Dragon Ball and AI in voice acting
Moderators: General Help, Kanzenshuu Staff
-
- I Live Here
- Posts: 3598
- Joined: Thu May 21, 2015 9:09 am
- Location: Sligo, Ireland
Dragon Ball and AI in voice acting
So with the news that Alejandro Graue, the voice of Broly in the Argentinan dub of Dragon Ball Super Broly is being replaced by an AI (artificial intelligence) voice what are everyone's thoughts on such technology being used in future Dragon Ball dubs?
I personally sympathise with all the voice actors who are potentially going to lose work because of it. I could see TOEI using it as a way around needing to recast Goku if, God forbid, Nozawa can no longer do it, although I'd still be sad to see this happen.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2wrBjrKXQVY
I personally sympathise with all the voice actors who are potentially going to lose work because of it. I could see TOEI using it as a way around needing to recast Goku if, God forbid, Nozawa can no longer do it, although I'd still be sad to see this happen.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2wrBjrKXQVY
Do you have any info about international non-English broadcasts about the Dragon Ball anime or manga translations/editions? Please message me. Researching for a future book with Dragon Ball scholar Derek Padula
Re: Dragon Ball and AI in voice acting
Oh goodie. Late stage capitalism.
Re: Dragon Ball and AI in voice acting
AI voice recreation is bad and dangerous technology and it is my hope that it is destroyed forever.
She/Her
progesterone princess, estradiol empress
bisexual milf
progesterone princess, estradiol empress
bisexual milf
- ABED
- Namekian Warrior
- Posts: 20282
- Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2013 10:23 am
- Location: Skippack, PA
- Contact:
Re: Dragon Ball and AI in voice acting
It's not a bad technology. It can be used poorly, though.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take - Wayne Gretzky" - Michael Scott
Happiness is climate, not weather.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take - Wayne Gretzky" - Michael Scott
Happiness is climate, not weather.
- PurestEvil
- I'm, pretty, cozy, here...
- Posts: 1948
- Joined: Tue Nov 24, 2020 2:34 pm
- Location: Constantinopolee!
Re: Dragon Ball and AI in voice acting
It has a market economy, so no.
Apart from the hypothetical possibility of this AI program rendering voice actors obsolete and phasing them out, what is dangerous about it? Identity theft? Creating misinformation?
This post was brought to you by 魔族
Rest in Peace, Toriyama-san
Rest in Peace, Toriyama-san
- VegettoEX
- Kanzenshuu Co-Owner & Administrator
- Posts: 17547
- Joined: Sat Jan 10, 2004 3:10 pm
- Location: New Jersey
- Contact:
Re: Dragon Ball and AI in voice acting
Can we get a little background on this specific example for the non-native speakers (e.g., me!)? I don't know what the situation is with Alejandro Graue, and a super fast Google search didn't tick any lightbulbs for me.
Have they retired? Unfortunately passed away? (Dare we say, another Broly sex pest? Certainly hope to Dende not!)
What about this role in particular, versus other roles in the series, has made the producers go this route?
I'm definitely of two (very unequal) minds on this. I have that part of me that absolutely believes in technology and the human ingenuity that both creates and propels it, while at the same time I love art of all types and believe in the sometimes-intangible quality of a "real" human creation (in this case, performance).
Would love to get a little more information here. Thanks!
Have they retired? Unfortunately passed away? (Dare we say, another Broly sex pest? Certainly hope to Dende not!)
What about this role in particular, versus other roles in the series, has made the producers go this route?
I'm definitely of two (very unequal) minds on this. I have that part of me that absolutely believes in technology and the human ingenuity that both creates and propels it, while at the same time I love art of all types and believe in the sometimes-intangible quality of a "real" human creation (in this case, performance).
Would love to get a little more information here. Thanks!
:: [| Mike "VegettoEX" LaBrie |] ::
:: [| Kanzenshuu - Co-Founder/Administrator, Podcast Host, News Manager (note: our "job" titles are arbitrary and meaningless) |] ::
:: [| Website: January 1998 |] :: [| Podcast: November 2005 |] :: [| Fusion: April 2012 |] :: [| Wiki: 20XX |] ::
:: [| Kanzenshuu - Co-Founder/Administrator, Podcast Host, News Manager (note: our "job" titles are arbitrary and meaningless) |] ::
:: [| Website: January 1998 |] :: [| Podcast: November 2005 |] :: [| Fusion: April 2012 |] :: [| Wiki: 20XX |] ::
Re: Dragon Ball and AI in voice acting
So does China.
Anyway I don't think the use of A.I. is inherently bad, but I feel it should only be used to assist not replace. This is definitely pretty messed up and they really should have just recast him.
Raditz did nothing wrong
- PurestEvil
- I'm, pretty, cozy, here...
- Posts: 1948
- Joined: Tue Nov 24, 2020 2:34 pm
- Location: Constantinopolee!
