"Dragon Ball Super" Series Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by Hellspawn28 » Mon Nov 09, 2015 9:29 pm

Noah wrote:
I don't know. This talk is to Toei HR Department.

How is not entitled to anything? Dragon Ball is a huge franchise that still makes a lot of money since the end of its serialization, it should be treated better and with the respect that we fans deserve. We shouldn't accept anything crappy just because it has "Dragon Ball" logo in the title, no! We deserve a series with great quality for a great franchise that is Dragon Ball.
That's how any business works. How much money it makes in the home country comes first and the rest of the world later. Dragon Ball may be a big brand name, but One Piece sells better in Japan. Dragon Ball is not even the biggest anime brand name in Japan. Gundam, Pokemon, Yokai Watch and One Piece make more money then DBZ does.
They always make anime based on Japanese demographics only. No different how it is here. They don't make Rick and Morty or South Park with the market of China or Japan in mind.
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by VegettoEX » Mon Nov 09, 2015 9:50 pm

Hellspawn28 wrote:They don't make Rick and Morty or South Park with the market of China or Japan in mind.
That's entirely different; those are two shows aimed at adults made with American sensibilities exclusively in mind.

Dragon Ball is a show that was never particularly "Japanese" and always managed to get out there internationally with huge success.

The disparity between what Toei talks about and actually does is the issue here. They say they recognize Dragon Ball as an international megahit, yet beyond the theatrical and home release rollout for the Freeza movie in a timely fashion, they have yet to truly show an understanding about what it's like to produce and market Dragon Ball as the international hit it is.
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by precita » Mon Nov 09, 2015 9:53 pm

Super was obviously rushed to production. The fact that this show debuted out of nowhere in 2015 when we just had the Freeza movie says a lot.

They should have waited till 2016 to debut Super. They could have taken their time with the show and handled it better, instead of "rushing it to the market" in 2015. You can tell they weren't prepared for another weekly long series at all.

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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by JulieYBM » Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:54 pm

Noah wrote:
JulieYBM wrote:How many of them are good? How many of them are willing to work on a weekly schedule?

Just because Dragon Ball is popular in the outside world it doesn't mean it is entitled to anything.
I don't know. This talk is to Toei HR Department.

How is not entitled to anything? Dragon Ball is a huge franchise that still makes a lot of money since the end of its serialization, it should be treated better and with the respect that we fans deserve. We shouldn't accept anything crappy just because it has "Dragon Ball" logo in the title, no! We deserve a series with great quality for a great franchise that is Dragon Ball.
You can't force good staff to work on a series and put out their best work if they don't want to.
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by TheDevilsCorpse » Tue Nov 10, 2015 12:36 am

JulieYBM wrote:People want to work on PreCure. Go! Princess PreCure has Tanaka Yuuta as its series director. Tanaka is a young director who is a huge fan of the franchise and has been climbing the ranks of the franchise since he began working on it. Studio Live animator Itaoka Nishiki is a big fan of the franchise, too, so much so that he even draws fan art in his spare time. It's the only series he will work on at this point. Fujii Shingo and Ota Kazuhiro have also been recent mainstays of Go! Princess PreCure. Before them there was Tanaka Hironori and Ootsuka Takashi. Tanaka loved the franchise so much he produced an incredible number of scenes for it. Ootsuka directed the franchise's best movies. The list of talent involved with the franchise goes on, all because they like the series or have connections with those deeply involved with it.

Nobody becomes an animator in Japan for the money, they do it for the things they love. In this case it's cute girls and fight scenes.
Dragon Ball isn't just an international hit though, but from what I've seen, it's also one of those series that is almost universally praised by people in this part of the business for being a portion of their inspiration from growing up with it as a kid. Do a lot of these people really not want to work on the franchise, or could the lack of talented staff also be partially attributed to the Yamamuro stigma that has plagued the franchise for over a decade now? I know Kimitoshi Chioka is the series' director, but I imagine Yamamuro is still a figure looming over Super to some extent (not just as character designer), credited or not.
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by JulieYBM » Tue Nov 10, 2015 12:56 am

