Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by ahill1 » Mon Feb 01, 2016 6:08 pm

Lord Beerus wrote:
ahill1 wrote:Dragon Ball battle powers
Spoiler:
Um... what? :shock:

Those Battle Power's are all kinds of improper. And goes against the story of the manga in every conceivable way. Unless in you're mind the story ended at the 23rd Tenkaichi Budokai and Dragon Ball Z takes place in an alternate universe. But even then, these Battle Power's still make no sense at all. :?

Like DanielSSJ said, this is a non-scouter list, as they seem very inconsistent with the implied gaps. This method has been popularised on many forums since the inconsistencies created with the numbers given in Raditz's arrival.

They're just impossible if you use the statements. Less than half old Piccolo Daimao tanks Goku's Kamehameha and young Piccolo Daimao is so stronger than his old self that there's no comparison between their powers.
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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by Noah » Mon Feb 01, 2016 10:41 pm

ahill1 wrote:Like DanielSSJ said, this is a non-scouter list, as they seem very inconsistent with the implied gaps. This method has been popularised on many forums since the inconsistencies created with the numbers given in Raditz's arrival.

They're just impossible if you use the statements. Less than half old Piccolo Daimao tanks Goku's Kamehameha and young Piccolo Daimao is so stronger than his old self that there's no comparison between their powers.
You care to mention which more inconsistencies?
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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by apex_pretador » Tue Feb 02, 2016 10:07 am

ahill1 wrote: Like DanielSSJ said, this is a non-scouter list, as they seem very inconsistent with the implied gaps. This method has been popularised on many forums since the inconsistencies created with the numbers given in Raditz's arrival.

They're just impossible if you use the statements. Less than half old Piccolo Daimao tanks Goku's Kamehameha and young Piccolo Daimao is so stronger than his old self that there's no comparison between their powers.
There aren't any inconsistencies.

When was daimao "less than half" ? I don't remember when he said that. You sure about the translation ?
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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by dbgtFO » Tue Feb 02, 2016 11:25 am

apex_pretador wrote:
ahill1 wrote: Like DanielSSJ said, this is a non-scouter list, as they seem very inconsistent with the implied gaps. This method has been popularised on many forums since the inconsistencies created with the numbers given in Raditz's arrival.

They're just impossible if you use the statements. Less than half old Piccolo Daimao tanks Goku's Kamehameha and young Piccolo Daimao is so stronger than his old self that there's no comparison between their powers.
There aren't any inconsistencies.

When was daimao "less than half" ? I don't remember when he said that. You sure about the translation ?
It was just before he tanked Goku's Kamehameha. Any translation worth its salt has it as "I'm not even using half my power.." (paraphrased).
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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by emperior » Tue Feb 02, 2016 11:59 am

It's the first time I've tried to do a power levels list. I've tried to stay as low as possible.
I don't really care about power levels as they are long gone from the series. Anyways, if you notice any error/incongruence in my list, let me know.


Multipliers
Oozaru - 10x base
SSJ - 50x Base
SSJ Grade 2 - 60x Base with 5% speed loss
SSJ Grade 3 - 80x Base with 10% speed loss
FPSSJ - 60x Base with no drawbacks
SSJ2 - 100x Base
SSJ3 - 200x Base

Fusions
Dance = [(A+B) + (A+B)] x 2 also [(A+B)] x 8
Potara (Manga) = Fusion Dance x 50
Potara (Anime) = Fusion Dance x 250

Dragon Ball Z


Raditz Arc
Spoiler:

Saiyan Saga
Spoiler:

Namek Arc
Spoiler:
Freezer’s Saga
Spoiler:
Trunks Arc
Spoiler:
Android Saga
Spoiler:
Cell Saga
Spoiler:
Cell Games
Spoiler:
The Future
Spoiler:

Babidi Saga
Spoiler:
Buu Saga
Spoiler:

Dragon Ball Super

With Super, power levels get so high it's impossible to calculate them. I will base power levels from Toriyama's statement of God Goku being 6, Beerus at 70% being a 7, Full Power 10, and Whis 15 and use it as a base to make power levels.