Re: Dragon Ball and AI in voice acting
Why yes, China is a capitalist country as well. They dropped its Marxist pretenses by the turn of the 21st century, with the exception of certain national symbols. Argentina doesn't even pretend to be socialist.
This has absolutely nothing to do with the topic at hand, though, so I'll stop myself from protracting this argument now.
This post was brought to you by 魔族
Rest in Peace, Toriyama-san
Rest in Peace, Toriyama-san
Re: Dragon Ball and AI in voice acting
All of the above, and then some. What you can do with a deepfake ranges from pornography to blackmail.PurestEvil wrote: ↑Wed Jan 11, 2023 4:36 pmApart from the hypothetical possibility of this AI program rendering voice actors obsolete and phasing them out, what is dangerous about it? Identity theft? Creating misinformation?
- M16U3L2015
- Not-So-Newbie
- Posts: 54
- Joined: Thu Jan 27, 2022 2:57 pm
Re: Dragon Ball and AI in voice acting
Apparently a company used an AI with his voice to do a Voice Over in a documentary. The company did it to reduce costs. They did it without his permissionVegettoEX wrote: ↑Wed Jan 11, 2023 4:43 pm Can we get a little background on this specific example for the non-native speakers (e.g., me!)? I don't know what the situation is with Alejandro Graue, and a super fast Google search didn't tick any lightbulbs for me.
Have they retired? Unfortunately passed away? (Dare we say, another Broly sex pest? Certainly hope to Dende not!)
What about this role in particular, versus other roles in the series, has made the producers go this route?
Would love to get a little more information here. Thanks!
Re: Dragon Ball and AI in voice acting
Voice actors make money by just imitating previous actor's vocal creations without compensating the original actors or their families for decades. I think AI basically doing the same falls in the same category, with the difference that the "actor" is digital.
Taking US voice acting as an example, Disney got in a bit of trouble with this in the 90's. That's when Jim Cumming did his uncanny imitation of Louis Prima's voice (Jazz musician who performed the part of King Louis in Jungle Book) for Tale Spin.
Prima's widow was not happy with this and sued Disney. As a result Disney had to basically retire the character until they worked things out.
The blurry part is the question when it's a character you're imitating and when it's a person you're imitating. Prima is a great example since he wasn't really an actor and basically used his own voice.
Basically when it's a person you're imitating and it misleads the listener to think they're hearing the real celebrity, the real celebrity can take legal action. For example, if you make an ad with a clear parody of President Trump, you should be clear. If you make an ad with a voice over where ot isn't clear whether it's the real President Trump or not, you could very well get in trouble.
This is based on US law though so I don't know how it would apply in Japan. And this is purely from a legal stand point.
Ethically I would say that it's okay as well, since, as mentioned, voice actors have been using previous voice actors' work for decades without compensation to the originals who worked on crafting that specific voice for that character. Most of the times they created it while working for a company as hire so you could argue for example that the while Nozawa created the Goku voice, TOEI owns the "vocal design".
Taking US voice acting as an example, Disney got in a bit of trouble with this in the 90's. That's when Jim Cumming did his uncanny imitation of Louis Prima's voice (Jazz musician who performed the part of King Louis in Jungle Book) for Tale Spin.
Prima's widow was not happy with this and sued Disney. As a result Disney had to basically retire the character until they worked things out.
The blurry part is the question when it's a character you're imitating and when it's a person you're imitating. Prima is a great example since he wasn't really an actor and basically used his own voice.
Basically when it's a person you're imitating and it misleads the listener to think they're hearing the real celebrity, the real celebrity can take legal action. For example, if you make an ad with a clear parody of President Trump, you should be clear. If you make an ad with a voice over where ot isn't clear whether it's the real President Trump or not, you could very well get in trouble.
This is based on US law though so I don't know how it would apply in Japan. And this is purely from a legal stand point.
Ethically I would say that it's okay as well, since, as mentioned, voice actors have been using previous voice actors' work for decades without compensation to the originals who worked on crafting that specific voice for that character. Most of the times they created it while working for a company as hire so you could argue for example that the while Nozawa created the Goku voice, TOEI owns the "vocal design".
- TheGreatness25
- I Live Here
- Posts: 4929
- Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2007 9:36 am
Re: Dragon Ball and AI in voice acting
I feel like there's useful AI that can help advance medicine and figure out how to feed and clothe every child in the world, and then there's useless AI like replacing a voice actor. I know that we want to hear what we're familiar with, but I think it's more respectful to replace a voice actor with someone putting their heart and soul into living up to the role than just typing in a script for a lifeless machine to spit out in the same voice.
It's like, sure, I want Kevin Conroy as Batman. I will never think that anyone will live up to that performance. But that's because it was Kevin Conroy, not because nobody else can do a good job or because nobody else deserves to play the part. Would it make me feel better to know that Kevin Conroy was replaced by AI that sounds like him? No, because it's still not Kevin Conroy. It doesn't feel what he felt, prepare how he prepared, dive into itself the way he dove into himself. It'll just spit out anything you tell it to. It'll deliver an epic speech the same way it'll make fart jokes.
