Subbing Dragonboxes, sharing .SRT files...whaddaya think?

Smooth Criminal · Post by **Smooth Criminal** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 12:04 am

EDIT:

Whatever. There's no point in me bitching.

A simple edit of my post without the snide comment would have sufficed, don't you think?

lost in thought · Post by **lost in thought** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 1:08 am

Smooth Criminal wrote:EDIT:

Whatever. There's no point in me bitching.

A simple edit of my post without the snide comment would have sufficed, don't you think?

Highly off topic, but it must be said.
This is Mike's forum, where he manages it as he sees fit; I think that as a member [guest] in his forum [house], you should have the utmost respect for the man who works his ass off to provide a community to maturely discuss a topic near and dear.

Further, I know what you posted previously, and I should hope to never see such flagrant disrespect again. However, since you said it, I think you should put it back, since he already wants to ban you, and that would give him an excellent reason to.

Smooth Criminal · Post by **Smooth Criminal** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 1:38 am

Does it personally offend you that I posted the name of a fansub group? The NAME of a fansub group?

The question still stands. A simple edit of my post without the snide comment would have sufficed, don't you think? If you're going to post again, lost in whatever, do so without Mike's dick down your throat.

lost in thought · Post by **lost in thought** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 1:43 am

Smooth Criminal wrote:Does it personally offend you that I posted the name of a fansub group?

And Jesus Christ, please hop off the guy's dick...

Does it matter? This is Mike's forum, and if he does not like something, his word is final. End of story. Everyone needs to follow the rules set down here, myself included, and you are no exception.

Further, I don't take very kindly to your reference there in the final sentence, because I specificly requested to see no further insults, as I merely spoke the truth, and you failed to abide. We try to stay mature on these boards, and not let things boil down to what they have with you; but apparently you have a problem with rules, so I wish you the best when you are repremanded.

Smooth Criminal · Post by **Smooth Criminal** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 1:50 am

This is gold. Let me paraprhase what you just said.

"What Mike says goes. Mike is God, here. I love Mike. You hurt my feelings and should be banned for it. Sadface."

Alright, Mike, let your little groupie or whatever have his wish. But not before I get a word in on how much this bullshit elitism here sucks.

Mike: You are an asshole. Jesus Christ, I've seriously tried to keep my mouth shut about how much of a cock you are, but fuck it. Would it be that hard to just delete the name of the group, and NOT be an asshole about it?

Dude, stop waving your goddamn dick around because you're the admin. NOBODY GIVES A FLYING FUCK.

Why is it more than half your posts are warnings to other members, or some kind of useless fucking comment with an attitude? There's this little rule about not posting if you have nothing useful to say, so why don't you, oh I don't know, FOLLOW IT? I get it, you don't like [name of funsub group]. Delete it, PM me with a warning, and move on with life. But noooooo, you just have to be the fat fucking asshole that you are. Have you not gotten laid in a couple of years? Ever? Is that why you have this constant stick up your butt?

I like the community here. But whatever. Ban me.

MarcFBR · Post by **MarcFBR** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 1:56 am

Wow...and I thought I was the Daizex asshole. (edit- although I think I should still be the official asshole, since I bitch about shit that makes sense.)

Although smooth criminal, what you said is true, Mike is god here.

And plenty of people give a fuck that he's the admin, it's why people arent acting like you.

"Jesus Christ, I've seriously tried to keep my mouth shut about how much of a cock you are, but fuck it."

Half your posts are insulting Mike, so how exactly have you been trying to keep your mouth shut?

Plus, if Mike wants to be an asshole, hey, more fun to watch what he does to people, if he ever does go all psycho asshole I'm sure I will be one of the first people to go, but it'll still be fun to see.

...although I do admit, your screenname makes me imagine you are dancing around with a monkey and children....so you should probably get back to that.

Smooth Criminal · Post by **Smooth Criminal** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 2:02 am

And plenty of people give a fuck that he's the admin, it's why people arent acting like you.

Acting like me?

Because I suggested helping this guy out by providing him SUBTITLES created by a fansub group, I'm commiting an offense worthy of being threatened a ban? Come on, dude.

Yeah, it's probably true half of my posts are in some way showing that I think Mike is an asshole. Oops. I said I tried.

Duo · Post by **Duo** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 4:33 am

Or you could try being a man by swallowing your pride and moving on with life.

If you're going to turn into a 3 year old girl every time you disagree with someone of higher authority then you, good luck in life. Seriously, you will fricken need it.

Tsukento · Post by **Tsukento** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 5:16 am

Smooth Criminal wrote:Does it personally offend you that I posted the name of a fansub group? The NAME of a fansub group?

A simple Google of the name and you can instantly find it withing five seconds, thus giving people access to said fansubs leading to less profit directed to FUNimation. Let us not forget, Daimao worked his butt off for the fans and was paid for his work. Not just so it could be ripped off by some fansubbers making episodes available for free.

Even though you didn't provide a link, it's still very easy to track down and presents a number of problems.

Post by **VegettoEX** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 7:03 am

There's a difference between a "fansub group" and a "ripping group". The entity mentioned goes far and beyond being just a "ripping group". For those of you that haven't been into anime long enough to understand the difference, I'd highly suggest doing a little reading up on the subject. There's a whole nasty background to the distinction.