TheDevilsCorpse wrote:
JulieYBM wrote:People want to work on PreCure. Go! Princess PreCure has Tanaka Yuuta as its series director. Tanaka is a young director who is a huge fan of the franchise and has been climbing the ranks of the franchise since he began working on it. Studio Live animator Itaoka Nishiki is a big fan of the franchise, too, so much so that he even draws fan art in his spare time. It's the only series he will work on at this point. Fujii Shingo and Ota Kazuhiro have also been recent mainstays of Go! Princess PreCure. Before them there was Tanaka Hironori and Ootsuka Takashi. Tanaka loved the franchise so much he produced an incredible number of scenes for it. Ootsuka directed the franchise's best movies. The list of talent involved with the franchise goes on, all because they like the series or have connections with those deeply involved with it.

Nobody becomes an animator in Japan for the money, they do it for the things they love. In this case it's cute girls and fight scenes.
Dragon Ball isn't just an international hit though, but from what I've seen, it's also one of those series that is almost universally praised by people in this part of the business for being a portion of their inspiration from growing up with it as a kid. Do a lot of these people really not want to work on the franchise, or could the lack of talented staff also be partially attributed to the Yamamuro stigma that has plagued the franchise for over a decade now? I know Kimitoshi Chioka is the series' director, but I imagine Yamamuro is still a figure looming over Super to some extent (not just as character designer), credited or not.
I have no doubt Yamamuro Tadayoshi plays a part in so few talents wanting to participate in the series. We know he pissed off Eguchi Hisashi enough for him to complain about Yamamuro on Twitter with Satou Masaki. We also know Kameda Yoshimichi was aghast when he saw the trailer for the 2013 film at how terrible the character designs looked. "Bring back Maeda Minoru!" Kameda said. Kameda is one of the most talented young animators around today. He did the key animation for this masterpiece of a fight scene in One Punch Man Episode #1.

If you look at the movies there are a few good animators involved (2013: Takahashi Yuuya, Kan'no Yoshihiro, Ishigami Hiromi, Shida Naotoshi, Oonishi Ryou, Hamano Yuu'ichi, Shishido Nozomu, Takara Isami; 2015: Urata Yukihiro, Takahashi Yuuya, Ootsuka Ken, Ishizuka Katsumi, Nishino Takeshi, Eguchi Hisashi, Hayashi Yuuki, Watanabe Koudai). Hell, Dragon Ball Super had Hayashi Yuuki, Watanabe Koudai and Tate Naoki work on the Opening animation but not a single one of us can pick out what they did. Hayashi Yuuki did that cool little fight between those two aliens in Episode #2.

Yamamuro takes what makes animation so fun and completely removes it from an animator's drawings. Hayashi and Watanabe both worked on the 2015 film as assistant animation supervisors but none of their presence can be felt throughout the film at all. When television episodes have better animation than films with the same talented animators working on them you know there is something wrong going on.

Nevertheless, it is also important for us to keep in mind that as much as we might like Dragon Ball Super it doesn't mean others do. It just means we all have mutually shitty taste. It's also wise to remember the role production assistants play in securing talent. They practically have to kill one another to get a good animator. You mentioned Chioka Kimitoshi, too, which is something to keep in mind. The thing is, none of Chioka's presence can be felt in Dragon Ball Super. Hunt down his last series, Hakaba Kitarou (Yamamuro is character designer of it, though). Even just those first two episodes have such a striking mood to them. It's really weird that these two series feel so disjointed, but I suppose that's what happens when a good series director is wrangled (strangled?) into leading a series with two months of pre-production before going to broadcast.

So far Super has had two bright spots, Takahashi Yuuya and Oonishi Ryou's twenty second bursts of good animation. That's it.
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by Hellspawn28 » Tue Nov 10, 2015 1:25 am

VegettoEX wrote:
Hellspawn28 wrote:They don't make Rick and Morty or South Park with the market of China or Japan in mind.
That's entirely different; those are two shows aimed at adults made with American sensibilities exclusively in mind.

