visually distinct dynamics between Goku and Whis training and Beerus and Vegeta that complement bother their characters and the manner in which their were approaching their training. Great stuff.

- I found quite surreal, and a bit hilarious, how two strangers show up to Goku's house and alarm bells don't go off for Chi Chi like why these people know who Goku is and yet Goku has never mentioned them before. Like, Chi Chi is so used to weird shit she sees and hears she doesn't think twice about letting her guard down. And... her main concern is still about the fact that the money that Mr Satan gave Goku is running dry. Which begs the question... how the fuck did she blow through that money so quickly? Didn't she lie to Goku about spending all of the money Mr Satan gave him to get to him to work a vegetable farmer/seller in the first place? I know this is a minor point, but I think it's safe to say that Chi Chi needs to hire an accountant. She is TERRIBLE with money. Anyway...

- Vegeta: "None may claim the title of the universe's strongest without my say." Granolah's gonna curb stomp Vegeta, isn't he?

- This chapter reminded me of why I love Beerus and Whis so much. They play off each-other so damn well. Seamless shifting from different dynamics like a Batman/Alfred relationship to a older/younger sibling dynamic and even at times like a mother/father and son/daughter relationship. It keeps the character fresh, while also subtlety developing them as well. Beerus wants to get one up on Whis when it comes to mentoring, but actually does give a shit about making Vegeta an even more competent and versatile martial artist.

- Oil and Macki are really growing on me. They have great chemistry not only with themselves, but with nearly everyone they interact with. Macki in particularly is a really fun character. Very social, cunning, charming and can even be a bit funny. I wanna see more of her.

- Super hyped about Goku, Vegeta and Granolah duking it out because it's been so meticulously planned out. Can't wait for Vegeta to be humbled again.

Overall thoughts... another great chapter that wonderfully balanced subtle character development with significant plot progression and yet managed to be mundanely entertaining and even a bit surreal at times. Next month can't come soon enough.

[PurestEvil]

Chapter 71 was good! I absolutely dig the Heeters deceiving everyone, they really are an enjoyable bunch. The little convo between Elec and Gas was quite interesting, I would like to see how Gas becomes stronger in this circumstance. The scenes with Goku and Vegeta training were fun, it's nice to see them do things that don't involve hitting things.
I do have to agree that the Cerealian DBs are getting a bit problematic now. Monaito is most likely going to die anyway, though, but a part of me does not count on that
But still, it was at least an upgrade from the snail-pace previous chapter.

[Krillin1994]

Maybe with this dragonball infinite use we could see the heeters really abuse them.

We saw Goku just grab his 4 star before as a kid before they scattered. Imagine them just holding onto them and repeatedly wishing for things. No recharge time kinda makes me feel they’ll somehow get more than one wish.

[GalaxyBusterBuu]

Old Namek guy is likely going to die sooner or later, calling it now. I can't imagine keeping him around, especially while the Heeters have the balls. It'd be too problematic seeing as they could literally just keep going back to the balls and ask for wishes over and over again. Assuming his age doesn't kill him, someone else will.

Like god, could you imagine if someone like Zamasu got these balls, if Zamasu had access to these balls when he was alive...it would've been bad considering he'd just have to keep the old guy alive and continue wishing over and over again. These balls either need to be destroyed or rendered in inactive, that way we don't have to worry about someone just spamming for wishes that would make them ridiculously OP to the point literally no one can beat them.

[Kinokima]

- Super hyped about Goku, Vegeta and Granolah duking it out because it's been so meticulously planned out. Can't wait for Vegeta to be humbled .

Not that I think Vegeta is going to beat Granolah obviously that is not going to happen but I also don’t think he needs to be “humbled” because he says a typical Vegeta line.

Do we really need to see the same thing with Vegeta every single time? I certainly hope this isn’t going to lead to just Vegeta getting beat up to show Granolah’s power because that is just the same boring formula we always see. And both Goku & Vegeta were showing over confidence this chapter.

If the chapter is just Vegeta getting beat up than I rather it stem from something more interesting like his guilt over what the Saiyans did.

[TheSaiyanGod]

Spoiler:

Thinking about it, a question about the Dragon Balls - Maki speculates that the Earth Balls are stones right now, but in the Moro arc, Gohan mentions that they've gathered the Dragon Balls to use if they need to - but they don't use them. Is this a sly indication that they've been used for something we don't yet know about recently, or is this a goof? Or, is it simply that Maki isn't aware that they're with Dende right now, and something about that makes them less easily detected? I wonder.

Also, the Cereal Balls never turning to stone is interesting: still puts the Heeters on course to use a set to empower Gas in the aftermath of the Granolah fight, if that's what the story is going for.

