The All-Purpose "What-If " Thread

[YoungDefender]

Like King Cold and Frieza? Gero might be a little more anxious once Cell becomes disobedient. I see Cell keeping him alive because Gero feeds his ego.

Yeah, actually that works too. I agree that Gero doesn't seem to take disobedience well and may react in such a way as to elicit a severe response from Cell, similar to how he did with 17. But I can also see Cell playing ball as long as Gero can keep finding and lining up pins for him to knock down.

[Steven Bloodriver]

Just imagine an Alternate Timeline of DBZ having absolutely all of the main antagonists from DB that came after the Red Ribbon Army Saga, but just before the Androids Saga having been revived and then turned into Cyborgs just like Android 18 and Android 17 by Maki Doctor Gero?

[theherodjl]

What if every Saiyan on Planet Vegeta inexplicably & spontaneously transformed into SSJ3 just minutes before Freeza launched his blast at the planet? How would history change if the Saiyans not only did not go extinct, but also had the full potential of the SSJ transformation unleashed?

[Koitsukai]

What if every Saiyan on Planet Vegeta inexplicably & spontaneously transformed into SSJ3 just minutes before Freeza launched his blast at the planet? How would history change if the Saiyans not only did not go extinct, but also had the full potential of the SSJ transformation unleashed?

King Vegeta and Prince Vegeta would be over 4M, the elites would be around 2M. The low class warriors would be around 400k, almost as strong as Freeza in his laz-e boy. Goku would become 800.
But more importantly, Bardock, the guy standing up to Freeza would be also around 4M. Freeza would not be able to counter his blast, and in his hubris I doubt he'd think he should power up. If he were to do that he'd only become 2nd form, which wouldn't be enough.
Bardock would destroy Freeza even before he understands he needs to use his real form.

Even if this fails, there's a big chance they can all turn SS4 once the moon is out or somebody creates an artificial one. In that case, Freeza is dead. An army of SS4 is too much even for his FP. SS4 King Vegeta alone would be pretty close to his FP, and SS4 Vegeta might be stronger.

This would probably make Beerus do something about it, he did order Freeza to kill them. It's uncertain if he was already asleep or not, perhaps Whis would wake him up sooner if Beerus' plan were to backfire as this What-if proposes.

Goku would grow up as an OP child on Earth, Son Gohan would not be able to control him, I'm not sure if he'd hit his head and become nice. I guess he'd rule the planet, probably kill Kami eventually. No offsprings. The androids might be much stronger, if Gero even survives SS3 Goku's onslaught, but I doubt they could do much against a SS4 Goku.
The Buu arc would not happen, and Beerus eventually should challenge Goku and destroy him.
If he does hit his head, I guess he'd save the world without casualties, become even stronger under Roshi. Probably no Piccolo Jr, assuming he'd trash Piccolo before he can spit out an egg. So, no more DBs.
The threat of the androids would be even easier, considering he'd have friends and family to aid him. Again, the Buu arc is not happening. And BoG might happen just like in the movie, only with Beerus having to exert himself a little more against this SSG Goku.

No Golden Freeza, no future timeline, no Black, the ToP is the final destination. Without Geets as a rival, I doubt Goku can take on Jiren.

[Yuji]

What if Piccolo wished for his potential to be unlocked during the 2 months of training for Moro?

[Koitsukai]

What if Piccolo wished for his potential to be unlocked during the 2 months of training for Moro?

He'd be another SSB level character for Saganbo to wipe his ass with. I'm not sure if he'd unlock Orange vs Saganbo, in SH he did so after being pretty much taken out of the ring, but even without his potential unlocked he was still very much in the game vs Saganbo. I doubt he'd put Saganbo in that much trouble in order for Moro to power him up even more and force the Orange Piccolo to come out.
That part probably plays out as it did in the manga.
However, when Moro7-3 corners everybody, I can see Orange Piccolo emerging and giving Moro7-3 a good fight. It's unclear how he compares exactly to UI Goku. Maybe he wins, maybe he only weakens Moro7-3.