Dragon Ball is a show that was never particularly "Japanese" and always managed to get out there internationally with huge success.
My point is that companies always focus on the main market in their home country first. Japan is always the main market for Dragon Ball first. They always make shows for the main audience in the country that it was made. It's the same for every country out there since America always makes their shows for the US audience in mind first before the rest of the world comes into play.
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by EmmaWinters » Tue Nov 10, 2015 2:01 am

So apparently this is a thing.

http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/press-r ... sia/.95205
http://toonamifaithful.com/press-releas ... all-super/

Not sure how seriously we should take it given the lack of sources. If true, I would hate for a company like Animax to pull a Yu Yu Hakusho again.
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by Chuquita » Tue Nov 10, 2015 2:04 am

EmmaWinters wrote:So apparently this is a thing.

http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/press-r ... sia/.95205
http://toonamifaithful.com/press-releas ... all-super/

Not sure how seriously we should take it given the lack of sources. If true, I would hate for a company like Animax to pull a Yu Yu Hakusho again.
OH. O_O

Does this mean we could potentially have two English dubs of Super? One by Funimation and one by whoever does English dubs for Toei in Asia?
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by Cure Dragon 255 » Tue Nov 10, 2015 2:08 am

I will LOL if its made by Ocean....LOL.

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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by Sodhi » Tue Nov 10, 2015 2:09 am

Chuquita wrote:
EmmaWinters wrote:So apparently this is a thing.

http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/press-r ... sia/.95205
http://toonamifaithful.com/press-releas ... all-super/

Not sure how seriously we should take it given the lack of sources. If true, I would hate for a company like Animax to pull a Yu Yu Hakusho again.
OH. O_O

Does this mean we could potentially have two English dubs of Super? One by Funimation and one by whoever does English dubs for Toei in Asia?
It says it here toohttps://twitter.com/ToonamiAsia, but somehow I have feeling that these are all fan pages. Except the news one.

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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by Chuquita » Tue Nov 10, 2015 2:10 am

The idea of the Ocean cast returning for alternate Super dub would be so bizarre. O_O

Who would voice Gokû? Ocean's had like 5 or 6 of them.

Also, Brian Drummond voicing the "wacky" Vegeta antics from episode 16 would be something to listen to.
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by Sodhi » Tue Nov 10, 2015 2:11 am

Cure Dragon 255 wrote:I will LOL if its made by Ocean....LOL.
It's probably the Malaysian dub. XD

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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by EmmaWinters » Tue Nov 10, 2015 2:12 am

Chuquita wrote:Does this mean we could potentially have two English dubs of Super?
Assuming this is true, I believe it's possible, but we won't know for sure for quite some time.
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by Super Saiyan Swagger » Tue Nov 10, 2015 2:26 am

Two English dubs? Ehhh... :| I don't know about this. The Funimation dub has already established itself as the go-to English dub of the series so I don't see why there would end up being two separate English dubs for Super. It seems unlikely to me.

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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by Sodhi » Tue Nov 10, 2015 2:32 am

Well it turns out I was right, the source from where the news is indeed a fan website
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by EmmaWinters » Tue Nov 10, 2015 2:38 am

Sodhi wrote:Well it turns out I was right, the source from where the news is indeed a fan website
Yeah, they're a fan page. I think they're a pretty well-known one, too.
Which is why I mentioned a lack of sources. An announcement straight from the company wouldn't be a rumor.

We should definitely take this with a grain of salt.
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by Ssgvegito30 » Tue Nov 10, 2015 2:42 am

I heard there was a Malaysian english dub for db and dbz it was so funny it would suit as a dbz parody not for the real show the voices they make and vegeta's voice killed me lol, though I don't remember the company name that dubbed db/z in english maybe those same company got the rights from toei to get db super dubbed in Malaysian english lol this will kill the ratings of db super!!!!
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by Chuquita » Tue Nov 10, 2015 2:58 am

Was the Malaysian English dub the one that pronounced Vegeta's name as "BahGETuh"?
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Re: Official Announcement Thread & Discussion

Post by EmmaWinters » Tue Nov 10, 2015 3:03 am

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