"Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

[UpFromTheSkies]

While I'm kind of happy to see normal SS return, I do wonder why he wouldn't just use SSB. As far as we know it has no limitations like SS3, so there's no reason not to use it and just take care of business.

[TheMikado]

I think I'll go with DBZGTKOSDH theory:

Maybe after his training inside the RoSaT, he has full control of the Super Saiyan God power, so he can turn it on & off in his regular form? So, it would work like this:

Regular form (Base) ⇒ Super Saiyan ⇒ Super Saiyan 2 ⇒ Super Saiyan 3
⇓
Super Saiyan God

Regular form (Base) with SSG power ⇒ Super Saiyan Blue

I'm fine with this too as long as it's an explanation, but it would make the progression too cluttered in my opinion and I thought Akira wanted to simplify the transformations.

Also how did Goku first fight frost than? Was Goku base (base) or base (God ki). If he was base God, why would he go
Base God Ki down to full base then powerup to SSJ which is actually slightly weaker than Base God?

[alakazam^]

I don't really remember how it went but maybe Freeza asking Goku to become Gold and him saying he didn't need to while still turning Blue makes more sense now?

Anyway, how strong do you feel Frost is? He felt the need to go to his Final Form just by seeing Gold but I think he's not strong at all (at least for Boo-level standards). Goku still loses though, but it's hard for me to think he'd power up so much by just transforming one more time. Unless he's hiding one more transformation which is totally possible but the episode has no time for that

[Sodhi]

Anyway, how strong do you feel Frost is? He felt the need to go to his Final Form just by seeing Gold but I think he's not strong at all (at least for Boo-level standards). Goku still loses though, but it's hard for me to think he'd power up so much by just transforming one more time. Unless he's hiding one more transformation which is totally possible but the episode has no time for that

Frost is stronger than Freeza for sure. His third form made goku go ssj or ssb whatever. While freeza struggled to do anything to goku even with his final form. So I see frost beating goku, without even going golden(or whatever color he chooses).

[LightBing]

I don't really remember how it went but maybe Freeza asking Goku to become Gold and him saying he didn't need to while still turning Blue makes more sense now?

Anyway, how strong do you feel Frost is? He felt the need to go to his Final Form just by seeing Gold but I think he's not strong at all (at least for Boo-level standards). Goku still loses though, but it's hard for me to think he'd power up so much by just transforming one more time. Unless he's hiding one more transformation which is totally possible but the episode has no time for that

I also think he's pretty weak, Goku took a direct hit and was doing stretches unaffected. Although if he follows Freeza's patterns this transformation could be 99% of the power and he's been going at 1% or less.

[Sandubadear]

First form Frost is maybe on par with True form Freeza, or just slightly below. Frost's second form (or third?) is probably stronger than true form Freeza. Let's see how strong he is in the true form.

[Lord Frieza]

Frost must be quit strong if he can keep up with thus Goku in a warm up fight in his first form and make Goku use what looks like normal SSJ in his second form, so by default he already far more powerful then Frieza in his mastered final form.

If Frost is Frieza's opposite then as a good galactic emperor he may have been fighting aginst evil forces for years keeping his universe safe. Makes lazy Frieza's 4 months after years of indolence look pathetic.

[Noah]

I wonder if a hypothetical "Silver" Frost would be stronger enough to defeat Beerus.

[Lord Frieza]

I wonder if a hypothetical "Silver" Frost would be stronger enough to defeat Beerus.

We'd need to see how powerful his final form is before trying to guess. If he forces Goku to use SSGSS then there is the possibility that he would be that strong. But since his final form is much more powerful then Frieza's the chances are high in my opinion.

[LightBing]

Frost must be quit strong if he can keep up with thus Goku in a warm up fight in his first form and make Goku use what looks like normal SSJ in his second form, so by default he already far more powerful then Freeza in his mastered final form.

If Frost is Freeza's opposite then as a good galactic emperor he may have been fighting aginst evil forces for years keeping his universe safe. Makes lazy Freeza's 4 months after years of indolence look pathetic.

He didn't force Goku to transform, Goku went SSJ because he knew Frost was hiding transformations and wanted him to use them.
Goku has been cruising, not Botamo or the first two forms of Frost did anything to him..., not even a scratch. Since Goku was doing stretches after receiving an attacked from Second Form Frost, it's likely he didn't even serve as a warm up.

[Lord Frieza]

Frost must be quit strong if he can keep up with thus Goku in a warm up fight in his first form and make Goku use what looks like normal SSJ in his second form, so by default he already far more powerful then Freeza in his mastered final form.

