The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread

[Seekeroftruth]

Saitama vs SSG Goku



Stats:

Strength: Low end: Multi solar system level | High end: Multi galaxy level

Durability: Low end: Multi solar system level | High end: Multi galaxy level

Combat speed: Low end: MFTL+ | High end: Immeasurable with Toonforce

Skill and Intellect: Below Average human intellect with Genius level fighting and learning abilities

Techniques: A variety of punching techniques, namely from Normal Series, Serious Series, (and Potentially Death Series?) | Super leaps and flight | BFR with Serious Table Flip | Afterimage creation with Serious Series speed techniques, Monster Calamity God Slayer Fist (comes with a variety of qualities like energy projection, pressure point combat, shockwaves bypassing durability etc), Matter manipulation, Causality alteration and time travel with Zero Punch.

Hax resistance: Immune extreme levels of heat, cold, poisoning, cosmic and nuclear radiation, lack of air and other sustenance | Immune to means of bypassing physical durability such as piercing attacks, pressure point combat, acid, implosion and internal attacks. Immune energy, blood and spirit absorption and manipulation. Immune to mind corruption and psychic powers.

Limitless Growth: Saitama's growth has no cap because of the removed limiter. Though his passive growth is impressive enough for Saitama to easily beat his yesterday's self, when fighting seriously, he is capable of multiplying his existing power by a rapidly expanding factor with every punch even while fighting at MFTL+ speeds.

Potential Toonforce: Though Saitama being a Toonforce character has not been full-fledged or widely accepted, it is still a fact that Saitama possesses a variety of abilities currently impossible to explain in-verse. Whether or not one decides to accept them as actual Toonforce is up to an individual. The fact is, Saitama can freely ignore a selection of laws of physics, for example, sneeze and talk while outside of Earth's atmosphere, fart his way around solar system, move around cracks in spacetime as if they were objects, seemingly appear instantly wherever he chooses to be, bypass invisibility and intangibility, or affect, cross and damage other dimensions of reality, freely perceiving and interacting with spiritual entities if he chooses to, and more.


vs

SSG Goku

[Thani]

Goku would intentionally allow Saitama to grow during their battle, since it would be in his best interest to have a proper fight. Then it would be a matter of time.

But if they both go all out from the start? It would depend on Saitama's level of durability - it is, by all means, shown to be much greater than his actual strength. If Goku can put Saitama down despite his insane durability, before Saitama catches up to him, then he wins.

[Alruneia]

Saitama would probably beat Goku, because it would be funny. Goku would probably go through all his forms one by one and get clowned on in a comedic fashion all the way up. At the same time, Saitama would almost definitely lose against Yamcha, because it would be funny.

[FPSSJ4_Goku]

Based on you guys' personal power levels, who is the strongest character that Z Bardock (in separate forms - SS1, SS2, SS3, SS4, SS5, and Limit Breaker SS4) can defeat?

For the sake of argument, assume that SS4 is an 8,000x multiplier from base form, SS5 is a 50,000x multiplier from base form, and Limit Breaker SS4 is a 1,000,000x multiplier from base form.

[Koitsukai]

Who's the strongest character DBS-131 Goku can take? This includes both base forms, the one that trumps Z and the more manga-like base form that isn't as impressive.

Also, who is strong enough, from Z, DBS and GT, to beat post UI-beatdown Jiren? what about post pep-talk Jiren? who can he beat, being as depleted as he was?

[GreatSaiyaman123]

Who's the strongest character DBS-131 Goku can take? This includes both base forms, the one that trumps Z and the more manga-like base form that isn't as impressive.

Also, who is strong enough, from Z, DBS and GT, to beat post UI-beatdown Jiren? what about post pep-talk Jiren? who can he beat, being as depleted as he was?

I like to think SSJ Goku and FP Freeza were as strong as they were on Namek when they beat Jiren. Base Goku was comparable (Not necessarily, but I like to think they are) to "Base" (50-70%) Freeza in the final fight, meaning he couldn't squeeze the full 50x when he went SSJ because he was so tired.

