The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread

[Hugo Boss]

Beerus doesn't seem very interested in fighting Demigra like he was in Super Saiyan God, so Demigra could be even weaker than SSG Goku.

About GT characters though, the only that I see competing with the gods in power are Omega Shenron and SS4 Gogeta. Omega Shenron, I have him as strong as Golden Freeza and SS4 Gogeta stronger than Whis or Vados.

[Khin]

I use power scaling instead of feats mostly because feats in DB anywhere are wildly inconsistent and because Supers whole 10% thing with LAWLRAGITUH pretty much cemented my original assumption that the Gods aren't really as strong as people thought they are. Here's where I stack up the characters up as if they existed side by side:

LAWLRAGITUH = SSJ GT Kid Goku: 0.125
SSJ2 GT Kid Goku: 0.25
SSJ3 GT Kid Goku: 1
SSJ4 Goku (Baby Saga): 12
- Shadow Dragon Saga: 14
Omega: 17

Where do you even scale them? we dont even know how strong SSJ God is compared to SSJ3.

We know that Goku, even as a kid, has a base strength more or less on par with Kid Boo during GT which makes him at best marginally weaker than SSJ3 BoG Goku. Rageta is completely ridiculous, but I think making him 50 stronger than SSJ3 Goku is the best out of a worst situation. I know a lot of people think he's above SSJ3 Vegetto, but I'll swallow a cyanide pill before accepting this. It just reeks of the old bullshit where every fanboy spouted "GOKU IS A QUINTILLION TIMES STRONGER THAN ON NAMEK WHEN HE FIGHTS 19!" as if it was a fact.

The way I interpret the God boost is this: you want to get to SSJ3 Vegetto levels of power? You become a God. Once I take all this into account on top of the GT stuff, the numbers just start speaking for themselves, GT tier > God tier

Where do you even get the GT Base Goku = Kid Buu? from what i remember,it was only a dub line and also with the way DB Super going,it seems like Vegeta' rage boost has something to do with him not needing the ritual to go SSJ God.And i dont even see a single guy that said Vegeta is above SSJ3 Vegetto,it was only SSJ Vegetto.

[ekrolo2]

We know that Goku, even as a kid, has a base strength more or less on par with Kid Boo during GT which makes him at best marginally weaker than SSJ3 BoG Goku. Rageta is completely ridiculous, but I think making him 50 stronger than SSJ3 Goku is the best out of a worst situation. I know a lot of people think he's above SSJ3 Vegetto, but I'll swallow a cyanide pill before accepting this. It just reeks of the old bullshit where every fanboy spouted "GOKU IS A QUINTILLION TIMES STRONGER THAN ON NAMEK WHEN HE FIGHTS 19!" as if it was a fact.

The way I interpret the God boost is this: you want to get to SSJ3 Vegetto levels of power? You become a God. Once I take all this into account on top of the GT stuff, the numbers just start speaking for themselves, GT tier > God tier

Where do you even get the GT Base Goku = Kid Buu? from what i remember,it was only a dub line and also with the way DB Super going,it seems like Vegeta' rage boost has something to do with him not needing the ritual to go SSJ God.And i dont even see a single guy that said Vegeta is above SSJ3 Vegetto,it was only SSJ Vegetto.

It comes from Goku stating that Rildo's power is even greater than Boo's which did happen in the JPN version and takes Rildo on in his base form. Upon turning SSJ, Rildo transforms once but Goku still hands him his ass, forcing him to transform a second time before he can do any damage to Goku at all. As for the Vegetto think, trust me, I've seen plenty of Rageta > SSJ3 Vegetto on the Super PL thread and on dbzf

[Khin]

It comes from Goku stating that Rildo's power is even greater than Boo's which did happen in the JPN version and takes Rildo on in his base form. Upon turning SSJ, Rildo transforms once but Goku still hands him his ass, forcing him to transform a second time before he can do any damage to Goku at all. As for the Vegetto think, trust me, I've seen plenty of Rageta > SSJ3 Vegetto on the Super PL thread and on dbzf

That statement make it looks like Goku was reffering to Good Buu and not Kid Buu,why would Goku mentions a guy he killed 15 years ago? And Good Buu is only at high SSJ2 tier.Even if Rildo is really is Kid Buu tier,that still doesnt make the GT characters stronger than the Gods since we dont know how strong Beerus is compared to Kid Buu.And also you think Vegeta pushing Beerus to use 10% of his full power as BS but you accept Goku being over 400x stronger in 15 years?

[SSJ2FutureGohan]

Rild beat up Base Gohan who's stronger than Ultimate Gohan, he's well above fodder like Innocent Boo.