Furthermore, call me what you want. Whatever. Name calling on the internet got old about a decade ago. Blah blah blah, whatever. People hiding behind computers saying nonsense, blah blah blah.

I'm just at a complete and utter shock at the amount of disrespect towards the sole person (OK, one of two) who's responsible for bringing accurate and fan-friendly translations to you in your own countries. "Fans" (and I use that term extremely loosely) these days are a bunch of whiney brats. Selfish, irresponsible, hypocritical, whiney brats.

How quickly we forget there was, once upon a time, an era when there were no plans to release subtitled DVDs.

MajinVejitaXV · Post by **MajinVejitaXV** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 9:26 am

VegettoEX wrote:I'm just at a complete and utter shock at the amount of disrespect towards the sole person (OK, one of two) who's responsible for bringing accurate and fan-friendly translations to you in your own countries. "Fans" (and I use that term extremely loosely) these days are a bunch of whiney brats. Selfish, irresponsible, hypocritical, whiney brats.

Eh, yes and no. In my case, I have nothing but respect for Daimao (unlike his employers, who originally censored his scripts), but since I purchased a legitimate copy of the series, I don't feel as though I'm stealing anything. And since I'm willing to bet Daimao isn't paid per unit sold but rather a flat rate (if not, then I'll retract all of this), it's not having an impact on him directly if people trade subtitles. I mean seriously, how many people will have a use for them that don't already have FUNi discs, the DragonBox owners? The Region 2 single disc owners? That's still a very small consumer base.

And hey, if FUNi will release a book with scripts for all the series, or better yet a CD/DVD, I'll snap it up in an instant. I'm not against paying for it. It's just we both know that will never happen.

Now, having said that, this is your forum, and I do remember ye olden days of the unmoderated counterpart. In this case, Mike has the right to exercise his administrative rights. And while some may get pissed, try and remember that Mike isn't going to go too far overboard because no members = no Daizenshuu EX. There's always private messaging, he just doesn't want it out in the public (more likely than not, a major factor is that FUNi would crack down on the whole place and might cause it to close).

How quickly we forget there was, once upon a time, an era when there were no plans to release subtitled DVDs.

I don't mind your speaking out on the subtitle issue, but this is just silly. You and I both know FUNi didn't do the discs out of altruism for true fans or anything, they did it because there was a profit involved. And seriously, they're milking it for all that its worth (3 episodes a disc, woo-hoo!) ;p

-Corey

Domon · Post by **Domon** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 9:37 am

I don't mind your speaking out on the subtitle issue, but this is just silly. You and I both know FUNi didn't do the discs out of altruism for true fans or anything, they did it because there was a profit involved. And seriously, they're milking it for all that its worth (3 episodes a disc, woo-hoo!) ;p

I don't think he's trying to say that Funimation released subtitled DVDs out of The Goodness Of Their Heart, but rather that many fans are forgetting that we have it so damn easy compared to 7-8 years ago where there were few English-country release of anime/manga. Now, you can go to Best Buy or Amazon and fine tons of titles out there, and picuture/sound are likely to be better than grainy fansubs. Also, by buying the legit release, it can only encourage those companies to release even more anime titles, making even more titles easliy accessable(there's certainly a few titles out there that I hope see a stateside release someday... and I certainly hope that anime DVDs sales will continue to be high enough that we'll see the complete run of subtitled Voltron).

Blitzen · Post by **Blitzen** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 9:50 am

Domon wrote:and I certainly hope that anime DVDs sales will continue to be high enough that we'll see the complete run of subtitled Voltron).

You're aware MB are putting out GoLion and Dairugger next year, sub-only, right?

MajinVejitaXV · Post by **MajinVejitaXV** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 9:59 am

Domon wrote:I don't think he's trying to say that Funimation released subtitled DVDs out of The Goodness Of Their Heart, but rather that many fans are forgetting that we have it so damn easy compared to 7-8 years ago where there were few English-country release of anime/manga. Now, you can go to Best Buy or Amazon and fine tons of titles out there, and picuture/sound are likely to be better than grainy fansubs. Also, by buying the legit release, it can only encourage those companies to release even more anime titles, making even more titles easliy accessable(there's certainly a few titles out there that I hope see a stateside release someday... and I certainly hope that anime DVDs sales will continue to be high enough that we'll see the complete run of subtitled Voltron).

I figured as much, but the transition in his post from 'how could you disrespect those who translate the series for us' to 'years ago, they didn't even plan on releasing it subbed to begin with' did have a sort of "Look what they did for us!" feel to it.

And yes, purchasing is good because it fuels the machine that causes more titles to be brought over here...question is, do I wanna purchase titles and encourage a company that butchered this particular show (both from a technical standpoint and with regards to their adaptation so that being a DBZ fan essentially is a joke to most people) to pick up more licenses? To me, if they do a good product (Fruits Basket), I'll buy it. If they make a bad one, I don't (DBZ and GT, I dunno if they took the same 'LOL NEEDS MROE COLOR AND SHARP!!111'-approach on DB).

