Non-thread-worthy discussions

[Dragon Ball Ireland]

Fukanaga infamously had to beg Toei to let them just do Z after the first thirteen underperformed

It's also never been proven the first 13 episodes underperformed. A toy line was planned, pre-production for a further 13 episodes was complete and by all accounts the VHS tapes were widely available in stores, many fans recall seeing it air, so without any hard ratings data the evidence doesn't support the BLT dub not doing well. It's more likely due to poor timeslots the dub was at a disadvantage and was never going to perform to its full potential.

I suspect part of the reason Fukanaga begged TOEI to let Funimation skip to Z is because they wanted to get out of a bad deal with SeaGull because Saban, who were a bigger name could offer them better timeslots and merchandising opportunities but were more interested in Z because it was more the kind of show they were interested in promoting.

This of course doesn't excuse Funimation's history of negligence for original Dragon Ball but it's a better explanation for why they skipped 140 episodes than the "poor ratings" narrative that's always thrown around.

[MasenkoHA]

Fukanaga infamously had to beg Toei to let them just do Z after the first thirteen underperformed

It's also never been proven the first 13 episodes underperformed. A toy line was planned, pre-production for a further 13 episodes was complete and by all accounts the VHS tapes were widely available in stores, many fans recall seeing it air, so without any hard ratings data the evidence doesn't support the BLT dub not doing well. It's more likely due to poor timeslots the dub was at a disadvantage and was never going to perform to its full potential.

I suspect part of the reason Fukanaga begged TOEI to let Funimation skip to Z is because they wanted to get out of a bad deal with SeaGull because Saban, who were a bigger name could offer them better timeslots and merchandising opportunities but were more interested in Z because it was more the kind of show they were interested in promoting.

This of course doesn't excuse Funimation's history of negligence for original Dragon Ball but it's a better explanation for why they skipped 140 episodes than the "poor ratings" narrative that's always thrown around.

The fact that they were able to convince Toei to let then skip ahead to Dragon Ball Z and that they decided to go with Saban to get better timeslots would indicate that it didn't get the rating Funimation, Bandai, and Toei wanted. In other words...it underperformed. It not doing great in the ratings doesn't mean literally nobody saw it just that not enough people saw it. And the VHS tapes were getting released shortly after Dragon Ball Z debuted viewtopic.php?t=11569 a lot of fans probably were exposed to the BLT dub via the VHS tapes or the DVD release (that came out like 7 months before Funimation started releasing their in house dub of original Dragon Ball) unfortunately that would have been AFTER Funimation had abandoned the show for Z.


And just to reiterate it didn't do as well as the companies wanted it to=/= nobody saw it

[Dragon Ball Ireland]

The fact that they were able to convince Toei to let then skip ahead to Dragon Ball Z and that they decided to go with Saban to get better timeslots would indicate that it didn't get the rating Funimation, Bandai, and Toei wanted. In other words...it underperformed.

Even if we assume it underperformed it was inevitable considering the reports of it airing at like 5am. BLT Dragon Ball most certainly would have done better if it had the right timeslots and promotion (and clearly SeaGull didn't do as much as Saban did for Z, but in theory they could have tried to push it harder).

And TOEI would have let any company skip ahead to Dragon Ball Z. In fact Funimation didn't even set that precedent. In the Philippines the Creative Corp Products dub started with Z following a trip the company's owner William Co took to Thailand where he spotted a poster in the backseat of a friend's car who informed him the show was "Asia's number one cartoon series" and tracked down the Hong Kong licensor for TOEI Animation who gave him the license.

Sure TOEI probably asked a certain price for William Co to acquire Dragon Ball Z to dub to air on RPN9, but clearly because his company must have paid it as they were allowed to go ahead before they even started original Dragon Ball.

And the VHS tapes were getting released shortly after Dragon Ball Z debuted viewtopic.php?t=11569 a lot of fans probably were exposed to the BLT dub via the VHS tapes or the DVD release (that came out like 7 months before Funimation started releasing their in house dub of original Dragon Ball) unfortunately that would have been AFTER Funimation had abandoned the show for Z.

I'll concede I was wrong about the VHS tapes being available when Dragon Ball was first on TV. I also think the fact the rights to those episodes were tied up by Kidmark for so long supports the theory that Funimation had a bad deal going and were trying to get out of it. A new show (albeit the direct sequel) was Funimation's perfect excuse for a clean slate with a new distributor.

[MasenkoHA]

[
]

Even if we assume it underperformed it was inevitable considering the reports of it airing at like 5am. BLT Dragon Ball most certainly would have done better if it had the right timeslots and promotion (and clearly SeaGull didn't do as much as Saban did for Z, but in theory they could have tried to push it harder).