In the event that Orange Piccolo does appear vs Saganbo, then he'd beat his ass, and should defeat Moro. The thing is he doesn't know much about Moro, so he could become another meal that would probably end with Sign Goku dying in his fight vs this much stronger Moro.
Piccolo fell twice for 7-3's trickery, so I don't see how he wouldn't fall for Moro's absorption.

[Hellspawn28]

What if Goku and Vegeta show up during the fight against Cell Max? Would they need fusion or one of them be enough?

[SonTao]

What if Goku and Vegeta show up during the fight against Cell Max? Would they need fusion or one of them be enough?

Ultra Ego Vegeta solos--one hakai and Cell Max is down. Additionally, MUI Goku could pull off a similar win--once the weak spot is pointed out, one warp Kamehameha takes down the bio android.

[Peach]

What if Piccolo wished for his potential to be unlocked during the 2 months of training for Moro?

Not much of a difference imo. Probably just volunteers to fight in place of Android 17 and 18.

The problem is, the strength beyond his limits at that point in the series is still weaker than the version of him years later in Super Hero. He just awakens his potential at the time, and not all the potential he'll ever have in life.

[Hellspawn28]

What if Uub went into space instead of Pan in GT?

[Steven Bloodriver]

What if Uub went into space instead of Pan in GT?

Well, then, Hellspawn28, an absolute Hell of a whole lot more than around a handful of the antagonists from the Black Star Dragon Ball Saga are going to be surpassed, humiliated, defeated, and then murdered by Uub.

[Steven Bloodriver]

What if Master Roshi had found and then Adopted Kakarot or Son Goku instead of Grandpa Son Gohan?

[SonTao]

What if Master Roshi had found and then Adopted Kakarot or Son Goku instead of Grandpa Son Gohan?

I suppose a great number of things could change! Goku's power would be pretty easily curbed since Roshi could shove Oozaru Goku into the water and off the island, chop off his tail, and raise Goku to not look at the sun. He'd also be raised in the Turtle Hermit school of martial arts from birth, meaning we have a far more disciplined and intelligent Goku! He'd have a different name as well, but it's also quite possible Roshi would salvage the pod Clark Kent style and let Goku know of his Saipan heritage. With a far more intelligent, practiced, and sunglasses--sporting Kakarot, what else would we have to deal with? One might think Goku would grow up pervy, but he doesn't really get the appeal in general throughout the series or why he should desire them, so he'd likely look at it as "my grandpa's weird obsession." Overall, less bumpkin-esque with more common sense but not to like genius levels.

When Dragon Ball starts, Kakarot would meet Bulma and Grandpa Gohan after they rescued Turtle. Considering Grandpa Gohan is a friend of Roshi, Roshi would hand over the Dragon Ball--and tell Kakarot to join the pair on the journey, as there's only so much Kakarot could really do on Roshi's island. After that, quite a bit of early Dragon Ball goes the same or improves in general, Yamcha is encountered, handily beaten, and invited by Gohan into the group. Pilaf gets whooped. Difference is, Goku joins up with Yamcha and Gohan in flying off to West City after Pilaf's Wish is foiled by a controlled Oozaru Kakarot. Of course, this means Kakarot doesn't train with Krillin at all, since he's off with Gohan and Yamcha--Kakarot's new best friend bond forms with Yamcha instead! Krillin does still end up training with Muten Roshi as a result of the master's warmed heart after raising Kakarot though. He misses his grandson.

Yamcha grows in leaps and bounds sparring against Kakarot and Gohan, meaning by the time of the tournament, Yamcha is at the level of Goku and Krillin from canon in the 21st Tenkaichi Budokai. But in the end, Jackie Chun ends up defeating the group as a whole, teaching Kakarot his lesson regarding consistently stronger opponents. Without the urge to collect the Dragon Balls, Kakarot doesn't head off after the fourth ball, meaning the Red Ribbon Army is free to continue collecting them without care. Instead, the gang decides to split off on their own to train once more. This may lead into one of the group running into the Red Ribbon Army, meaning that at one point or another, the Red Ribbon Army will be annihilated. Perhaps Bulma notices the balls beginning to converge? In any case, Gero grows a hatred for Kakarot, Yamcha, Krillin, etc.