Yeah, definitely DBs were used off-panel judging by that, or maybe Toyo forgot about that? I wouldn't be surprised if that wish was revealed in a bonus chapter. Maybe Bulma finally got her wish to be 5 years younger?

- I don't like the "horny old man" vibes emanating from Zuno. It's such a tired and old trope that I wish would just die already. I like it before when he was nonplussed about getting kissed on cheek. That was the point of the gag. Now he he has "types" he prefers. Ugh...

Zuno actually mentions when Bulma went to see him for the first time that she wasn’t his type, so it’s recurring. But yeah, I can see people getting uncomfortable with that. Tho I feel that "harassment" was specifically mentioned in the chapter as a reminder that this type of situation is not specifically seen as just a gag or inconsequential.

Considering that Roshi's instances of doing these things are almost non-existent in the manga, I feel that Toyo doesn't want to put these things in the story, and probably neither Toriyama (supervising the chapters) since times have now changed compared to early DB

[Mystic Buu]

Anyway, if he's not the main villain, who do you think it is? Freeza? 7/3? The Heeters? Most likely the Heeters imo. The setup with that one brother being able to surpass Freeza, him not fighting Granolla and the fact the heeters are pursuing the dragon balls makes it seem like they are going to wish to bring out his full potential. Or maybe The Heeters are end up fused???

My best guess would be Heeters, although it's tough to tell. It feels like this fight will be a tip of the iceberg for story, just like Goku vs Black in anime version or Goku and Vegeta vs Moro.

I'm more and more convinced that we won't see Freeza. The only role he has is linking the characters together and he does that without having to be present. Outside of that, he would probably only be a punching bag like in Broly movie.

[Kinokima]

- I don't like the "horny old man" vibes emanating from Zuno. It's such a tired and old trope that I wish would just die already. I like it before when he was nonplussed about getting kissed on cheek. That was the point of the gag. Now he he has "types" he prefers. Ugh...

Zuno actually mentions when Bulma went to see him for the first time that she wasn’t his type, so it’s recurring. But yeah, I can see people getting uncomfortable with that. Tho I feel that "harassment" was specifically mentioned in the chapter as a reminder that this type of situation is not specifically seen as just a gag or inconsequential.

Considering that Roshi's instances of doing these things are almost non-existent in the manga, I feel that Toyo doesn't want to put these things in the story, and probably neither Toriyama (supervising the chapters) since times have now changed compared to early DB

While it is less than the original DB I actually feel these type of moments are more frequent in Super than they were in DBZ. Although there were some that stand out in Z like with the Old Kai

But even if they say it is harassment it’s still being played for Laughs in the end. In this case I agree with Lord Beerus I hate this type of humor.

[TKA]

Cool lore addition with the earring.

Maki is fun. The fat guy doesn't say or do anything.

[nato25]

- I don't like the "horny old man" vibes emanating from Zuno. It's such a tired and old trope that I wish would just die already. I like it before when he was nonplussed about getting kissed on cheek. That was the point of the gag. Now he he has "types" he prefers. Ugh...

Zuno actually mentions when Bulma went to see him for the first time that she wasn’t his type, so it’s recurring. But yeah, I can see people getting uncomfortable with that. Tho I feel that "harassment" was specifically mentioned in the chapter as a reminder that this type of situation is not specifically seen as just a gag or inconsequential.

Considering that Roshi's instances of doing these things are almost non-existent in the manga, I feel that Toyo doesn't want to put these things in the story, and probably neither Toriyama (supervising the chapters) since times have now changed compared to early DB

While it is less than the original DB I actually feel these type of moments are more frequent in Super than they were in DBZ. Although there were some that stand out in Z like with the Old Kai

But even if they say it is harassment it’s still being played for Laughs in the end. In this case I agree with Lord Beerus I hate this type of humor.

It's very low key harassment if it can be called that seeing as Maki is doing it for personal gain. But let's not get into a battle of harassment.

Another great chapter. I love the subtleness of the joke that bulma and chi chi could be their biggest weaknesses. For a second I thought that might get them kidnapped which would have been interesting as well. It's also implied their self righteousness could be another weakness and I like that too.

The only thing that I found a bit strange was why they needed any more than there are two saiyans who want to fight you to goad Granolah. All the freezas army stuff seemed unneeded. Speaking of freeza, interesting he still hasn't shown up yet. Liking the arc so far a lot and enjoying all the new lore additions we get. Ceruleans balls don't turn to stone is interesting.

[Krillin1994]

Zuno actually mentions when Bulma went to see him for the first time that she wasn’t his type, so it’s recurring. But yeah, I can see people getting uncomfortable with that. Tho I feel that "harassment" was specifically mentioned in the chapter as a reminder that this type of situation is not specifically seen as just a gag or inconsequential.

