[Guide/How-To] Put Daimao's subtitles on your DragonBox DVDs

[ect5150]

Okay, so many people have been bugging me for a good guide on how to properly re-time the subtitles from the region 1 releases for the region 2 releases. When I said I'd make a guide, others started asking more general questions about making videos... so I just decided on writing a guide for making a video from all aspects, from step A to step Z.

By this I mean, proper video encoding, resizing, anamorphic videos, audio encoding and subtitle encoding and corrections for each of the media streams to match Daimao's subtitles found on FUNimation's DVD to be placed with video from the Dragon Box DVDs. I should note, the guide is not going into reburning the subtitles back onto DVDs (mainly because its an extra lengthy step per DVD), but PS3 playback is being explored through MP4 files.

Anyways, the beginnings of the guide are being posted here:

http://www.geocities.com/dbmovieproject/

It is shaping up to be quite lengthy just from me providing so many details, so I'm sure it will take me some time to finish (trying to make a short version and long version, and I'm only half way through the short version and I wish the long version to not leave any details out what-so-ever).

There are samples up as well as to the results of the overall process. Evaluate, leave feedback, etc... let me know your own results. I will say the main point of interest (the resynch-ing of the subtitles) is not completely written out yet... just a summary of it (extremely short summary).

[SonEric84]

Awesome, I need to get some Dragon Box singles at the very least now.

[Pain]

Wish I had one...

[Forgotten Hero]

Cool! I was wondering if that was even a possibility!
I probably won't get the Dragon Box anytime soon, but at least this info is available!

Oh, you can find the Dragon Box in two parts on Amazon Japan. Everyone probably knows that already, but there you go!

[Adamant]

Yeah, but the seller usually won't ship outside Japan, so you better make some friends over there first..

[sangofe]

Yo, I wanted to know, is there a way to "scene time" for dvds? (I.e: ending or starting the subtitle line timing on the last frame before a next "scene" starts?)

[ect5150]

Yo, I wanted to know, is there a way to "scene time" for dvds? (I.e: ending or starting the subtitle line timing on the last frame before a next "scene" starts?)

Aegissub has a few features to do these types of things automatically, but they are highly dependent on its ability to detect a scene (which isn't great). but its easily done if you want to do it manually... picking the start frame and the end frame of the scene itself.

[Raki]

Yeah, but the seller usually won't ship outside Japan, so you better make some friends over there first..

Use the Celga service.

[sangofe]

Yo, I wanted to know, is there a way to "scene time" for dvds? (I.e: ending or starting the subtitle line timing on the last frame before a next "scene" starts?)

Aegissub has a few features to do these types of things automatically, but they are highly dependent on its ability to detect a scene (which isn't great). but its easily done if you want to do it manually... picking the start frame and the end frame of the scene itself.

No, this does not hold true for vob files. I have done some experimenting scene timing with vob files, and found it very hard to scene time stuff, because occasionally you would have so called "scene bleeds" here and there.
I'm a timer for a fansub group and have timed well over 300 episodes so I do know very well how to scene time for "regular" encoded fansub releases, but timing for dvds seem a bit trickier.

[JulieYBM]

Isn't this illegal?

[laserkid]

If you own the Japanese Dragon Boxes/singles, AND the FUNimation releases with the subtitles on them, then no, because you paid for both the remastered footage AND for the translation.

If however you own only one part, or neither, then yes it would be illegal.

[desirecampbell]

Let's not get into the legality of the issue. The information presented here is useful, what people do with it is not at issue - information should be shared.

[ect5150]

No, this does not hold true for vob files. I have done some experimenting scene timing with vob files, and found it very hard to scene time stuff, because occasionally you would have so called "scene bleeds" here and there.
I'm a timer for a fansub group and have timed well over 300 episodes so I do know very well how to scene time for "regular" encoded fansub releases, but timing for dvds seem a bit trickier.

My explanation was just to video in general and actual time codes of it (although I'm still not exactly sure what you mean by "scene time")... this may vary for specific implementations of the subtitle streams (e.g. - VOB files). If you have problems getting these things to display in a VOB properly, but not through an AVI (or whatever), the problem has to lie in the SUP file stream of the VOB file.