Mercenary Tao is never hired by the army due to the lack of competition they had in the initial hunt, meaning Tenshinhan has no motivation to hate Kakarot or Turtle School initiates. Bora doesn't die, no one goes to Korin's Tower (yet anyway), or meet Baba. But after the Red Ribbon Army is destroyed, Roshi and Gohan suggest Korin Tower after they barely scrape out a win against a completed Android 8 and the remaining Red Ribbon members. Kakarot, Krillin, and Yamcha undergo what Goku had in canon, all reaching his level or above considering they had to learn to work together as a trio to take Korin down. With a new bond cultivated with the newcomer Krillin after the Red Ribbon arc and Korin's training, the three Turtle School students continue their hard work, and move on to the 22nd Tenkaichi Budokai.

The 22nd Tenkaichi Budokai's lineup is far different. Kakarot, Krillin, Yamcha, Tenshinhan, Chiaotzu, Tao, Panput and Jackie Chun enter and continue onward. Yamcha and Tenshinhan scrap as per usual, with Tien BARELY managing to defeat him in a fight. With the Crane School suitably shaken but assured that the last two opponents are children, they're shocked as Krillin wins his bout against Chiaotzu. Kakarot violates Panput with ease. However, the major change here is Jackie Chun vs. Mercenary Tao. Considering Tao is fairly cocky and is limited from weapons, combined with Roshi being stronger due to raising Kakarot, Jackie Chun has motivation to legitimately win, knocking Tao down for the count. Meaning everything is riding on Tenshinhan, the last pupil of the Crane School in the tournament.

Knowing Tenshinhan wouldn't exactly pull through against Kakarot, especially so given how Tenshinhan brutalized Yamcha after barely pulling out his win, Jackie Chun spares Tenshinhan the beating by taking him down in the ring, delivering his same message to Tenshinhan that he did to Kakarot. With Kakarot and Krillin going down how it had in canon, it comes to a final rematch between Jackie Chun and Kakarot wherein Kakarot wins in a legitimate fight, having studied and improved upon Roshi's moves. However, his master unveils himself after tearing off his wig, explaining why he'd chosen to disguise himself. Kakarot takes it to heart--registering how cockiness could wreck him in the future had he not been careful. He'd been so used to being the top dog that during the Red Ribbon Army saga, he and his friends almost died against the androids. Even now, having beaten his grandfather in combat, he needs to improve.

Much like in canon, the Crane Hermit begins to absolutely COME DOWN on Tien, even worse than in canon due to losing to his brother, resulting in a swift combined blast from Krillin and Kakarot. Despite how Tenshinhan had harmed his best friend, Kakarot couldn't let that stand. But, when Yamcha comes back from the hospital with an understanding yet cautious stance, they decide to invite Tenshinhan and Chiaotzu to the dinner table. But, like the forgetful young man he is, Kakarot forgot his power pole. Considering how hard everyone had fought, Roshi decides to do his grandson a favor. Standing up from the table, he waltzes on off to go collect his things. But as time passes, they grow worried. And decide to investigate.

Kakarot, upon seeing his downed grandfather, explodes into a rage no one had seen before. A golden rage. I only posit Kakarot transforming into a Super Saiyan due to his connection. Kakarot has never experienced loss before. He's never lost his grandfather, only briefly flirting with death, only to reassert himself--against the Androids, battling Pilaf, in controlling his Oozaru state, he always came out swinging. But now, with his grandpa dead on the floor, he explodes into Super Saiyan, frightening those around him. I will continue this at a later date, perhaps in a doc I link here? I don't want to make this too long.

[Steven Bloodriver]

What if Master Roshi had found and then Adopted Kakarot or Son Goku instead of Grandpa Son Gohan?

I suppose a great number of things could change! Goku's power would be pretty easily curbed since Roshi could shove Oozaru Goku into the water and off the island, chop off his tail, and raise Goku to not look at the sun. He'd also be raised in the Turtle Hermit school of martial arts from birth, meaning we have a far more disciplined and intelligent Goku! He'd have a different name as well, but it's also quite possible Roshi would salvage the pod Clark Kent style and let Goku know of his Saipan heritage. With a far more intelligent, practiced, and sunglasses--sporting Kakarot, what else would we have to deal with? One might think Goku would grow up pervy, but he doesn't really get the appeal in general throughout the series or why he should desire them, so he'd likely look at it as "my grandpa's weird obsession." Overall, less bumpkin-esque with more common sense but not to like genius levels.