[ekrolo2]

It comes from Goku stating that Rildo's power is even greater than Boo's which did happen in the JPN version and takes Rildo on in his base form. Upon turning SSJ, Rildo transforms once but Goku still hands him his ass, forcing him to transform a second time before he can do any damage to Goku at all. As for the Vegetto think, trust me, I've seen plenty of Rageta > SSJ3 Vegetto on the Super PL thread and on dbzf

That statement make it looks like Goku was reffering to Good Buu and not Kid Buu,why would Goku mentions a guy he killed 15 years ago? And Good Buu is only at high SSJ2 tier.Even if Rildo is really is Kid Buu tier,that still doesnt make the GT characters stronger than the Gods since we dont know how strong Beerus is compared to Kid Buu.And also you think Vegeta pushing Beerus to use 10% of his full power as BS but you accept Goku being over 400x stronger in 15 years?

Goku is far above Mister Boo who's probably no higher than SSJ2 Majin Vegeta on his own so I don't know why Goku would use him as any significant benchmark or be impressed by it. Since Kid Boo was the last enemy he faced and Oob maybe attaining that level of strength was his primary motivation for even reincarnating him, it stands to reason Goku is referring to Kid Boo. He could mean Bootenks or Boohan but then that just makes his strength gains even crazier so I just go with him being on Kid Boo's level.

Me hating Vegeta's power up comes more from the stupid fanboy hype around it than anything else. If people just used it to say Vegeta JUST overcame Goku while still being beneath Gotenks or Gohan, I wouldn't mind it too much. But everyone spouting LAWLRAGITUH! > SSJ3 Vegetto is what pisses me off. Goku's power up is GT is stupid too, but at least there he has 15 years of training, 5 of which is with Oob, Vegeta, a character who's bitch fits never did anything for his power somehow surpassing Vegetto is a LOT worse than a x400 boost.

[Hellspawn28]

I say GT characters are weaker then Super characters since nothing in GT has anything that puts them on that level. Goku's statements in GT wit Super Yi Xing Long being the strongest opponent ever may not be even relevant anymore. Fans don't view Goku comment on Buu being the strongest opponent that he has fought at the end of the manga anymore given how Beerus and Golden Freeza are way above Buu in terms of power.

[Captain Space]

I think it's less an issue of any kind of relative-power-scaling comparison, and more an issue of the gods' battle being enough to destroy the entire universe with the mere aftershock of three clashes...

[ekrolo2]

I think it's less an issue of any kind of relative-power-scaling comparison, and more an issue of the gods' battle being enough to destroy the entire universe with the mere aftershock of three clashes...

I think that has less to do with power and more to do with the fact they're Gods. I 100% believe that the Boo Saga tier characters can basically do the same level of destruction, but because Goku and Beerus are beings using a sort of transcended energy as a source for their attacks, it can affect things in a far more adverse way than regular Ki. Their shockwaves are even crossing over into the realms of Kais and I think even the afterlife.

[Captain Space]

I think it's less an issue of any kind of relative-power-scaling comparison, and more an issue of the gods' battle being enough to destroy the entire universe with the mere aftershock of three clashes...

I think that has less to do with power and more to do with the fact they're Gods. I 100% believe that the Boo Saga tier characters can basically do the same level of destruction, but because Goku and Beerus are beings using a sort of transcended energy as a source for their attacks, it can affect things in a far more adverse way than regular Ki. Their shockwaves are even crossing over into the realms of Kais and I think even the afterlife.

I mean, there's nothing to outright contradict that, but there's no evidence for it, or indeed for anybody in the manga's run being able to cause that kind of destruction, so I'm gonna go with "that's just how much force they're throwing into it" myself.

[ekrolo2]

I think it's less an issue of any kind of relative-power-scaling comparison, and more an issue of the gods' battle being enough to destroy the entire universe with the mere aftershock of three clashes...

I think that has less to do with power and more to do with the fact they're Gods. I 100% believe that the Boo Saga tier characters can basically do the same level of destruction, but because Goku and Beerus are beings using a sort of transcended energy as a source for their attacks, it can affect things in a far more adverse way than regular Ki. Their shockwaves are even crossing over into the realms of Kais and I think even the afterlife.

I mean, there's nothing to outright contradict that, but there's no evidence for it, or indeed for anybody in the manga's run being able to cause that kind of destruction, so I'm gonna go with "that's just how much force they're throwing into it" myself.