With my understanding of DVD subtitle structure, the timing is done in # of frames (maybe even number of fields), and that can vary depending on if the video is encoded as interlaced or progressive with pulldown flags (or a combo of both).

If you wish, send me a PM and maybe we can tackle the problem together (I always love learning more about the stuff). I don't remember much of it currently, but when I used to fool around with VOB files, I remember they were a pain in the ass.

Isn't this illegal?

As stated above, if you actually own both versions of the discs, I don't see why it would be illegal. The site doesn't provide any video, audio or subtitles at all. It attempts to provide a legit way for you to use your legally purchased products and view them how many of us would prefer to watch it.

EDIT for sangofe:
I forgot to ask, are you are using Aegisub on the VOB files themselves? Or are you using a different program? Reason I ask is Aegisub doesn't handle VOB properly. It gives incorrect time codes. Test it out, drop the vob file into Aegisub, then into VirtualDubMod. Same frame numbers yield different frames:

Links:
http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o150 ... bfile1.jpg
http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o150 ... aldub1.jpg

Not sure if this is the issue or not... if not PM me. If it is, I always encode the video first via AviSynth and mux it into an mkv file. I'm guessing Aegisub has an error with the pulldown flags. This corrects the issue for me.

[sangofe]

Hey, ect5150. I have to admit I didn't invest a lot of time into this issue and gave up rather quickly, because re-timing the subtitles was not my main concern, but having the French dub synced on (which failed).
But anyway, I timed making "timing raws" that were 24 fps (23 something)...
This has been some time, so I don't remember clearly how I did it... but I either used an automated rip-pack program or avs script in vdub.
When I used the key-frames from the avi and timed with those 100%, some lines would "bleed", others not.
I'll have to look more into this. I think I have the scripts for first 3-4 episodes re-timed this way that I could send you...

[kusakun004]

The only issue with the subs would be none for the next episode previews. It would be weird to have subs and then they suddenly disappear during the previews. But the idea is really interesting.

[Raki]

The only issue with the subs would be none for the next episode previews. It would be weird to have subs and then they suddenly disappear during the previews. But the idea is really interesting.

Couldn't somebody who knows the language on here translate the next episode previews?

[ect5150]

The only issue with the subs would be none for the next episode previews. It would be weird to have subs and then they suddenly disappear during the previews. But the idea is really interesting.

Next episode previews are after the ending credits. I personally just encode the recap and the episode itself and don't worry with the intro and exit songs for each and every episode. To me, it kind of seems redundant.

But it would be nice to have the next episode previews. FUNI ran into issues I believe trying to do it (no audio on them?). It would be nice if someone would translate them, but that person would already have to have the DBox. Its probably a BIG pain for not a whole lot of benefit.

[MajinVejitaXV]

But it would be nice to have the next episode previews. FUNI ran into issues I believe trying to do it (no audio on them?). It would be nice if someone would translate them, but that person would already have to have the DBox. Its probably a BIG pain for not a whole lot of benefit.

Yah, Toei's masters that they provided to FUNi didn't have the audio. It was assumed, back in 2000 or so when Daimao did an interview about his hand in subtitling the series, that perhaps FujiTV did the audio for those directly. This means that Toei might not have had the audio when they made the Digibeta masters they gave FUNi, and acquired them somewhere in the process of making the DragonBoxes.

Though, in my opinion, the previews add a little extra to the show. I always enjoy watching them, with the little commentary that the characters provide (one of my favorites being the preview for Episode 185 where all the characters are talking about Gohan's SSJ2 transformation, with Vegeta commenting that Gohan "[took out] those midgets we were strugging with...with just one hit!?"). Besides, it's not that hard, they're short and they all begin with the same phrase ;p

-Corey

[sangofe]

The only issue with the subs would be none for the next episode previews. It would be weird to have subs and then they suddenly disappear during the previews. But the idea is really interesting.

Couldn't somebody who knows the language on here translate the next episode previews?

I'd surely time those previews if someone would translate them

[Forgotten Hero]

Majin Vegeta...
WTF?! Your avator is just confusing the crap out of of me!
Yeah the previews were pretty cool. I'm sure we all enjoy the BGM on the previews.