"Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

[Lord Beerus]

Why are some of you so obsessed with seeing blood?

Because if there's no blood it doesn't have that badass feeling of violence, which is a BIG part of dragonball. Action and violence. You can't go backwards and go from blood to no blood, it's childish to have no blood.

I agree with Vegito's statement, you need to appeal to kids but you can't make dragonball FOR kids. That limits the market. Do what Star Wars does.

But George Lucas also made Star Wars for kids.

[Draconic]

For me it's because showing blood makes it seem like the characters are actually getting hurt. Super's battle damage looks pretty bad as a whole and most of the time the characters look like they've been drawn on with permanent marker on their faces, not actually dusty or bruised, but that is a problem with the art direction in general. Adding blood helps the illusion. I don't get why some people seem to be against the idea. And the whole children issue, I've seen Goku punch trough Daimao when I was 4 and Piccolo ripping his arm off at 5 and it didn't give me nightmares. I thought it was cool as hell. Kids can handle that stuff. BoG had blood, RoF had blood. Why not Super? It's not like I'm asking for Berserk level violence... Just some splashes when the situation calls for it.

[kinisking]

LOL can't make dragonball "for kids". Dragonball has been for kids since the beginning. It just happens to appeal to adults.

[Blade]

The presence of more violence and graphic injuries in the old Dragonball Z anime has nothing to do with the show being aimed at a different target audience - but with a set of Japanese cultural attitudes that have became a lot more stringent over the last 20 years under increasing Western influence.

Whilst blood, guts and violence have always been associated with mature content in the Western world, in Japan, traditionally, the distinction between fictional works and reality has always been a lot more clear-cut. The depiction of physical injuries, and the depiction of actual harm, have always been two very different things - and said gap between fiction and reality has always made the event of children emulating the violent acts depicted in anime a lot less likely in Japan than in America.

To give an example of what I mean, think back to when Power Rangers first made it big in America. Reports of kids trying to emulate the violent stunts hit the press in a big way, whereas in Japan, young people simply didn't see the stunts of the actors on-screen and mistake them for things that could, or should be replicated in real life. The whole 'these events are fictional and all stunts are performed by trained professionals' disclaimer is the sort of fail-safe warning that Japanese cultural attitudes simply did not necessitate - the distinction was abundantly clear to the kids.

And before anyone hops in and says 'American kids are dumb' or anything of the sort - it's completely not what I'm getting at. In Japan, dramatic performances in general are pretty detatched from normal life - even in the way in which people talk and the words that are used. If you try to learn conversational Japanese by replicating vocabulary and speech from anime, you're not going to get very far - people don't talk like that. Western drama, on the other hand, always goes for less of a suspension of disbelief; it's all about art replicating life.

[buutenks]

I dont mind the lack of blood. Seeing blood in dbz or db or now super was never important to me. I could tell they were getting hurt just from their reaction.

Also, the reason for lack of blood is most likely due to new laws on what is allowed and what is not. Allot of things can change in 20 years.

So i doubt super will show the level of violence dbz and db showed, due to not being allowed anymore.

[Chuquita]

I think the time slot factors in too. Z aired Wednesday evenings. Super airs Sunday mornings.

[Ajay]

I'm not convinced it's a time slot thing. I mean, One Piece airs right after it, and it's filled to the brim with blood.

Either the blood was grandfathered in with One Piece (unlikely, given Kai was still bloody), or they have simply decided the show does not need it.

It's not part of their vision for the series as it stands.

[Protege]

I understand that its a smart corporate tactic for them to have DBS sorta be this promo series to sell toys but could they atleast have made a separate series for that? When your dealing with canon material and downgrading it soo much just to appeal to some toddler, your sorta destroying your franchise. Remember Dragon Ball is shounen series and shounen specially means thats its target audience is young males ages 10-18. There is a specific target audience for anime shows that are meant for even younger audience and their called Kodomomuke, which means children anime or manga.


This is shounen genre for ages 10-18 (and yes these shows call also be popular to younger children but it doesnt make them the intended audience)



This this is kodomomuke genre which is meant for younger children ages 3-8

And since dragon ball is sorta is trying to fit into this niche, I'm starting to wonder what does dragon ball have anything to do with it? These shows were specifically designed to be silly and teach kids morals, kindness and the right path of life. Which is completely opposite of what dragon ball does.

[Blade]

I'm not convinced it's a time slot thing. I mean, One Piece airs right after it, and it's filled to the brim with blood.

Either the blood was grandfathered in with One Piece (unlikely, given Kai was still bloody), or they have simply decided the show does not need it.

It's not part of their vision for the series as it stands.

Modern One Piece is nothing on the stuff from yesteryear, it's incredibly toned down on what it was. But again, as I think you allude to, the anime has always taken liberty with that anyway. As both a manga reader and an anime watcher, I've always found that to be pretty marked.

[kinisking]

I understand that its a smart corporate tactic for them to have DBS sorta be this promo series to sell toys but could they atleast have made a separate series for that? When your dealing with canon material and downgrading it soo much just to appeal to some toddler, your sorta destroying your franchise. Remember Dragon Ball is shounen series and shounen specially means thats its target audience is young males ages 10-18. There is a specific target audience for anime shows that are meant for even younger audience and their called Kodomomuke, which means children anime or manga.


This is shounen genre for ages 10-18 (and yes these shows call also be popular to younger children but it doesnt make them the intended audience)



This this is kodomomuke genre which is meant for younger children ages 3-8

And since dragon ball is sorta is trying to fit into this niche, I'm starting to wonder what does dragon ball have anything to do with it? These shows were specifically designed to be silly and teach kids morals, kindness and the right path of life. Which is completely opposite of what dragon ball does.