Goku: 75,000,000
~ SSJ: 150,000,000

Freeeza: 84,000,000
~ 100%: 120,000,000

I think Goku can't beat Namek 50% Freeza because he's so low on stamina, but he might beat his KKx20 self from Namek.

Jiren required them both to just get pushed off the arena. I'd say 200,000,000 for him, on pair with Yardrat Goku. Jiren is unstoppable, so I think he beats Yardrat Goku but not whoever comes next in the hierarchy (19 or 20 would drain him, and Piccolo would stomp him).

Based on you guys' personal power levels, who is the strongest character that Z Bardock (in separate forms - SS1, SS2, SS3, SS4, SS5, and Limit Breaker SS4) can defeat?

For the sake of argument, assume that SS4 is an 8,000x multiplier from base form, SS5 is a 50,000x multiplier from base form, and Limit Breaker SS4 is a 1,000,000x multiplier from base form.

Bardock is officially around 10,000 so I think most people will have the same answer up to SSJ4.

SSJ Bardock: 500,000. He can beat post-nap Vegeta, but barely loses to 1st form Freeza.

SSJ2 Bardock: 1,000,000. Beats Enraged Gohan, but barely loses to Initial 2nd form Freeza.

SSJ3 Bardock: 4,000,000. On pair with Base Yardrat Goku, but I think Bardock loses to Goku and Trunks because of stamina. He can beat Pink shirt Vegeta, however.

SSJ4 Bardock: 80,000,000. Equals with King Cold. I think it could go either way. He'd beat 50% Mecha Freeza though.

SSJ5 Bardock: 500,000,000. Beats Android 17/Kamiccolo in a good fight.

Limit Breaker SSJ4 Bardock: 10,000,000,000. Beats Majin Vegeta.

[Grimlock]

Based on you guys' personal power levels, who is the strongest character that Z Bardock (in separate forms - SS1, SS2, SS3, SS4, SS5, and Limit Breaker SS4) can defeat?

What's "Z Bardock"? Is it just TV Special Bardock or do you lump Episode of Bardock together with "Z Bardock"?

If it's just TV Special Bardock:

• False Super Saiyan: 10,000 x 25 = 250,000 )---> Tied with Freeza saga Vegeta (before recovering from his fight with Recoom, as per V-Jump).

• Super Saiyan: 10,000 x 50 = 500,000 )---> Defeats Turles and everyone else below him (Movie 3).

• Super Saiyan Grade 2: 10,000 x 75 = 750,000 )---> Defeats Freeza last transformation (or "first form", as it was called...).

• Super Saiyan 2: 10,000 x 100 = 1,000,000 )---> Tied with Freeza second transformation.

• Super Saiyan Grade 3: 10,000 x 150 = 1,500,000 )---> Defeats Freeza second transformation and everyone below him.

• Super Saiyan 3: 10,000 x 400 = 4,000,000 )---> Defeats base Goku (as per Daizenshuu 7).
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If OVA Bardock is counted as "Z Bardock", I'm gonna apply the same zenkai boost (x33) Goku gets in Freeza saga (his power level is now 330,000):

• False Super Saiyan: 330,000 x 25 = 8,250,000 )---> Defeats Freeza saga Goku with Kaio-Ken (who has a power level of 6,000,000).

• Super Saiyan: 330,000 x 50 = 16,500,000 )---> Defeats Freeza saga Goku with Kaio-Ken x5 (who has a power level of 15,000,000).

• Super Saiyan Grade 2: 330,000 x 75 = 24,750,000 )---> Defeats Freeza saga Goku with Kaio-Ken x8 (who has a power level of 24,000,000).

• Super Saiyan 2: 330,000 x 100 = 33,000,000 )---> Tied with Freeza saga Goku with Kaio-Ken x11 (who has a power level of 33,000,000).