Right, but never once did I claim it underperformed simply for being Dragon Ball (in fact I often argued the opposite). Obviously we know WHY it didn't do well, doesn't change the fact that it didn't do well and Funimation made the decision to skip ahead to Dragon Ball Z.

And TOEI would have let any company skip ahead to Dragon Ball Z. In fact Funimation didn't even set that precedent. In the Philippines the Creative Corp Products dub started with Z following a trip the company's owner William Co took to Thailand where he spotted a poster in the backseat of a friend's car who informed him the show was "Asia's number one cartoon series" and tracked down the Hong Kong licensor for TOEI Animation who gave him the license.

Again, "I had to beg Toei to let me skip ahead to Dragon Ball Z" came straight from Fukanaga. It might not have been a rule Toei applied too all their licensees but it was evidently a rule Funimation had to abide by, until Fukanaga convinced Toei otherwise

I'll concede I was wrong about the VHS tapes being available when Dragon Ball was first on TV. I also think the fact the rights to those episodes were tied up by Kidmark for so long supports the theory that Funimation had a bad deal going and were trying to get out of it. A new show (albeit the direct sequel) was Funimation's perfect excuse for a clean slate with a new distributor.

Kidmark only had the home video rights to the first thirteen episodes and the first movie. They didn't need to skip ahead to DBZ to get out of a bad contract. They could have just gone with another home video distributor for the remaining 140 epsiodes. Kidmark's long hold on those episodes 100 percent had nothing to do with the decision to go to Dragon Ball Z.

[Dragon ball master]

Why did harmony gold used sleeping princess clips in there opening there though they didn't dubbed movie 2

[MasenkoHA]

Why did harmony gold used sleeping princess clips in there opening there though they didn't dubbed movie 2

We don't have an official answer, as far as I know. My best guess isn't Harmony Gold didn't want to dub it for some reason (they thought it was too creepy for kids? Just plain didn't like the movie?) but since they had the rights to the movie they probably wanted to get some use out if it, so they inserted some of its clip to an opening that was otherwise just the second OP and used a still shot of Devil's Hand as an "After These Messages" eyecatch

[Noah]

In complete contrast, Rōshi groping No.18 in the Boo arc just because he could when she literally had her three-year old daughter in her arms... yeah, there was no joke there. That was just gross and wrong (though at least, that was the fault of the anime writers, not Toriyama, as that scene was not in the manga). I know he gets punished by getting smashed against the side of the plane by No. 18... but the way the scene is presented tries to play both that AND the literal sexual assault that precedes it as equally "comedic". FUCK that scene.

Even though I do agree with you it's a terrible scene, this falls flat to territory of people problematizing old shows like The Fresh Prince of Bel-Air (1990) and Friends (1994) with today's sight.

Not trying to defend these bad taste jokes, but at time nobody cared to discuss the matter so no point in doing so.

What we could discuss is that how in freaking 2017, Toei could fans (even the old school) would find funny Roshi sexually harassing Yurin?

[Cure Dragon 255]

Something Masenko Ha said has me thinking, Saban kept the halos unedited, but the "Other Dimension" thing conveniently removed theHeaven/Hell/Afterlife element, and since The CW (Much easier than saying 4kids/Saban Brands)dub used Other World and thus they felt the need to make clear to the audience the characters ARE NOT in Heaven/Hell/Afterlife.

[Dragon Ball Ireland]

Something Masenko Ha said has me thinking, Saban kept the halos unedited, but the "Other Dimension" thing conveniently removed theHeaven/Hell/Afterlife element, and since The CW (Much easier than saying 4kids/Saban Brands)dub used Other World and thus they felt the need to make clear to the audience the characters ARE NOT in Heaven/Hell/Afterlife.

I think the Ocean Studios cast's performances really helped elevate the whole "another dimension" thing, Brian Drummond had the charisma to make it sound threatening that I couldn't see any of the other English Vegetas being able to match. Jonathan Todd Ross managed to pull off something similar as his portrayal as Yami Marik in the 4Kids Yu-Gi-Oh dub, always making "Shadow Realm" feel a bit more sinister. "Other World" is a fine way of dancing around death, it's more generic and harder to screw up in the recording booth. As a line or adaptation choice it works better because its not an incorrect definition of what people would perceive an afterlife to be.

The Blue Water dubs had a clever way around using "Hell" using the term "underworld" or "Hades", which was a clever way around it, especially because the latter is a common substitute, and has a nice ring to it. If not "Hell" isn't too risky, it's used in pop songs all the time, even on daytime radio. Allegedly Ocean Kai used it too. In fact, Hades wouldn't feel out of place in an uncut dub because it has darker connotations and basically means the same thing as Hell so it's a valid translation while still being TV-safe.

[Hellspawn28]

I wonder how long would have taken Funimation to dub DBZ if they didn't skip it and they dub the rest of DB in the mid 90s?