Considering that Roshi's instances of doing these things are almost non-existent in the manga, I feel that Toyo doesn't want to put these things in the story, and probably neither Toriyama (supervising the chapters) since times have now changed compared to early DB

While it is less than the original DB I actually feel these type of moments are more frequent in Super than they were in DBZ. Although there were some that stand out in Z like with the Old Kai

But even if they say it is harassment it’s still being played for Laughs in the end. In this case I agree with Lord Beerus I hate this type of humor.

It's very low key harassment if it can be called that seeing as Maki is doing it for personal gain. But let's not get into a battle of harassment.

Another great chapter. I love the subtleness of the joke that bulma and chi chi could be their biggest weaknesses. For a second I thought that might get them kidnapped which would have been interesting as well. It's also implied their self righteousness could be another weakness and I like that too.

The only thing that I found a bit strange was why they needed any more than there are two saiyans who want to fight you to goad Granolah. All the freezas army stuff seemed unneeded. Speaking of freeza, interesting he still hasn't shown up yet. Liking the arc so far a lot and enjoying all the new lore additions we get. Ceruleans balls don't turn to stone is interesting.

Think that was because they said they were looking for Frieza to granolah he would’ve been suspicious maybe if after the time skip had just said we found two saiyans this then can justify with their ‘slip of revealing that granolah wants Frieza’

Oh man we were hot on his trail but now he’s gone into hiding. Buying the heeters more time for their plotting

[Mr Baggins]

Like with last month, there's a lot of material that could have been condensed.

I tend to enjoy Dragon Ball more for its snappier pacing and unexpected character beats than the kind of deliberative plot stuff we're getting here; the latter isn't really DB's forte, but I'm willing to see if it pays off this time. Structurally, it's absolutely new territory.

We'll see. *shrug*

[Kinokima]

Zuno actually mentions when Bulma went to see him for the first time that she wasn’t his type, so it’s recurring. But yeah, I can see people getting uncomfortable with that. Tho I feel that "harassment" was specifically mentioned in the chapter as a reminder that this type of situation is not specifically seen as just a gag or inconsequential.

Considering that Roshi's instances of doing these things are almost non-existent in the manga, I feel that Toyo doesn't want to put these things in the story, and probably neither Toriyama (supervising the chapters) since times have now changed compared to early DB

While it is less than the original DB I actually feel these type of moments are more frequent in Super than they were in DBZ. Although there were some that stand out in Z like with the Old Kai

But even if they say it is harassment it’s still being played for Laughs in the end. In this case I agree with Lord Beerus I hate this type of humor.

It's very low key harassment if it can be called that seeing as Maki is doing it for personal gain. But let's not get into a battle of harassment.

Another great chapter. I love the subtleness of the joke that bulma and chi chi could be their biggest weaknesses. For a second I thought that might get them kidnapped which would have been interesting as well. It's also implied their self righteousness could be another weakness and I like that too.

The only thing that I found a bit strange was why they needed any more than there are two saiyans who want to fight you to goad Granolah. All the freezas army stuff seemed unneeded. Speaking of freeza, interesting he still hasn't shown up yet. Liking the arc so far a lot and enjoying all the new lore additions we get. Ceruleans balls don't turn to stone is interesting.

This particular scene wasn’t the worst but it’s still kind of dumb needing the female character to perform “sexual favors.”


And as for the Heeters telling Granolah that Goku and Vegeta were part of the Freeza force I think they were just piling on reasons for Granolah to hate them.

It’s the same with Goku and Vegeta they must know those two like a challenge so they sell the strongest in the Universe along with Granolah being a villain

The Heeters come off as intelligent while everyone else comes off as idiots lol. Vegeta is a little suspicious but brushes it aside too quickly.

[Trouser]

Beerus is just jealous of Goku mastering Ultra Instinct before him.

Spoiler:

[DiscountDabi]

And as for the Heeters telling Granolah that Goku and Vegeta were part of the Freeza force I think they were just piling on reasons for Granolah to hate them.

It’s the same with Goku and Vegeta they must know those two like a challenge so they sell the strongest in the Universe along with Granolah being a villain

The Heeters come off as intelligent while everyone else comes off as idiots lol. Vegeta is a little suspicious but brushes it aside too quickly.

I already gave a pretty good reason as to why Granolah trusts the Heeters. As for Goku and Vegeta, the same thing just happened last arc with The Galactic Patrol. Even Goku alludes to it by saying “The earth isn’t in danger this time.”


Plus, Like Goku is gonna say no when Chi-Chi is getting paid for this.