When Dragon Ball starts, Kakarot would meet Bulma and Grandpa Gohan after they rescued Turtle. Considering Grandpa Gohan is a friend of Roshi, Roshi would hand over the Dragon Ball--and tell Kakarot to join the pair on the journey, as there's only so much Kakarot could really do on Roshi's island. After that, quite a bit of early Dragon Ball goes the same or improves in general, Yamcha is encountered, handily beaten, and invited by Gohan into the group. Pilaf gets whooped. Difference is, Goku joins up with Yamcha and Gohan in flying off to West City after Pilaf's Wish is foiled by a controlled Oozaru Kakarot. Of course, this means Kakarot doesn't train with Krillin at all, since he's off with Gohan and Yamcha--Kakarot's new best friend bond forms with Yamcha instead! Krillin does still end up training with Muten Roshi as a result of the master's warmed heart after raising Kakarot though. He misses his grandson.

Yamcha grows in leaps and bounds sparring against Kakarot and Gohan, meaning by the time of the tournament, Yamcha is at the level of Goku and Krillin from canon in the 21st Tenkaichi Budokai. But in the end, Jackie Chun ends up defeating the group as a whole, teaching Kakarot his lesson regarding consistently stronger opponents. Without the urge to collect the Dragon Balls, Kakarot doesn't head off after the fourth ball, meaning the Red Ribbon Army is free to continue collecting them without care. Instead, the gang decides to split off on their own to train once more. This may lead into one of the group running into the Red Ribbon Army, meaning that at one point or another, the Red Ribbon Army will be annihilated. Perhaps Bulma notices the balls beginning to converge? In any case, Gero grows a hatred for Kakarot, Yamcha, Krillin, etc.

Mercenary Tao is never hired by the army due to the lack of competition they had in the initial hunt, meaning Tenshinhan has no motivation to hate Kakarot or Turtle School initiates. Bora doesn't die, no one goes to Korin's Tower (yet anyway), or meet Baba. But after the Red Ribbon Army is destroyed, Roshi and Gohan suggest Korin Tower after they barely scrape out a win against a completed Android 8 and the remaining Red Ribbon members. Kakarot, Krillin, and Yamcha undergo what Goku had in canon, all reaching his level or above considering they had to learn to work together as a trio to take Korin down. With a new bond cultivated with the newcomer Krillin after the Red Ribbon arc and Korin's training, the three Turtle School students continue their hard work, and move on to the 22nd Tenkaichi Budokai.

The 22nd Tenkaichi Budokai's lineup is far different. Kakarot, Krillin, Yamcha, Tenshinhan, Chiaotzu, Tao, Panput and Jackie Chun enter and continue onward. Yamcha and Tenshinhan scrap as per usual, with Tien BARELY managing to defeat him in a fight. With the Crane School suitably shaken but assured that the last two opponents are children, they're shocked as Krillin wins his bout against Chiaotzu. Kakarot violates Panput with ease. However, the major change here is Jackie Chun vs. Mercenary Tao. Considering Tao is fairly cocky and is limited from weapons, combined with Roshi being stronger due to raising Kakarot, Jackie Chun has motivation to legitimately win, knocking Tao down for the count. Meaning everything is riding on Tenshinhan, the last pupil of the Crane School in the tournament.

Knowing Tenshinhan wouldn't exactly pull through against Kakarot, especially so given how Tenshinhan brutalized Yamcha after barely pulling out his win, Jackie Chun spares Tenshinhan the beating by taking him down in the ring, delivering his same message to Tenshinhan that he did to Kakarot. With Kakarot and Krillin going down how it had in canon, it comes to a final rematch between Jackie Chun and Kakarot wherein Kakarot wins in a legitimate fight, having studied and improved upon Roshi's moves. However, his master unveils himself after tearing off his wig, explaining why he'd chosen to disguise himself. Kakarot takes it to heart--registering how cockiness could wreck him in the future had he not been careful. He'd been so used to being the top dog that during the Red Ribbon Army saga, he and his friends almost died against the androids. Even now, having beaten his grandfather in combat, he needs to improve.