Battle of Gods Arc
Spoiler:
Revival of Freezer Arc
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Last edited by emperior on Sat Feb 06, 2016 10:12 am, edited 28 times in total.
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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by DanielSSJ » Tue Feb 02, 2016 2:14 pm

emperior wrote:It's the first time I've tried to do a power levels list. I've tried to stay as low as possible. By the way I don't really care about power levels as they are long gone.


Multipliers
Oozaru - 10x base
SSJ - 50x Base
SSJ Grade 2 - 60x Base with 5% speed loss
SSJ Grade 3 - 80x Base with 10% speed loss
FPSSJ - 60x Base with no speed loss
SSJ2 - 100x Base
SSJ3 - 200x Base

Fusions
Dance - [(A+B) + (A+B)] x 2
Potara - ???

Main Story

Trunks Saga
Spoiler:
Android Saga
Spoiler:
Cell Saga
Spoiler:
Cell Games
Spoiler:
The Future
Spoiler:

Majin Buu Saga
Spoiler:
Fusion Saga
Spoiler:
Okay I noticed a few problems.
1. Why are Kuririn and the others on par with 50% Freeza? Why are they above the base Saiyans?
2. The Future Androids should be about twice as strong as Freeza Arc SS Goku, based on 17's line about not using half his full power against Gohan. Their present day counterparts should be stronger as well.
3. About half of Goku's FPSS power was enough to cause Vegeta and the others to freak out. He and Gohan should be a lot stronger.
4. Mr. Satan and Videl being in the hundreds is a gross overestimation.
5. Spopovich and Yamu should be higher than Videl.
6. Super Saiyan 3 should be 400x base, but I can understand if you want to ignore it.
7. Daizenshuu implies that Gotenks only surpassed Majin Vegeta after his trip in the Room of Spirit and Time.
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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by emperior » Tue Feb 02, 2016 3:25 pm

DanielSSJ wrote:
emperior wrote:[/spoiler]
Okay I noticed a few problems.
1. Why are Kuririn and the others on par with 50% Freeza? Why are they above the base Saiyans?
2. The Future Androids should be about twice as strong as Freeza Arc SS Goku, based on 17's line about not using half his full power against Gohan. Their present day counterparts should be stronger as well.
3. About half of Goku's FPSS power was enough to cause Vegeta and the others to freak out. He and Gohan should be a lot stronger.
4. Mr. Satan and Videl being in the hundreds is a gross overestimation.
5. Spopovich and Yamu should be higher than Videl.
6. Super Saiyan 3 should be 400x base, but I can understand if you want to ignore it.
7. Daizenshuu implies that Gotenks only surpassed Majin Vegeta after his trip in the Room of Spirit and Time.

1. That was a stupid decision by me, I basically based earthlings powers basing from Tenshinan holding Imperfect Cell back three times. I have now fixed their power levels so they are weaker than base Saiyans cause no way earthlings are stronger than base Saiyans. Tenshinan Neo Tri-Beam is 100x his power level.
2. I have written power levels of Future Gohan, I've made he weaker than SSJ Goku before he died, as he stated he used Goku's gi to try being as strong as he was, but admitted it didn't work. I also made the androids of the future as strong as their past counterparts, assuming they never used their true power against Trunks or else he would be dead.
3. When I decided FPSSJ Goku's power my idea was that Vegeta and the others clearly knew Goku was only at 50%, this is way they were so amazed by it. Remember Z Fighters CLEARLY know when someone is suppressing their power as Gohan and Krillin were able to see the Namekians holding back and there was no clue at all they were holding back. I don't think it's possible 50% Goku was stronger than Vegeta and Trunks. This way I can also prevent power levels from going crazy high.
4. You are probably right about that, I will fix them.
5. Videl clearly had the upper hand over Spopovich, he was able to win because she got tired out and he was practically a zombie.
6. I don't remember it being stated in the manga, and it also makes power levels way too high.
7. I don't care about what Daizenshuu stated because if Gotenks would have been weaker than Majin Vegeta, then no way Goku wouldn't have tried to kill Buu by himself. He clearly knew SSJ Gotenks > Buu. The fusion was hyped up as a very powerful technique by Goku himself.
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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by DanielSSJ » Tue Feb 02, 2016 4:11 pm

