Would you approve Xicor/Zaiko as the new DBSuper Villain?

[successoroffate]

This is just pure speculation but clickbaiters on Youtube are speculating Xicor is going to be the New Villain for Super for a number of reasons:
1. The White hair remark from Toriyama.
2. Toyotaro's involvement in Super's Manga (Since, Toyotaro is the father of Xicor)

Thoughts?

[dbgtFO]

Xicor isn't Toyotaro/Toyble's baby, he was just made more known in Toyble's DBAF fan-manga. Toyble is Xicor's adoptive father, if anything.
The character was created by some unknown guy.

I wouldn't want him in DBS, but I would find it funny, if Toriyama just straight up took the character and put him to good use.
I'm holding out for Mira and Towa and Future Trunks to be the focus of the next arc.

[z_cherub]

Personally, I wouldn't want anything recycled villain-wise (from AT or from fan works). Golden Freeza gave me my fill of that.

[VegettoEX]

There's noooooooo way Shueisha/Toei would recycle a character from a fan-artist's manga that was originally based on rumors/speculation/bullshit from a nebulous group of unidentifiable English-speaking fans. You'd see people coming out of the woodwork claiming to be the person who actually created the character looking for their piece of the pie!

[apex_pretador]

i think the white hair refers to

Spoiler:

whis

.

[Vijay]

I dont see how people would come out of the woodwork claiming to be creator of the said character looking for piece of pie when no one did for Meruem from Hunter Hunter 2011

Call it inspiration. Rip-off. Whatever. The Frieza/Cell cross hybrid impression was evident right off the bat. Yet, Toriyama/TOEI/DB fandom never made an issue of it at all

Like-wise, how come using drawings, that too of a cartoon/anime character could potentially jeopardize TOEI's multi billion investment in Super*cough*poor animation*cough

Copyrights infringement? Lol

If anything, as a fan he/she would be honored to have his creation actually being brought-to-life. I think we first need to stop treating DB/Z fandom as parasitic creations just waiting for time to suck the freaking life outta TOEI at whatever vulnerable moment available.

[VegettoEX]

I don't know anything about Hunter x Hunter. A cursory glance at said character makes me think... well, Mewtwo above all else.

But regardless, it's a totally separate discussion when you're talking about "allegations of an established manga artist potentially taking inspiration from another established manga artist that works for the very same company" versus "allegations of repurposing content whose sources are vague and come from another language's online fandom well over a decade ago". It's not comparable in the least.

Look at Toyotaro and Ooishi. They're essentially asked to disavow their prior works by taking on new pseudonyms. Toyotaro has gotten away A LITTLE BIT with hinting at who he is, but let's be clear: these folks are never going to be able to talk about their fan manga stuff from their prior lives in the open. If they can barely do THAT, you're not going to see their own old CONTENT brought up and repurposed under their new names.

I don't see how this is anything other than super-obvious. There's no reason to take that risk. They would gain nothing from it. It would be a terrible business decision. If anything, they can only LOSE by repurposing that content, at best by just having their creative process documented as "took stuff from online and used it with no credit", and at worst by having lawsuits thrown at them. There's no "win" there at all, beyond a few nods of "oh, that's cool" from fans who recognize the connection.

[RedRibbonSoldier#42]

I dont see how people would come out of the woodwork claiming to be creator of the said character looking for piece of pie when no one did for Meruem from Hunter Hunter 2011

Call it inspiration. Rip-off. Whatever. The Frieza/Cell cross hybrid impression was evident right off the bat. Yet, Toriyama/TOEI/DB fandom never made an issue of it at all

Like-wise, how come using drawings, that too of a cartoon/anime character could potentially jeopardize TOEI's multi billion investment in Super*cough*poor animation*cough

Copyrights infringement? Lol

If anything, as a fan he/she would be honored to have his creation actually being brought-to-life. I think we first need to stop treating DB/Z fandom as parasitic creations just waiting for time to suck the freaking life outta TOEI at whatever vulnerable moment available.

Meruems design may be inspired by Cell, but he isn't Cell itself. And the DB fandom holds no rights to copyright and can't do anyhting about it. (Btw, meruem is before 2011) And i don't see how copyright infringment gets a "lol"

[Hellspawn28]

This is just pure speculation but clickbaiters on Youtube are speculating Xicor is going to be the New Villain for Super for a number of reasons:
1. The White hair remark from Toriyama.
2. Toyotaro's involvement in Super's Manga (Since, Toyotaro is the father of Xicor)

Thoughts?

Toyotaro did not create Xicor. His AF is just a re-telling of multiple AF fan fiction. I remember there was a AF fan fiction from 2004 which had the same storyline as his AF fan fiction. The best thing that he did in his AF was the Dragon Realm concept and the Saiyan ritual. Like Mike (VegettoEX) said that Shueisha and Toei would never approve of Xicor being real when he is created by a unknown fan fic author.

[Cipher]

I think people would say it "feels like something from AF fan fiction."

But, no, actually, doing anything like that would be a legal nightmare. I don't think you can just incorporate a memetic fan character into published work an have it be hunky-dory as far as ownership is concerned.

[Bullza]

No I wouldn't, absolutely not.

[successoroffate]

There's noooooooo way Shueisha/Toei would recycle a character from a fan-artist's manga that was originally based on rumors/speculation/bullshit from a nebulous group of unidentifiable English-speaking fans. You'd see people coming out of the woodwork claiming to be the person who actually created the character looking for their piece of the pie!