• Super Saiyan Grade 3: 330,000 x 150 = 49,500,000 )---> Defeats Freeza saga Goku with Kaio-Ken x16 (who has a power level of 48,000,000).

• Super Saiyan 3: 330,000 x 400 = 132,000,000 )---> Tied with Freeza saga Goku with Kaio-Ken x44 (who has a power level of 132,000,000).
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I have elected to ignore the Super Saiyan 4 and Super Full Power Saiyan 4 - Limit Breaker forms as we don't have multipliers for them. Yeah, we don't have multipliers for False Super Saiyan and Super Saiyan Grade 2 too but the ones I use are logical and make sense.

Super Saiyan Grade 3's multiplier is a bit tricky, while I have this form stronger than Super Saiyan 2, I don't know which number to settle for. I went for "x150" in this occasion but I'm still unsure about it, I'm also up for its multiplier to be "x110" or "x125". But not higher than "x150".

Comparing with Freeza saga Goku does make this a lot easier if we stick with the "Goku has a power level of three million" thing. It took me longer to make the comparison using other characters, especially because I didn't know the power level of others and I had to use the battle power guides (and this one).

[Noah]

New match:

- Current Gogeta/Vegetto (can use any transformation) vs. Black Freeza

[GatoF]

New match:

- Current Gogeta/Vegetto (can use any transformation) vs. Black Freeza

Either of them stomp Freeza if they can use UI or UE.

[GreatSaiyaman123]

New match:

- Current Gogeta/Vegetto (can use any transformation) vs. Black Freeza

Gogeta/Vegetto are going to win, but the form is arguable. Going by Freeza's attitude, he must think he can take SSJB Gogeta at the very least to leave the Saiyans alive. On the other hand, I think the writers prefer to ignore fusion as much as possible, and I don't think Black Freeza would get past SSJ fusion.

[nineko]

Now I do have to wonder, how strong would a "self" fusion such as SSB Goku + SSJ4 Goku (or SSB Vegeta + SSJ4 Vegeta) be? Do you think Goku² or Vegeta² could defeat Beerus?

[Hellspawn28]

Ledgic vs Super Buu

Rules:
No absorbing
No candy beam
No outside help

If base Super Buu loses, how would Ledgic against Buutenks and Buuhan?

[TobyS]

Who is the strongest person Tenshinhan + Goku Potara fusion could beat?

1. a) Whatever your probable lowball human hating estimate is XD .
b ) that but with Kikoho

2. a) If he is as strong as I estimate, which follows the following logic, Goku and Ten are at the individual limits AND are now a half saiyan. They also get the rivals boost too just because Ten isn't as competitive as Vegeta he would still want to surpass Goku if he could plus lingering rival school stuff, so they are nearly as much stronger than Vegitto in the same form as Gohan is stronger than Goku*.
b ) that but using Kikoho

*SS3 brings the power the saiyans limits, whereas Ultimate brings power beyond limits.

Also what would his name be? Tenshintto?

[GreatSaiyaman123]

Now I do have to wonder, how strong would a "self" fusion such as SSB Goku + SSJ4 Goku (or SSB Vegeta + SSJ4 Vegeta) be? Do you think Goku² or Vegeta² could defeat Beerus?

Probably as strong as Vegetto or Gogeta since Goku and Vegeta are equals. There'd be no rival boost, but self-fusing is pretty OP too going by Zamasu.

Ledgic vs Super Buu

Rules:
No absorbing
No candy beam
No outside help

If base Super Buu loses, how would Ledgic against Buutenks and Buuhan?

I think Super Buu wins. I don't understand how strong Goku is when GT starts, but Redjic seems more like Fat Boo level. Look at this chain:

M2 Goku = General Rildo > "Boo" (Either Toei Kid Boo or Gohan-Boo) > Sigma Force ~ Lord Lood > BoGT SSJ Goku > Redjic.

It's gonna take like, Lood or the Sigma Force to beat Super Boo. And only Rildo can take Buuhan.