emperior wrote:
DanielSSJ wrote:
emperior wrote:[/spoiler]
Okay I noticed a few problems.
1. Why are Kuririn and the others on par with 50% Freeza? Why are they above the base Saiyans?
2. The Future Androids should be about twice as strong as Freeza Arc SS Goku, based on 17's line about not using half his full power against Gohan. Their present day counterparts should be stronger as well.
3. About half of Goku's FPSS power was enough to cause Vegeta and the others to freak out. He and Gohan should be a lot stronger.
4. Mr. Satan and Videl being in the hundreds is a gross overestimation.
5. Spopovich and Yamu should be higher than Videl.
6. Super Saiyan 3 should be 400x base, but I can understand if you want to ignore it.
7. Daizenshuu implies that Gotenks only surpassed Majin Vegeta after his trip in the Room of Spirit and Time.

1. That was a stupid decision by me, I basically based earthlings powers basing from Tenshinan holding Imperfect Cell back three times. I have now fixed their power levels so they are weaker than base Saiyans cause no way earthlings are stronger than base Saiyans. Tenshinan Neo Tri-Beam is 100x his power level.
2. I have written power levels of Future Gohan, I've made he weaker than SSJ Goku before he died, as he stated he used Goku's gi to try being as strong as he was, but admitted it didn't work. I also made the androids of the future as strong as their past counterparts, assuming they never used their true power against Trunks or else he would be dead.
3. When I decided FPSSJ Goku's power my idea was that Vegeta and the others clearly knew Goku was only at 50%, this is way they were so amazed by it. Remember Z Fighters CLEARLY know when someone is suppressing their power as Gohan and Krillin were able to see the Namekians holding back and there was no clue at all they were holding back. I don't think it's possible 50% Goku was stronger than Vegeta and Trunks. This way I can also prevent power levels from going crazy high.
4. You are probably right about that, I will fix them.
5. Videl clearly had the upper hand over Spopovich, he was able to win because she got tired out and he was practically a zombie.
6. I don't remember it being stated in the manga, and it also makes power levels way too high.
7. I don't care about what Daizenshuu stated because if Gotenks would have been weaker than Majin Vegeta, then no way Goku wouldn't have tried to kill Buu by himself. He clearly knew SSJ Gotenks > Buu. The fusion was hyped up as a very powerful technique by Goku himself.
- Fair enough about the future androids. I've seen that theory before, and while I don't subscribe to it, I can see its merit.
- As far as Goku's half power argument, Kuririn could tell that the Namekian's were holding back because he knows Piccolo and Kami were able to do so. No one could tell that Freeza was holding back his strength when they fought his final form. In fact Goku thought that he might've been bluffing. No one but Karin and Gohan should've known that Goku was at half strength.
- Vegeta notes that Spopy was holding back in their fight as to not kill her. As far as Videl being able to beat him up for a while despite such a power advantage, since Spopy's Ki was magically enhanced, his body didn't get physically tougher like it would've if you train normally. This didn't happen with Babidi's other warriors because they're already used to fighting at superhuman levels and can use their Ki to increase their defenses.
- Never stated in the manga, but The Super Exciting Guide states the multipliers for Super Saiyan 2 and 3. Like I said, I understand if you choose to ignore it.
- Have it your way, but I don't think Goku's really doing any math calculations in his head when he suggested fusion. He just knows that they'll get ridiculously strong, hopefully strong enough to beat Fat Boo
- Also, I noticed a problem with your Kibito, Kaioshin, and Piccolo levels. Piccolo is stated in the manga and the guidebooks to be weaker than Kaioshin. Also Kibito is implied in the manga and stated in the guidebooks to be about as strong as base form Gohan.
-
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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by emperior » Tue Feb 02, 2016 4:23 pm

As per your suggestion, I've changed Kaioshin and Kibito power levels. Now Kaioshin is stronger than Piccolo and Kibito is exactly on the same level as Base Gohan.