[Tian]

https://youtu.be/bAFlNHHV7kQ?si=WtRqqC_g2Ahs_wV1

I had no idea that the guys from Nicktoons did a behind the scenes promo with Schemmel.

[The Monkey King]

I find it mildly interesting that Vegito named himself instantly meanwhile Gogeta had to think of a name, maybe it's because Vegito was already taken.

[Grimlock]

I find that moment to be a waste of opportunity to establish some lore that has been "plaguing" Dragon Ball for some time. It's kind of annoying when something is right there, we can see it, we can touch it, we can smell it, but it is never addressed.

[Banduck]

I noticed something weird in the Saiyan arc.
In episode 10, the narrator says there are 11 months left until the saiyans arrive. In this episode, Bulma and Krillin find Yamcha and then go looking for Tenshinhan.
In episode 12, the narrator says there are only 9 months left until the arrival. It's only in this episode that Krillin and Bulma finally find Tenshinhan. That means they've been searching for him for 2 months...? Krillin and Yamcha could've used that time for training instead.

[ZeroNeonix]

Let's be real. Those two months wouldn't have made them any more useful. lol

[Koitsukai]

I was just watching Piccolo's scene after Geets blows himself up vs Buu, he says he is now fighting for others and this deserves his respect.

By now Piccolo respects everybody I guess, but did Yamcha or Chaozu ever do something to earn Piccolo's respect, like Vegeta did?
I assume he respected Tenshinhan's sacrifice vs Nappa (if not, then after he saved his ass vs 2nd form Cell), and he respects Krillin since they fought in the 23rd TB... but Yamcha screwed up and died against a fucking saibaimen, Piccolo didn't even want to train with them at Kaio sama's*, Yamcha was shit-scared vs Mecha Freeza and also when they heard about the new threat, and he was laughable vs the androids, after that he retired.
Chaozu's sacrifice vs Nappa could also earned him Piccolo's respect, but Yamcha has nothing going on for him.

*One could argue Yamcha earned his respect when they all defeated him at Kaio's, but IIRC, that was filler.

[MasenkoHA]

I was just watching Piccolo's scene after Geets blows himself up vs Buu, he says he is now fighting for others and this deserves his respect.

By now Piccolo respects everybody I guess, but did Yamcha or Chaozu ever do something to earn Piccolo's respect, like Vegeta did?
I assume he respected Tenshinhan's sacrifice vs Nappa (if not, then after he saved his ass vs 2nd form Cell), and he respects Krillin since they fought in the 23rd TB... but Yamcha screwed up and died against a fucking saibaimen, Piccolo didn't even want to train with them at Kaio sama's*, Yamcha was shit-scared vs Mecha Freeza and also when they heard about the new threat, and he was laughable vs the androids, after that he retired.
Chaozu's sacrifice vs Nappa could also earned him Piccolo's respect, but Yamcha has nothing going on for him.

*One could argue Yamcha earned his respect when they all defeated him at Kaio's, but IIRC, that was filler.

Does Piccolo respect Yamucha and Chaozu? Or does he just have no ill will towards them because he likes Gohan.

I feel like Piccolo just likes the Son family (and mostly just Gohan) and everyone else is just there.

He might like Krillin too but I think everyone else just hangs out in the same social circle that he does.

[ZeroNeonix]

Respecting someone and liking them are two different things. For instance, Dr. Eggman respects Sonic the Hedgehog as his capable adversary, but he hates that hedgehog. I doubt many characters respect Yamcha. lol

[TobyS]

I was just watching Piccolo's scene after Geets blows himself up vs Buu, he says he is now fighting for others and this deserves his respect.

By now Piccolo respects everybody I guess, but did Yamcha or Chaozu ever do something to earn Piccolo's respect, like Vegeta did?
I assume he respected Tenshinhan's sacrifice vs Nappa (if not, then after he saved his ass vs 2nd form Cell), and he respects Krillin since they fought in the 23rd TB... but Yamcha screwed up and died against a fucking saibaimen, Piccolo didn't even want to train with them at Kaio sama's*, Yamcha was shit-scared vs Mecha Freeza and also when they heard about the new threat, and he was laughable vs the androids, after that he retired.
Chaozu's sacrifice vs Nappa could also earned him Piccolo's respect, but Yamcha has nothing going on for him.

*One could argue Yamcha earned his respect when they all defeated him at Kaio's, but IIRC, that was filler.

Vegeta respected Chaozu for blowing himself up vs nappa and piccolo was easier to please, probably respected his bravery in trying to stop king Piccolo too.

Kami respected yamcha as someone who impressed him at the 23rd and surpassed him training for the saiyans. He was scared but showed up to fight freeza, the androids and cell despite being scared.

Piccolo would respect him.

[WittyUsername]

It’s not like Piccolo has any reason to dislike Yamcha, especially after he and Kami became one again.