Who is the strongest person Tenshinhan + Goku Potara fusion could beat?

1. a) Whatever your probable lowball human hating estimate is XD .
b ) that but with Kikoho

2. a) If he is as strong as I estimate, which follows the following logic, Goku and Ten are at the individual limits AND are now a half saiyan. They also get the rivals boost too just because Ten isn't as competitive as Vegeta he would still want to surpass Goku if he could plus lingering rival school stuff, so they are nearly as much stronger than Vegitto in the same form as Gohan is stronger than Goku*.
b ) that but using Kikoho

*SS3 brings the power the saiyans limits, whereas Ultimate brings power beyond limits.

Also what would his name be? Tenshintto?

1)

a) If Base Goku is below 100% Freeza, then I don't think Tenshinhan gets to crack 1 million. I have him around Ginyu level, which means the fusion boost here is pretty puny... Not punnier than Kibitoshin's though since Goku and Tien were rivals. Tenshintto (That's the name that came to my mind, too) could beat SSJ3 Gotenks or Super Boo, but I don't see him beating Ultimate Gohan.

b) I think Shin Kikoho was Tenshinhan's way of keeping up with SSJs in the early Cell Saga, so I'd place it on 100% Freeza's level with a 1,000x multiplier. He's gonna crush SSJ3 Vegetto, SSJG and maybe even SSJBs from the DBS Manga.

2)

a) You mean he's stronger than Vegetto in this scenario? Well then I think he can beat everyone Vegetto can, i.e. Boo, Enraged Vegeta, Baby Vegeta if we're including GT. I say he beats SSJG, it's debatable if Vegetto could beat SSJG but being that much stronger than Vegetto I think Tenshintto could beat Godku.

b) SSJG x 1,000. That's just SSJB (50x) + Kaio-Ken x20. He beats Goku Black, Toppo, all those high SSJB tiers.

[nineko]

Has anyone ever wondered how powerful a fusion of Broli and Kale would be? I sure hope they would be called Brole and not Kali, otherwise we'd anger all the Indian fans. I'm also not sure about their pronouns.

Brole - Beerus?
Brole - Black Freeza?

Do you think Brole could take on Merus? Either angelic Merus or mortal Merus.

[sunsetshimmer]

Probably as strong as Vegetto or Gogeta since Goku and Vegeta are equals.

It depends. Gogeta and Vegetto always used a single transformation owned by both Goku and Vegeta. But if SSB and SS4 fused and somehow created a new transformation, a "SS4 Blue", they should become stronger i believe. We never saw a fusion like this so it's hard to say if SS4+SSB would be stronger than SS4+SS4/SSB+SSB.

[Hellspawn28]

Buu saga Piccolo vs. Semi Perfect Cell

Who wins?

[ZombieVito]

Buu saga Piccolo vs. Semi Perfect Cell

Who wins?

Even Cell Games Piccolo one shots.

[nickzambuto]

Buu saga Piccolo vs. Semi Perfect Cell

Who wins?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BmGL4Gt ... tletuslive

Trunks was shook by Piccolo's new power. If Piccolo was even remotely close to Trunks, he'd be stronger than that Cell.

[GreatSaiyaman123]

Has anyone ever wondered how powerful a fusion of Broli and Kale would be? I sure hope they would be called Brole and not Kali, otherwise we'd anger all the Indian fans. I'm also not sure about their pronouns.

Brole - Beerus?
Brole - Black Freeza?

Do you think Brole could take on Merus? Either angelic Merus or mortal Merus.

Merus isn't that strong. Moro copied his power and got dunked on by Goku.

I think they would beat Black Freeza for sure, and they could beat Gogeta Blue too. Probably not Gogeta using a Ultra form though, and still not touching Whis.

Buu saga Piccolo vs. Semi Perfect Cell

Who wins?

Piccolo. SSJ Vegeta was up there with Cell after training in the Rosat, and Piccolo was above Vegeta before the Rosat.