How the hell is dragonball trying to fit into the niche for 3-8 year olds? It's clearly still a shounen. It might not have blood, but the fighters are still fighting for their life. Just last arc we learnt that Tagoma was tourtured until he went insane, Gohan was riddled with holes as his younger brother watched, we say baby pan die from Freeza's blast, Piccolo died. Super isn't the darkest but it sure as hell isn't a kodmomuke.

[LSSJGODSSJ4Gogeta]

Why are some of you so obsessed with seeing blood?

Because if there's no blood it doesn't have that badass feeling of violence, which is a BIG part of dragonball. Action and violence. You can't go backwards and go from blood to no blood, it's childish to have no blood.

I agree with Vegito's statement, you need to appeal to kids but you can't make dragonball FOR kids. That limits the market. Do what Star Wars does.

But George Lucas also made Star Wars for kids.

Correction, he made it for EVERYONE. Never made it just for kids or just for adults.

[Ajay]

Modern One Piece is nothing on the stuff from yesteryear, it's incredibly toned down on what it was. But again, as I think you allude to, the anime has always taken liberty with that anyway. As both a manga reader and an anime watcher, I've always found that to be pretty marked.

I think the bloodiest I remember One Piece getting was a one off episode (#377) back in 2008. It corresponded to Chapter 485; I'm sure you know the scene I mean. I suppose the infamous event in the Summit War arc is also pretty gruesome, too. That was in 2011.

So I wouldn't say it's drastically less bloody only a few years later. A lot of the Doflamingo flashbacks were quite gruesome. Either way, my point was simply that it doesn't seem to be a time slot thing. Characters can bleed if the creators really want them to. I was just pointing out that that's almost certainly a deliberate choice on the staff's part over anything else.

They certainly have to freedom bleed to some extent, and I think many people's issue is that they don't bleed at all. Looks like that's changing tomorrow, though!

[namekiansaiyan]

LOL can't make dragonball "for kids". Dragonball has been for kids since the beginning. It just happens to appeal to adults.

I would not be surprised if Dragonball's fanbase has more adults then children due to the shows age. This probably applies to many shonen series and definitely outside of Japan.

Many things popular with adults are not directly aimed at them.Just look at Harry Potter, Lord of the rings, Star Wars, Dc and Marvel comics, Pokemon and other Nintendo games.

Its kids who like to be involved in so called 'mature' so they can show everyone they are grown up.

Also blood/violence does not equal mature but just makes it more realistic. Boxing has blood but kids still watch it.

[Lord Beerus]

Correction, he made it for EVERYONE. Never made it just for kids or just for adults.

No. He made it for children.

The movies are for children but they don't want to admit that. In the first film they absolutely hated R2 and C3-PO. In the second film they didn't like Yoda and in the third one they hated the Ewoks... and now Jar Jar is getting accused of the same thing.

[LSSJGODSSJ4Gogeta]

Correction, he made it for EVERYONE. Never made it just for kids or just for adults.

No. He made it for children.

The movies are for children but they don't want to admit that. In the first film they absolutely hated R2 and C3-PO. In the second film they didn't like Yoda and in the third one they hated the Ewoks... and now Jar Jar is getting accused of the same thing.

For just kids and made for kids are two different things. If it was for kids it wouldn't have decapitation, killing kids, genocide, cursing and racism. It's meant for everybody, not solely kids like say teletubies or Stephen universe.

DBZ needs to be for everyone. I believe it's the smartest choice business wise, kids are a BIG source of money, but they aren't the only source of money.

[Ajay]

I mean, I've never actually seen an episode, but I'm pretty sure Steven Universe is aimed at more than just children.

[Lord Beerus]

For just kids and made for kids are two different things. .

No, it really isn't. If you're making a product intended to appeal to children then... well... you're making that product in the earnest intention of appealing solely to children.

"The movies are for children..."

It doesn't get any more clear cut than that.

[kinisking]

Lol can't believe people are trying to say dragonball hasn't been targeted for kids when most of us got hooked on it when we were kids.

For just kids and made for kids are two different things. If it was for kids it wouldn't have decapitation, killing kids, genocide, cursing and racism. It's meant for everybody, not solely kids like say teletubies or Stephen universe.

DBZ needs to be for everyone. I believe it's the smartest choice business wise, kids are a BIG source of money, but they aren't the only source of money

The second yoy changed your arguement, you lost.

[Hellspawn28]

Remember Dragon Ball is shounen series and shounen specially means thats its target audience is young males ages 10-18. There is a specific target audience for anime shows that are meant for even younger audience and their called Kodomomuke, which means children anime or manga.

62.9% of the Shonen Jump magazine's readers were under the age of fourteen.
http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/20 ... ers-posted

You're forgetting that Dragon Ball airs on Sunday Mornings in Japan. Sunday morning anime is no different than cartoons that air on Saturday mornings in the US. So 10-18 years old is way too high for Dragon Ball. I would imagine after 13, most kids would grow out of Dragon Ball after middle school. Dragon Ball has the age market for other series in Japan like One Piece, Kamen Rider and Super Sentai which market to kids under 13 years old. You also posted Digimon in your image which has the same audience as Pokemon.

[LSSJGODSSJ4Gogeta]

For just kids and made for kids are two different things. .

No, it really isn't. If you're making a product intended to appeal to children then... well... you're making that product in the earnest intention of appealing solely to children.

"The movies are for children..."

It doesn't get any more clear cut than that.

You're twisting it. There's a big difference with 1 word. Cursing, blood, racism, genocide, death, and such are not things you put into something that's solely for kids. It's for kids the same way Mario is for kids, as in it's made to make them happy, but not them alone. This is off topic though.