Much like in canon, the Crane Hermit begins to absolutely COME DOWN on Tien, even worse than in canon due to losing to his brother, resulting in a swift combined blast from Krillin and Kakarot. Despite how Tenshinhan had harmed his best friend, Kakarot couldn't let that stand. But, when Yamcha comes back from the hospital with an understanding yet cautious stance, they decide to invite Tenshinhan and Chiaotzu to the dinner table. But, like the forgetful young man he is, Kakarot forgot his power pole. Considering how hard everyone had fought, Roshi decides to do his grandson a favor. Standing up from the table, he waltzes on off to go collect his things. But as time passes, they grow worried. And decide to investigate.

Kakarot, upon seeing his downed grandfather, explodes into a rage no one had seen before. A golden rage. I only posit Kakarot transforming into a Super Saiyan due to his connection. Kakarot has never experienced loss before. He's never lost his grandfather, only briefly flirting with death, only to reassert himself--against the Androids, battling Pilaf, in controlling his Oozaru state, he always came out swinging. But now, with his grandpa dead on the floor, he explodes into Super Saiyan, frightening those around him. I will continue this at a later date, perhaps in a doc I link here? I don't want to make this too long.

Thank you very much, Son Tao. For the very interesting read, but I think that Master Roshi might have been able to defeat Tambourine if Master Roshi had been able to go all-out against Tambourine.

[King Bogo]

What if Reacoom a.k.a Recoome was the last remaining Tsufuru-jin of Universe 7?

[Hellspawn28]

What if they used the Black Star Dragon Balls to kill Buu in the buu saga?

[coola]

What if all Z Warriors survive Nappa and Vegeta attack, our heroes don't go to Namek, Vegeta dies on Namek (By either Ginyu Force or Nail) Freeza kills every Namekian and destroys Namek unable to get immortality, his next target is Earth, will Z Warriors be able to defeat Freeza? (Assuming they were warned by Kaio-sama?)

[SonTao]

What if they used the Black Star Dragon Balls to kill Buu in the buu saga?

Well, that'd be a bit drastic, but things would get WORSE fast. So, the Black Star DBs annihilate Majin Buu. We're assuming Fat Buu here. With Fat Buu dead, we're off to the space races, boys and girls! Since Piccolo could explain that the Earth will blow up if they don't find em, the gang could just. Use the Earth Dragon Balls to wish them back to the Earth? Goku goes back to Otherworld, Gohan doesn't get Mystic, and Majin Vegeta might still be alive.

The problem being, everyone is significantly weaker. Without learning fusion or really getting to see the peak of Buu's power, the training is kinda lack luster. Sure, Goku might show SSJ3 to Vegeta after Buu is gone, but he can't really attain that power unless he goes to Otherworld.

Come time for BoG, Gohan can't even last a second against Beerus, Vegeta's rage is far lesser, and the resulting SSG is a tad weaker. Things might go well from here... for a while. But, come time for Moro, everyone is screwed. Why? No Uub. No massive amount of Genki. Also, the GSK is gone with Buu. And that's the MAXIMUM they could actually progress to. With Goku permanently iced, a great many things could change. Plus, with the Black Star Balls known to the world, what if Frieza's soldiers managed to use them to revive Frieza, knowing the side effects would distract the Z Fighters? Would the U6 arc, with Goku gone, mean Hit or Vegeta would get their body stolen by Black? Would Vegeta and Trunks alone be enough to stop Black using Vegeta's body? Would Gohan be capable of building his strength back up in time?

Overall, the Z Fighters might be doomed. By copping out with the Black Star Balls, they undermine their ability to grow. Gohan is free to return to a life of study, only for it to likely get stolen away by Frieza, Black, or death via Tournament of Power. That's not even to include the possibility that the Regular dragon balls might bring forth the Shadow Dragons, if we really want to merge in GT elements.

[Kappa]

What if Broly fused with Goten?

[SonTao]

What if Broly fused with Goten?