I agree. I don't think they're allowing such thing from happening but at least there's a 0.003% chance (Don't ask me how I got to that number) they would allow Toyotaro to put some of his input. The way I see it, is that they were pitching ideas for a new villain and Toyotaro probably proposed Xicor but he knew he wasn't going to get in anyway but somehow, Toriyama or Shueisha/Toei liked it. Oh and my bad for assuming Toyotaro created Xicor.

"nebulous group of unidentifiable English-speaking fans" You killed me with this.

Also, I don't see what kind of legal consequences TOEI/Shueisha would get from using something from a fan-art, fan fic. Technically speaking, wouldn't just the resemblance to the DB art style or if anything, Toriyama's art style be a problem for the fan who made it?

[VegettoEX]

"nebulous group of unidentifiable English-speaking fans" You killed me with this.

Huh? Why? It wasn't intended as a joke or to be funny. That's literally what it is.

[successoroffate]

"nebulous group of unidentifiable English-speaking fans" You killed me with this.

Huh? Why? It wasn't intended as a joke or to be funny. That's literally what it is.

Oh, then disregard...I thought you were exaggerating, my bad.

[Hellspawn28]

I never like Xicor because he is always over used in fan fiction. I find his character (for the most part) to be really dull since most AF fan fic writers never do anything good or special with his character. He is half god, half saiyan and yet his personality is almost nonexistent. I'm not a fan of his design neither.

[successoroffate]

I never like Xicor because he is always over used in fan fiction. I find his character (for the most part) to be really dull since most AF fan fic writers never do anything good or special with his character. He is half god, half saiyan and yet his personality is almost nonexistent. I'm not a fan of his design neither.

If they go that route, I wonder how much they will change from his background? The guy's mother is technically the female Supreme Kai. If I'm not mistaken the guy is supposed to be a SSJ 5, which only brings more plotholes and problems. Or are they saying the guy is just an Evil Goku from another Universe?

[VegettoEX]

Also, I don't see what kind of legal consequences TOEI/Shueisha would get from using something from a fan-art, fan fic. Technically speaking, wouldn't just the resemblance to the DB art style or if anything, Toriyama's art style be a problem for the fan who made it?

It's not the same thing both ways, and you're guiding the discussion in a different area if you're saying "something that just looks like maybe it's inspired by Toriyama's style" versus "literally using the exact fanfic material floating out there as-is".

Japan's internal copyright law is different than our own, but in general a blind-eye is turned toward doujinshi, even those sold for profit at things like Comiket. Part of the reason for this is that, like we've seen with Ooishi and Toyotaro, they use doujinshi artists as almost like a minor league for recruitment. They're also not oblivious to the implications of what going after your biggest fans with lawsuits would be.

However, on the flip side, corporations can't just pick and choose things and use them as they wish. It's just a different scale of production. Perhaps you've heard of comic companies that specifically tell their fans NOT to send them unsolicited ideas or manuscripts and such. This is for a reason: if someone can prove that their idea was used without their permission (or contributed to a production, influenced a production, etc.), that's grounds for legal action.

I know it sounds hypocritical that a company could be gone after for something like this while a one-off fan generally isn't, but if you really step back and think about the scale of what a person vs. a company can make, it should be pretty obvious.

[successoroffate]

Also, I don't see what kind of legal consequences TOEI/Shueisha would get from using something from a fan-art, fan fic. Technically speaking, wouldn't just the resemblance to the DB art style or if anything, Toriyama's art style be a problem for the fan who made it?

It's not the same thing both ways, and you're guiding the discussion in a different area if you're saying "something that just looks like maybe it's inspired by Toriyama's style" versus "literally using the exact fanfic material floating out there as-is".

Japan's internal copyright law is different than our own, but in general a blind-eye is turned toward doujinshi, even those sold for profit at things like Comiket. Part of the reason for this is that, like we've seen with Ooishi and Toyotaro, they use doujinshi artists as almost like a minor league for recruitment. They're also not oblivious to the implications of what going after your biggest fans with lawsuits would be.

However, on the flip side, corporations can't just pick and choose things and use them as they wish. It's just a different scale of production. Perhaps you've heard of comic companies that specifically tell their fans NOT to send them unsolicited ideas or manuscripts and such. This is for a reason: if someone can prove that their idea was used without their permission (or contributed to a production, influenced a production, etc.), that's grounds for legal action.

I know it sounds hypocritical that a company could be gone after for something like this while a one-off fan generally isn't, but if you really step back and think about the scale of what a person vs. a company can make, it should be pretty obvious.

Yeah, I get it know. It's basically them (Toei etc,) watching their backs and playing it safe. But still, I just don't see after so many years how can someone come out of the blue and say: "Hey, I made this character back in 20XX, this my idea. Therefore, give me money." Sounds ridiculous specially how difficult it would be to point at the exact point of creation of the character, Which in this case, is Xicor.

Well, I guess we're finding out Saturday anyway if the youtubers were right or not. Thanks for clarifying.

[Nejishiki]

Never underestimate Americans and their money.

[Xeztin]

I don't think Xicor will ever be official, but I do believe it's a high possibility that we could get a character that basically is Xicor. What I mean by that is, they could redesign the character a bit, tweak his backstory, and rename him and boom! New character with no legal problems! If it happened it'd most likely be through Toyotaro's involvement.