Is the Ultimate state/form the result of a God-like ability/power up?

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Desassina
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Is the Ultimate state/form the result of a God-like ability/power up?

Post by Desassina » Sun Mar 29, 2020 5:26 am

It's quite different than Goku and Vegeta training in base to get control of God-like power since they can transform on top. Gohan changes with Super Saiyan below or to the side of it, and the Elder Kaioshin tells him to get the gist of transformation, without pouring Ki into his ability (i.e. akin to using force or a fighting spirit). That is not God power, since Gohan can still be sensed, but the ability itself might be God-like. Kaioshins conceal their Ki, but if when during transformation, the Super Saiyans' aura showed, then it did not with Ultimate at first, because Gohan powers up with one otherwise. That is the parallel that I'm tracing.

Here's an image to get you inspired for discussion:

Image
Chapter: 496 (DBZ 302), P4.1-2
Gohan: "Ho-how can I turn into this mightiest of warriors!?"
Elder Kaioshin: "You transform into that Super whatever-it-is a lot, right? You'll be fine if you just get the gist of that, and throw in a kiai."
Gohan: "The gist of Super Saiyan... I-I got it...!"
And let me remind you that Goku could have his power unlocked too, although the Elder Kaioshin suggested this when he had God forms, which was ignored due to the time that it would take.

This is an extra question to you for the hypotheses: had Goku's power been unlocked and gone past the God forms', could it be sensed by others when SSG/B cannot, since it would assume his regular looking form?

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Re: Is the Ultimate state/form the result of a God-like ability/power up?

Post by Lionel » Sun Mar 29, 2020 9:00 am

Wasn't it established as being the by-product of the witch whom Elder Kaioshin fused with? I doubt she was a celestial being like the Kaioshins are. The original youthful Kaioshin's nature may have influenced the properties of the ability in some way but I doubt it's of the same typology as god ki.

Similarly, the Choshinsui was characterised as being mystical but all it did was unlock Goku's power after he underwent its intended trial.

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Re: Is the Ultimate state/form the result of a God-like ability/power up?

Post by Desassina » Sun Mar 29, 2020 10:50 am

I would like to call to attention that I'm not talking about the Elder Kaioshin's ability to unlock somebody's potential, but Gohan's ability to increase his power without transforming by changing state, because it couldn't be used to the Kaioshin's own benefit in spite of it being handed by him. When I say that it's God-like, I'm not talking about God power, something that Dai Kaioshin achieved before he gave it away, for example, but the ability to conceal it as it grows as shown in Goku and Vegeta's training or SSB's completion.

The unlocking ritual is mystical alright, but Gohan's Ki is still that of a mortal, in spite of its headstart being invisible/auraless. My comparison was due to Shin-jins ascending from Kaio to Kaioshins with their power concealed. Zamasu was still training to become one and he allowed his to leak. God power can be unleashed after it goes through the process of maturing inside of someone. That could be the reason for Dai Kaioshin, whose nature is that of a God and his Ki that of a Shin-jin, to have lost the power that was hidden.

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Re: Is the Ultimate state/form the result of a God-like ability/power up?

Post by theherodjl » Sun Mar 29, 2020 4:16 pm

Doesn't any skilled Ki-user have the ability to mask their Ki so that no one can sense how strong they really are?
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Re: Is the Ultimate state/form the result of a God-like ability/power up?

Post by DragonBallFoodie » Sun Mar 29, 2020 5:42 pm

Ultimate is beyond god power I think.
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Re: Is the Ultimate state/form the result of a God-like ability/power up?

Post by Desassina » Sun Mar 29, 2020 6:01 pm

theherodjl wrote: Sun Mar 29, 2020 4:16 pm Doesn't any skilled Ki-user have the ability to mask their Ki so that no one can sense how strong they really are?
Do you mean suppression? Isn't that to lower one's power? I thought that I was talking about improving it within like SSB complete.
DragonBallFoodie wrote: Sun Mar 29, 2020 5:42 pm Ultimate is beyond god power I think.
I believe that it was beyond his mortal limit. In surpassing it, he could have achieved the power of a God, but not gone beyond it I think.

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Re: Is the Ultimate state/form the result of a God-like ability/power up?

Post by theherodjl » Sun Mar 29, 2020 7:12 pm

Desassina wrote: Sun Mar 29, 2020 6:01 pmDo you mean suppression? Isn't that to lower one's power? I thought that I was talking about improving it within like SSB complete.
I'm a little confused. Are you talking about mastering ordinary Ki so that it cannot be sensed and is tranquil even at full power?
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Re: Is the Ultimate state/form the result of a God-like ability/power up?

Post by Desassina » Sun Mar 29, 2020 7:39 pm

I don't remember when that happened. I'm curious now. Seriously.

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Re: Is the Ultimate state/form the result of a God-like ability/power up?

Post by Hugo Boss » Sun Mar 29, 2020 10:09 pm

I think this is just a magical ability. Like Babidi or Moro type. It doesn’t seem like it’s related to god power at all. If Goku underwent that process, perhaps he would reach Ultra Instinct without that much of a toll.

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