I understand your point on Goku's half power statement but I'm going to assume the others knew he was holding back a lot, probably by knowing how much time it usually takes Goku to power up at max his power, probably noticing he HAD to stop because he was almost destroying Kami's lookout.
If I had to make 50% Goku stronger than Grade 2 Vegeta, ALL power levels would sky rocket and I would have to adjust my entire power levels list. I also quite like the fact that I basically guessed that when Cell absorbs one of the androids, he gains all his power level. So Semi-Perfect Cell is Imperfect Cell + 17, and Perfect Cell is Imperfect Cell + 17 + 18.

I stand by the fact that Goku, having seen the Metamorans using the fusion, knew how strong a fused being can get, so yeah, he basically did math calculations. Also SSJ Gotenks was quite confident in beating Buu, and considering the first time he tried to fight Buu he was very injured after the battle, I guess he understood how strong of an opponent Buu was.


- By the way, I decided to add Super's power levels, if you guys notice something wrong let me know.
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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by SSJ2FutureGohan » Tue Feb 02, 2016 4:57 pm

DanielSSJ wrote:Also Kibito is implied in the manga and stated in the guidebooks to be about as strong as base form Gohan.
Kibito is never implied outside of guidebooks to be anywhere near as strong as Base Gohan.
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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by Helios518 » Tue Feb 02, 2016 5:27 pm

Is SSJ Goten and Trunks (Pre Rosat) stronger than Piccolo (Buu Saga)? I ask because this manga page seems to imply that kids are stronger than Piccolo and Piccolo didn't even know about fusion at this time.
Spoiler:
or Is their a context I'm missing?
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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by ekrolo2 » Tue Feb 02, 2016 5:51 pm

Helios518 wrote:Is SSJ Goten and Trunks (Pre Rosat) stronger than Piccolo (Buu Saga)? I ask because this manga page seems to imply that kids are stronger than Piccolo and Piccolo didn't even know about fusion at this time.
Spoiler:
or Is their a context I'm missing?
They're close to Gohan and Vegeta in strength as SSJs and we know those guys are above Piccolo.
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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by ThePiccolo » Tue Feb 02, 2016 7:23 pm

emperior wrote:It's the first time I've tried to do a power levels list. I've tried to stay as low as possible. By the way I don't really care about power levels as they are long gone from the series. Anyways, if you notice any error/incongruence in my list, let me know.

<SNIP>
Hope you don't mind, just wanted to add my two cents
- Don't you think the gap between Kamicollo and Imperfect Cell (Humans Absorbed) should be bigger? Cell did tank a light grenade from Piccolo, after all
- During the Cell Games, Cell was said to have suppressed a lot of his power, yet it seems Cell is using more than 90% of his power against FPSSJ Gohan
- Piccolo performed better against a Cell Jr than a tired Goku did
- I think you have Goku and Vegeta too close in the Buu Saga, considering Vegeta let himself be controlled after only seeing a bit of SSJ2 Goku's power against Yakon
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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by Khin » Wed Feb 03, 2016 1:10 am

Can't some of you guys put your PL list into spoiler ? It's way easier to read that way.

Helios518 wrote:Is SSJ Goten and Trunks (Pre Rosat) stronger than Piccolo (Buu Saga)? I ask because this manga page seems to imply that kids are stronger than Piccolo and Piccolo didn't even know about fusion at this time.[/spoiler]
or Is their a context I'm missing?
It's true.
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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by Kaboom » Wed Feb 03, 2016 1:42 am

That doesn't necessarily mean they're stronger than him. Future Gohan said the same thing about the young Future Trunks, who was definitely still inferior to him. In the same way, Piccolo's seen how strong these kids already are and would definitely figure they have amazing potential for further growth. Even if they're not stronger than him already (I don't think they are, but are close to him), they could be very quickly.
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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by Khin » Wed Feb 03, 2016 1:55 am

Kaboom wrote:That doesn't necessarily mean they're stronger than him. Future Gohan said the same thing about the young Future Trunks, who was definitely still inferior to him. In the same way, Piccolo's seen how strong these kids already are and would definitely figure they have amazing potential for further growth. Even if they're not stronger than him already (I don't think they are, but are close to him), they could be very quickly.
What i'm saying is that the line about Piccolo stating the kids are the only hope of the earth is not a mistranslation or is true.(I still think the kids are above Piccolo though)
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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by emperior » Wed Feb 03, 2016 6:08 am

ThePiccolo wrote:
emperior wrote:It's the first time I've tried to do a power levels list. I've tried to stay as low as possible. By the way I don't really care about power levels as they are long gone from the series. Anyways, if you notice any error/incongruence in my list, let me know.