If Frost is Freeza's opposite then as a good galactic emperor he may have been fighting aginst evil forces for years keeping his universe safe. Makes lazy Freeza's 4 months after years of indolence look pathetic.

He didn't force Goku to transform, Goku went SSJ because he knew Frost was hiding transformations and wanted him to use them.
Goku has been cruising, not Botamo or the first two forms of Frost did anything to him..., not even a scratch. Since Goku was doing stretches after receiving an attacked from Second Form Frost, it's likely he didn't even serve as a warm up.

Had a quick refresher of the chapter and you seem to be right.

[Xeztin]

I wonder if a hypothetical "Silver" Frost would be stronger enough to defeat Beerus.

I really hope we have a Silver Frost, I still think He and Goku are holding back. (Golden Form and SSJB)

[Tsufuru]

did any1 notice that botama got 4 fingers on the cover but only 3 in the chapter?

which one is right?

[Xeztin]

did any1 notice that botama got 4 fingers on the cover but only 3 in the chapter?

which one is right?

I didn't notice the cover but always noticed he had 3 fingers in the manga itself, so I believe the cover was a mistake.

[TheDevilsCorpse]

did any1 notice that botama got 4 fingers on the cover but only 3 in the chapter?

which one is right?

There were plenty of characters that had less than the standard digits in the manga (Namekians, Dodoria, first form Cell, most Buu forms, etc.). It's entirely possible that Toriyama wanted Botamo to only have 3 fingers as well, but Japan has laws/regulations on depicting humanoid characters with less than the standard 4 fingers and a thumb hand design because of their history with yubitsume (the act of cutting off a finger to pay for a crime, usually via the burakumin or yakuza). Using a design with less digits will result in a fine for anything intended to be shown on TV. So the anime and promotional artwork would be forced to follow that, while Toyotaro could stick to Toriyama's intention.

Though, since what I've seen of Toriyama's artwork doesn't show Botamo's fingers, it's also possible that Toyotaro chose to use less fingers after he got Toriyama's designs, but before the anime settei were completed. We know the manga has differences because he reached story points before production material was completed (the tournament grounds, Jaco's new ship, etc).

[Xeztin]

did any1 notice that botama got 4 fingers on the cover but only 3 in the chapter?

which one is right?

There were plenty of characters that had less than the standard digits in the manga (Namekians, Dodoria, first form Cell, most Buu forms, etc.). It's entirely possible that Toriyama wanted Botamo to only have 3 fingers as well, but Japan has laws/regulations on depicting humanoid characters with less than the standard 4 fingers and a thumb hand design because of their history with yubitsume (the act of cutting off a finger to pay for a crime, usually via the burakumin or yakuza). Using a design with less digits will result in a fine for anything intended to be shown on TV. So the anime and promotional artwork would be forced to follow that, while Toyotaro could stick to Toriyama's intention.

Though, since what I've seen of Toriyama's artwork doesn't show Botamo's fingers, it's also possible that Toyotaro chose to use less fingers after he got Toriyama's designs, but before the anime settei were completed. We know the manga has differences because he reached story points before production material was completed (the tournament grounds, Jaco's new ship, etc).

Could this also be the reason why Boo in the anime had all fingers, while in the manga he had no fingers and a thumb? (His hands where sort of the same shape as Mister Boo's gloves).

[TheDevilsCorpse]

The yubitsume regulations thing isn't recent. It's the reason why all the character in the manga with visible fingers totaling less than a normal human's got bumped up to the human standard for the anime.

[Neon Z]

I really don't understand why people think Goku using regular Super Saiyan means Blue is gone, that's a pretty huge leap in logic...

There is no logic. Those people just want Blue to be gone.

Nah. It's the other way around. I fear that they'll suddenly get rid of SSJ Blue just like how they got rid of SSJ God (even though in the movie at one point Goku was shown transforming into that by himself), and I really don't want that.

Besides, something would have been said about it, just like against Beerus.
Characters would have been surprised, and/or Vegeta would have said "yeah, we kept our God powers, but no more blue hair".
Instead, nobody is surprised: Goku has just turned Super Saiyan instead of Super Saiyan God (with blue hair). No big deal, nothing replaced.

On the other hand, in the first half of the chapter, when people talk about how Goku could still power up to attempt to hurt his opponent, they only mention SSJ, nothing about SSJ Blue.

[Sodhi]

Goku kicks Frost, Frost loses balance but use his tail like a rope on Goku's legs.
Frost punches Goku's guts. Goku vomits blood.

Ah ha! Who wanna bet we'll not see this scene in the anime?

We can certainly have that scene, just like these two.

[ROCKYIII]

How strong are these guys compared to buu saga? All these guys are like 5X vegitto from buu saga? What's the deal here I'm lost.