Let's not underestimate our power as consumers. We demand a good quality product and refuse to spend our money, we'll get one. Why? They want our business. We buy their products and go, "Oh well, it's better than a 19th generation fansub by Anime Labs"...well, then what reason do they have to do better?

Anyway, sorry for the OT discussion.

-Corey

Castor Troy · Post by **Castor Troy** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 11:13 am

It was basically a civil rights struggle to get the japanese version on dvd.

*flashbacks to the ridiculous amount of arguments over the real details over irc many years ago*

Post by **desirecampbell** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 11:53 am

Aw, hell. I may as well say something too.

On the legality of sharing sub-files: In America this is illegal, in other countries (even Canada) the rules about file sharing is 'shaky'. In Canada the current situation (I believe) is that downloading copyrighted material is legal, but uploading isn't.

On the morality of sharing sub-files: That's a bit more tricky. Some people have no qualms about sharing what they own with others, others believe that you should have to pay for what you want. The general consensus here is that if it's readily available there's no reason to steal it. Downloading a BGM that can only be found on an out-of-print album is fair game, but near-perfect subtitles are available for reasonably inexpensive.

Finally, on Mike being an asshole: He isn't. He has set forth a specific set of rules with which to conduct yourself on his forum. This is not a democracy, it's LaBraieville. If you want a forum to say and do what you like, start your own (it's easy, even I have one). I think the fact that he hasn't banned you yet is a testament to how patient he is (I would've banned you already).

MajinVejitaXV · Post by **MajinVejitaXV** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 11:55 am

Castor Troy wrote:It was basically a civil rights struggle to get the japanese version on dvd.

*flashbacks to the ridiculous amount of arguments over the real details over irc many years ago*

I remember, but you've gotta agree surely that with the rise of bilingual anime DVD releases, FUNi would have come into the game anyway. I mean, they'd be damn stupid not to.

-Corey

Domon · Post by **Domon** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 12:22 pm

Blitzen wrote:
Domon wrote:and I certainly hope that anime DVDs sales will continue to be high enough that we'll see the complete run of subtitled Voltron).
You're aware MB are putting out GoLion and Dairugger next year, sub-only, right?

Fully. Hence why I want sales to continue being strong.

No ones wants things to go down the crapper and leave us with only a half-finished release.

question is, do I wanna purchase titles and encourage a company that butchered this particular show (both from a technical standpoint and with regards to their adaptation so that being a DBZ fan essentially is a joke to most people) to pick up more licenses? To me, if they do a good product (Fruits Basket), I'll buy it. If they make a bad one, I don't (DBZ and GT, I dunno if they took the same 'LOL NEEDS MROE COLOR AND SHARP!!111'-approach on DB).

I don't think anyone denys that Funimations dics are flawed(understatement, I know!), or that the Dragonboxes are superior(unless, perhaps, one is a die-hard dub fan), and I doubt anyone has problems with someone buying the Dragonboxes(least I hope not), so long as you got it legel. The problem, so far as I can tell, is distributing the series through illegel means, whenever it's file-sharing or through DVD-Rs, whenever subbed or not or using Dragonbox footages. The series is so widely available now that there's no need for fansubs and the likes.

Post by **VegettoEX** » Thu Apr 20, 2006 6:07 pm

I think Domon kinda nailed what I was actually going for. I'd hate to be a fan of any current-days kid shows (oh, wait... I *am* a One Piece fan). It was a little bit of a battle, but FUNimation came around and actually set somewhat of a standard for the long-running shonen handling in the US. You can go get 'em. Awesome.

(It was just weird... they were in this in-between stage of not caring about the fans and moving into caring about the fans... that bizarre mid/late-90s fandom nonsense... but anyway...)

I just have a huge problem with this whole mass-hysteria-present-day-fandom-idealogy of "gimme gimme gimme". For god's sake, what happened to being sly about it and just not telling anyone how much bootlegging and gray-area stuff you're doing...?!?

When it comes down to it, it's just really weird and inconsiderate to want to go ahead and have a major discussion about it when the guy who's doing them as a job is hanging out and reading ^_~.

Again, unless there's anything else to contribute to the actual discussion (which I'm happy to keep open and involved), I'll ask that the other comments stay out. Thanks so much!

sangofe · Post by **sangofe** » Sat Apr 22, 2006 7:15 pm

MajinVejitaXV wrote:I actually tried to rally people together like this before. Unfortunately, it would seem this is copyright infringement if you intend to use FUNi's subtitles (which, really, are the only accurate ones save for one or two episodes a fluent friend translated for me). I mean, Anime Labs subtitles on a DragonBox is sorta like spaghetti covered in shit-sauce ;p

Sorry, I don't think you'll have much luck. If this gets the green flag from Mr. LaBrie, I'll gladly contribute though (even if I've given up on subtitling each episode myself, it'd take too long and too many DL DVD+R's).

-Corey

Please, anyone that's interested in personal project like this, contact me. I've also started, and it'd be really nice not to have to re-time all 291 eps...

Kanzenshuu

Subbing Dragonboxes, sharing .SRT files...whaddaya think?

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