<SNIP>
Hope you don't mind, just wanted to add my two cents
- Don't you think the gap between Kamicollo and Imperfect Cell (Humans Absorbed) should be bigger? Cell did tank a light grenade from Piccolo, after all
- During the Cell Games, Cell was said to have suppressed a lot of his power, yet it seems Cell is using more than 90% of his power against FPSSJ Gohan
- Piccolo performed better against a Cell Jr than a tired Goku did
- I think you have Goku and Vegeta too close in the Buu Saga, considering Vegeta let himself be controlled after only seeing a bit of SSJ2 Goku's power against Yakon

- I think the gap is just fine, I consider 10 milion as a big gap between two fighters, you have also to consider Kamiccolo was worn out after the battle with 17 so it makes sense his light grenade wasn't strong enough to hurt Cell at all, considering the gap was probably around 30 milion basing from my list.
- Suppressing many milions in terms of power levels is a lot, in my opinion. The idea is that he suppressed enough to be on par with Goku or Gohan at first, but if he wanted he could have wrecked them.
- You are right, I've decided to make Goku a lot more worn out by the battle against Cell. Specifically, I assume he was so worn out he lost half his powers.
- I think it's fine this way, Goku also noticed Vegeta trained a lot during the 7 years, maybe even harder than himself, and I assume Vegeta got himself controlled by Babidi just for closing the little gap the two still had. Even if he didn't sense Goku's full power, he realized he was still a step behind him, and I don't think being controlled by Babidi gives a huge power boost, but it was just enough for Vegeta to be perfectly on par with Goku.
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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by DanielSSJ » Wed Feb 03, 2016 12:13 pm

So does anyone have a serious power level for Ten's Shin Kikoho?
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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by apex_pretador » Wed Feb 03, 2016 1:55 pm

DanielSSJ wrote:So does anyone have a serious power level for Ten's Shin Kikoho?
I don't feel like it is a good idea to do the power levels for ki attacks.
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Re: The Official Unofficial Power Levels Thread

Post by apex_pretador » Wed Feb 03, 2016 2:05 pm

emperior wrote:It's the first time I've tried to do a power levels list. I've tried to stay as low as possible.
I don't really care about power levels as they are long gone from the series. Anyways, if you notice any error/incongruence in my list, let me know.


Multipliers
Oozaru - 10x base
SSJ - 50x Base
SSJ Grade 2 - 60x Base with 5% speed loss
SSJ Grade 3 - 80x Base with 10% speed loss
FPSSJ - 60x Base with no drawbacks
SSJ2 - 100x Base
SSJ3 - 200x Base

Fusions
Dance - [(A+B) + (A+B)] x 2
Potara - ??? (Potara >>> Fusion Dance)

Dragon Ball Z

Trunks Arc
Spoiler:
Android Saga
Spoiler:
Cell Saga
Spoiler:
Cell Games
Spoiler:
The Future
Spoiler:

Majin Buu's resurrection
Spoiler:
Buu Saga
Spoiler:

Dragon Ball Super

With Super, power levels get so high it's impossible to calculate them. I will base power levels from Toriyama's statement of God Goku being 6, Beerus at 70% being a 7, Full Power 10, and Whis 15 and use it as a base to make power levels.

Battle of Gods Arc
Spoiler:
Revival of Freezer Arc
Spoiler:
- Imperfect cell is too close to piccolo in both pre & post. He must be MUCH farther apart pre & post.

- Mr Satan 50 ? :shock: :shock: ? 50 is too much IMO. Going by BoZ levels, it will be around 21st TB goku level.

- How does piccolo get weaker in buu arc ? He was confident in entering the tournament, and as stated by toriyama, he regularly trains.

- It is a good idea to use different scale for DBS, but I feel like tagoma is too high on the list
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