This could go one of many ways. But to make it more interesting? Let's set some ground rules.

Original Z timeline. Potara rules are still permanent fusion. This occurs post EoZ. Broly returns one last time, and with Goku indisposed (likely in the HTC with Uub to train) and the LSSJ even stronger than before, even Gohan and Vegeta struggle to combat the Saiyan. In order to try and circumvent this, the Kai bring about another pair of Potara. It is a hard choice though--Vegeta and Gohan plan to sacrifice their personal lives to save the world! However, Broly interrupts mid prep (Goten and Trunks can't stall for too long) and knocks them away! With the tables turned, Trunks and Goten decide to use the Potara in order to form a stronger Gotenks, maybe stall Broly long enough for Gohan and Vegeta to recover, take their Potara, and fuse as well. Goten manages to get one of the earrings on, and tosses Trunks one of the earrings.

But by pure happenstance. Pure COINCIDENCE. Broly attacks Trunks next in his blind rage, expecting the two are planning something. Trunks, with the unlatched earring in his hand, absentmindedly swings it toward Broly. Stabbing it into the ear opposite to Goten's. In the entirety of the Dragon Ball Multiverse, this is a one in infinity chance. The pure amount of coincidences required to produce this outcome are innumerable. And yet, it occurs anyway. Broly and Goten are drawn together, fusing into one being.

For starters, it's an equal fusion of both personalities becoming one guy. And now, it's a being with some form of bipolar disorder. So desperate to kill one of his... half-fathers? And destroy his... half-family? It's mind-rending, and Broten launches himself into deep space in order to get himself far away from the Earth. Luckily for all involved, this doesn't exactly make the problem FAR MORE insurmountable. While Goten was training, he wouldn't be stronger than GT Goten. He was clearly somewhat of a slacker to some extent. So, maybe... a cup of water added to the bucket? Still one hell of a lot of power, but doesn't really make the problem intensely worse. What DOES fuck it up, though, is the added life, relationships, and personify of Son Goten being added into Broly. Neither one is dominant. They're one man now. Merged into one. Loving, and hating, his own father and family, his best friend. Broten flies off to another world in order to calm himself.

On an empty planet, Broten slowly comes to a calmness. With Goten's memories and life mixed into Broly, the trigger of Kakarot is lessened. It's like, suddenly having somewhat of a coping mechanism for trauma. Additionally, Goten's control over his power provides a base level of stability, and compassion--contrasting heavily with Z Broly. Broten has intrusive thoughts and manic states, essentially. Base Broly was a placid individual after all. Calm until Goku was brought to him. Broten would eventually be approached by the Z Fighters--likely Goku and Vegeta (after some period of training HTC or not) in order to combat or pacify Broten. After explaining his predicament, the first idea is to gather the Dragon Balls in order to assert Goten's personality over Brolys. However, this fails--Broten is a merging, not a flesh mech with pilots. The aftermath could take years, but Broten would need INTENSE, ACTUAL therapy. He'd likely live on Kami's Lookout or the abandoned planet, or wherever Broten found. Trunks would be a frequent visitor, but he couldn't really be around others or he'd likely kill them in an episode.

In terms of training? Broten would not, whatsoever. Broly never had to, growing passive. Goten barely trained at all. And with the constant worrying about killing his friends... frenemy... enemies? It's weird for Broten, and he'd likely spend most of his time eating his problems away like a real Saiyan, trying to meditate, blowing things up, or trying to play video games. None of which are enjoyable as the composite personality heavily conflicts due to it's sources. Broten is a depressed, incredibly powerful entity.

Worst case scenario here? Broten might go on a rampage, and either die himself, or kill his friends. Maybe he'd self destruct from his sheer energy. He'd be wise to fusion tactics so it might not go well for Goku and the others unless they had powered up FAR beyond Broten.

Best case? Through years of therapy, Broten resolves his internal conflicts, and returns to Earth. Distanced somewhat from his half family, trying to make his way through the world without accidentally transforming or wigging out.


In the Dragon Ball Super scenario of this, Broly and Goten have a silly metamoran fusion or potato fusion that ends within the time limit but might be chaotic by adding immense power to a teenager's nature. No consequences.