I can see why since my idea can seem like an over complication of something that might just be "they're just that strong" lol. But to me, the whole shockwaves reaching into completely different dimensions, even into the afterlife is kind of a giveaway there's something more going on than just pure strength.

[Captain Space]

Well, it's certainly derived from a more-than-physical source and doesn't work quite like 'normal strength', but it's still a feat of destructive force well beyond anything seen in GT.

[SSGSS Vegetto]

GT and Super are two different continuities, one took place years before the other, every era has the greatest villain it needs in Dragon Ball, it is the main key of Dragon Ball, the fact that Super is produced after GT is the thing that GT fans take advantage of, I am a fan of the whole Dragon Ball franchise, trust me, but the feats. shown in Super are nowhere shown in GT, GT although took place after Super, but it isn't consistent, whereas talking about Super, and especially the God topic, taking into account that Beerus, Whis and the other Kais and Kaioshins had been existing since the start, assuming 75 million years, and from then Beerus is training, someone training for this much time, what would be their regular ki? You have to think about it.

[Angelus]

Buffed Forms Ginger, Nicky, Sansho VS Tien, Krillin, Yamcha, Chiaotzu, Popo, Korin, Yajirobe, Roshi -- All shortly before the start of Z. No Tribeam/Solar Flare/Paralysis

[RandomGuy96]

Garlic's goons could actually give Goku and Piccolo trouble. The humans were all considered worthless in a fight against a half-dead Piccolo. So this is an easy one.

[Angelus]

Garlic's goons could actually give Goku and Piccolo trouble. The humans were all considered worthless in a fight against a half-dead Piccolo. So this is an easy one.

That's because it was a 4 on 1 in the beginning. It was 3 of Garlic's goons and a buff Garlic Jr. himself that mobbed Piccolo in the beginning of the film. Base Garlic Jr. is slightly more powerful than Kami. When Piccolo actually fought one of Garlic's goons, he just punched the goon through a wall and through some pillars with little effort. Even Goku seemed to be being silly when fighting the 2 other goons. Both of which were easily dispatched by a single kamehameha.

[Birusu16]

You can't just powerscale GT from Super. Super never happened in the GT universe. They're basically two entirely different timelines and thus the only way to compare them is via feats. In that regard Super absolutely demolishes GT.

[ekrolo2]

You can't just powerscale GT from Super. Super never happened in the GT universe. They're basically two entirely different timelines and thus the only way to compare them is via feats. In that regard Super absolutely demolishes GT.

You actually can powerscale them since GT gives you plenty of parallels to draw from on top of LAWLRAGITUHS being able to force Beerus to use 10% of his power. Plus feats in DB either don't make sense or are wildly inconcsistent so I don't really trust them.

[Birusu16]

You can't just powerscale GT from Super. Super never happened in the GT universe. They're basically two entirely different timelines and thus the only way to compare them is via feats. In that regard Super absolutely demolishes GT.

You actually can powerscale them since GT gives you plenty of parallels to draw from on top of LAWLRAGITUHS being able to force Beerus to use 10% of his power. Plus feats in DB either don't make sense or are wildly inconcsistent so I don't really trust them.

No, you really can't because Super doesn't take place in the same continuity as GT. And you don't have to trust them. Fact is they're there and they're far above anything GT has ever shown and because of that GT has absolutely nothing on Super in terms of power in my eyes. When GT has any feats capable of outright destroying the universe in 3 physical blows then I might be persuaded otherwise.

[ekrolo2]

You can't just powerscale GT from Super. Super never happened in the GT universe. They're basically two entirely different timelines and thus the only way to compare them is via feats. In that regard Super absolutely demolishes GT.

You actually can powerscale them since GT gives you plenty of parallels to draw from on top of LAWLRAGITUHS being able to force Beerus to use 10% of his power. Plus feats in DB either don't make sense or are wildly inconcsistent so I don't really trust them.

No, you really can't because Super doesn't take place in the same continuity as GT. And you don't have to trust them. Fact is they're there and they're far above anything GT has ever shown and because of that GT has absolutely nothing on Super in terms of power in my eyes. When GT has any feats capable of outright destroying the universe in 3 physical blows then I might be persuaded otherwise.

Ah, so your whole defense is feats = facts and anything else is wrong. Right, I've had this discussion plenty of times enough lately to see it would be more productive to smash my face against a beaver damn. I already made my case in my previous comments as to why I think the whole Super feats thing is just more stupid fanboy bullshit overblowing power levels to the point of absurdity until BoG basically shot them in the face by saying Base Saiyan's > Max Freeza.

I don't trust feats, usually because people just throw them around without putting any thought into the context in which they're happening or just taking them at complete face value.