Anyway, we're gonna mess around and find ourselves living out the Terminator series.
It's like, sure, I want Kevin Conroy as Batman. I will never think that anyone will live up to that performance. But that's because it was Kevin Conroy, not because nobody else can do a good job or because nobody else deserves to play the part. Would it make me feel better to know that Kevin Conroy was replaced by AI that sounds like him? No, because it's still not Kevin Conroy. It doesn't feel what he felt, prepare how he prepared, dive into itself the way he dove into himself. It'll just spit out anything you tell it to. It'll deliver an epic speech the same way it'll make fart jokes.
Anyway, we're gonna mess around and find ourselves living out the Terminator series.
- Hellspawn28
- Patreon Supporter
- Posts: 15206
- Joined: Mon Sep 07, 2009 9:50 pm
- Location: Maryland, USA
Re: Dragon Ball and AI in voice acting
AI voice recrations sound like garbage, and can easily be spotted for fake. I doubt it will reach human level of voice acting. Same with AI art with it none of it being any good to reach human levels of art.
She/Her
PS5 username: Guyver_Spawn_27
LB Profile: https://letterboxd.com/Hellspawn28/
PS5 username: Guyver_Spawn_27
LB Profile: https://letterboxd.com/Hellspawn28/
-
- Beyond Newbie
- Posts: 131
- Joined: Fri Sep 24, 2021 4:37 pm
Re: Dragon Ball and AI in voice acting
I couldn’t hear the fakeness in the kenobi show.Hellspawn28 wrote: ↑Thu Jan 12, 2023 4:46 pmAI voice recrations sound like garbage, and can easily be spotted for fake. I doubt it will reach human level of voice acting. Same with AI art with it none of it being any good to reach human levels of art.
Re: Dragon Ball and AI in voice acting
Technology improves over time and it will eventually be used by the powerful in anyway possible to oppress the powerless.Hellspawn28 wrote: ↑Thu Jan 12, 2023 4:46 pmAI voice recrations sound like garbage, and can easily be spotted for fake. I doubt it will reach human level of voice acting. Same with AI art with it none of it being any good to reach human levels of art.
This is all putting aside things that affect me personally as a writer and someone who would love to be a filmmaker.
She/Her
progesterone princess, estradiol empress
bisexual milf
progesterone princess, estradiol empress
bisexual milf
- Hellspawn28
- Patreon Supporter
- Posts: 15206
- Joined: Mon Sep 07, 2009 9:50 pm
- Location: Maryland, USA
Re: Dragon Ball and AI in voice acting
The AI voices that I have seen still robotic. Like this one for example where it still sounds not real at all
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hRlo8_13Zyw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hRlo8_13Zyw
She/Her
PS5 username: Guyver_Spawn_27
LB Profile: https://letterboxd.com/Hellspawn28/
PS5 username: Guyver_Spawn_27
LB Profile: https://letterboxd.com/Hellspawn28/
-
- I Live Here
- Posts: 3598
- Joined: Thu May 21, 2015 9:09 am
- Location: Sligo, Ireland
Re: Dragon Ball and AI in voice acting
I'm not a native Spanish speaker either but received this link from someone I trust, so I'm inclined to think Alejandro Graue is a respectful person, unlike some other individuals in the industry we know of. You won't be able to just find information on this actor in English because he's from Latin America.VegettoEX wrote: ↑Wed Jan 11, 2023 4:43 pm Can we get a little background on this specific example for the non-native speakers (e.g., me!)? I don't know what the situation is with Alejandro Graue, and a super fast Google search didn't tick any lightbulbs for me.
Have they retired? Unfortunately passed away? (Dare we say, another Broly sex pest? Certainly hope to Dende not!)
Agreed, technology is wonderful but there is nothing more pure than an artist's creation.VegettoEX wrote: ↑Wed Jan 11, 2023 4:43 pm I'm definitely of two (very unequal) minds on this. I have that part of me that absolutely believes in technology and the human ingenuity that both creates and propels it, while at the same time I love art of all types and believe in the sometimes-intangible quality of a "real" human creation (in this case, performance).
Do you have any info about international non-English broadcasts about the Dragon Ball anime or manga translations/editions? Please message me. Researching for a future book with Dragon Ball scholar Derek Padula
- 8000 Saiyan
- I Live Here
- Posts: 2841
- Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2016 9:03 am
Re: Dragon Ball and AI in voice acting
Ugh, why? This is so unnecessary.
"It was deemed to be too awesome." - Scott McNeil on Dragon Ball Kai not being aired yet in Canada.
Re: Dragon Ball and AI in voice acting
give me AI generated Big Green cast for all the movies they didn't get to do pls