Discussion regarding the entirety of the franchise in a general (meta) sense, including such aspects as: production, trends, merchandise, fan culture, and more.
LuckyCat wrote:I'm trying to be open to this idea, but there just isn't enough morally gray area to work with. Freeza's revenge is completely unsympathetic, since he was the instigator of his battle with Goku by killing his race and friends. Freeza ignores countless opportunities to grow as a character by dismissing suggestions from his own minions that he can control an empire and forget about Goku. He dismisses another chance to grow by not accepting Goku's offer to train and fight another day. And his reasoning for declining growth is so petty and infantile, that the audience is really left with the idea that Freeza is a lost cause.<br abp="714"><br abp="715">If they showed scenes that established Freeza as maintaining some sort of legitimate empire, and that his evil deeds actually served a higher purpose of galactic stability, Freeza could be a protagonist as a necessary evil (like Beerus). But without scenes like this, we're left with the conclusion that Freeza is petty and infantile in all situations, making for a terrible leader even without the Goku grudge.<br abp="716"><br abp="717">So if you must paint Freeza as the protagonist, he's a shallow one at best, and that doesn't really make the movie better.
Freeza at his core is pure evil. He wants power, and we saw in the series that his empire was very business like, so seeing how his defeat has made him emotionally unstable is different. Granted, it's kind of there in the Trunks episodes, but it's hit on here more. And dictatorships don't serve any "higher purpose" especially not stability. The most you could say is that it's "mildly better" than anarchy but even that's a stretch. I like that the villain is infantile. It's a very dislikable trait which is great in a villain. Far too often writers make villains likable, arguably even moreso than the hero. They might assume that the audience won't like them more than the hero simply because they do evil things but if you're fun to watch and the good guy is just good because the story needs a good guy, who will the audience want to spend time with?
What makes Freeza interesting isn't "shades of grey", what makes him interesting is that he does what he does with panache.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take - Wayne Gretzky" - Michael Scott
Happiness is climate, not weather.
Akira Toriyama wrote:My policy is to try and forget things once they’re over. Since if I don’t discard the old and focus on what’s new, I’ll overload my brain capacity. I still haven’t lived down going, “Who the heck is Tao Pai-pai?” that one time I was talking with Ei’ichiro Oda-kun. But the fact that there are still people reading the series after all this time… All I can say is; “thank you.” Really, that’s all.
Akira Toriyama wrote:Drawing Dragon Ball again reminded me of two things--how much I love it, and how much I never want to do it again.
Kunzait_83 wrote:And if you're upset because all this new material completely invalidates the tabletop RPG rulebook-sized statistical system and flowchart for the characters' "canonical Power Levels" that you'd been working on painstakingly for the last bunch of years now... well I don't think there's a kind, non-blunt way of saying this, but that's 100% entirely your own misguided fault for buying so deeply into all this nonsensical garbage in the first place. And that you also have IMMENSELY skewed and comically backwards priorities in what you think is most important and needed to make a good Dragon Ball story.
Zephyr wrote:Goodness, they wrote idiotic drivel in a children's cartoon meant to advertise toys!? Again!? For the ninetieth episode in a row!? Somebody stop the presses! We have to voice our concern over these Super important issues!
Kamiccolo9 wrote:Fair enough, I concede. Sean Schemmel probably has some kind of hidden talent. Maybe he is an expert at Minesweeper. You're right; calling him "talentless" wasn't fair.
Michsi wrote: ↑Mon Jul 04, 2022 11:29 amIn Super Piccolo got yelled off the stage by Vegeta in the U6 Tournament arc and lost to Jiminy Cricket in the ToP , he deserved 15 new transformations with his theme song played by Metallica in the background.
ABED wrote:What makes Freeza interesting isn't "shades of grey", what makes him interesting is that he does what he does with panache.
Oh yes, I never claimed that, that's just one of many ways Freeza could have been given a path for us to follow. He stays pretty static in development throughout the whole movie, so his largest claim to the title protagonist is screentime, which is dubious. Dr. Evil gets more screen time in the second Austin Powers movie, but I don't think that qualifies him as the protagonist. Like Freeza, he sets up the master plan which the heroes must foil.
If anyone could be argued a protagonist of RoF, it should be Bulma. She finds out about the threat to Earth first, she calls everyone to action including Goku and Whis. She has a direct confrontation with the antagonist (Freeza). And she even gets Beerus to promise the heroes safety, which allows Goku to come back and finish Freeza off.
Was Freeza the protagonist? Sure, I can buy that. After all, the plot was driven largely by his character. Even the plot to resurrect him came from the memory of his charisma and leadership and all-around badassery. The fighting happened because he actively refused to listen to reason. He lost because he refused to have sufficient patience. It's almost a tragedy: so much build up for this god-like being, and he behaves... ur... like a classical god.
Dr Gero, in Budokai 2 wrote:Go, my Saiba Rangers!
Akira Toriyama, in Son Goku Densetsu wrote:You really can’t go by rumors (laughs).