So who or what is Black?

[Xeztin]

Basing on the fact Toriyama's comment says "Black Goku!?" It leaves the possibility Black isn't actually Goku, or else he wouldn't have put the "!?"
For now, all we know is that Black looks just like Goku. He seems younger but if we consider Goku was a lot younger than he is now when he died in the future, then it would make sense.

I really like the theory that Black is actually Goten. I don't like the theories that say he is a shapeshifter, it would make no sense for a shapeshifter to take the appearance of Goku.

If he is Goten, it would be cool if he was actually trained and controlled by the Kaioshin and maybe he doesn't even know he actually is a Saiyan.

Same here, it'd make his character totally relevant and would give character progression to their younger counterparts. Woudn't it be cool if our Goten and Trunks stopped looking at their powers as a play thing? This arc has me hyped to the gills

[ChronoTwigger]

PLEASE NOTE

There's nothing like "people duplicates". Universes share the same geography and planets (at least nominally), but not the same people. Kaioshins are a simple example of that. U6 kaioshins where different people. And in U7 no "machine people" like Magetta.

So, there's nothing like an "another universe Goku". (things could be retconned, but until then, no way).

[Neon Z]

PLEASE NOTE

There's nothing like "people duplicates". Universes share the same geography and planets (at least nominally), but not the same people. Kaioshins are a simple example of that. U6 kaioshins where different people. And in U7 no "machine people" like Magetta.

So, there's nothing like an "another universe Goku". (things could be retconned, but until then, no way).

They constantly referenced Frost as "Universe 6 Freeza" in the anime. He technically had a different physical appearance and name, but still was clearly similar to him in several way. This Black Goku is thinner and has fully outlined eyes compared to our Goku, so they aren't really identical either just similar like Frost and Freeza. The character's name so far seems to be just "Black" in the anime too, with the "Goku" part only used in promotion/merchandising.

[HeroR]

PLEASE NOTE

There's nothing like "people duplicates". Universes share the same geography and planets (at least nominally), but not the same people. Kaioshins are a simple example of that. U6 kaioshins where different people. And in U7 no "machine people" like Magetta.

So, there's nothing like an "another universe Goku". (things could be retconned, but until then, no way).

They constantly referenced Frost as "Universe 6 Freeza" in the anime. He technically had a different physical appearance and name, but still was clearly similar to him in several way. This Black Goku is thinner and has fully outlined eyes compared to our Goku, so they aren't really identical either just similar like Frost and Freeza. The character's name so far seems to be just "Black" in the anime too, with the "Goku" part only used in promotion/merchandising.

Goku and the others also called the Namekians a bunch of Piccolos and we had Nail who was practically a Piccolo-clone, however, none of them are Piccolo. Frost looked and sound like Freeza, so Goku and the others called him U6 Freeza because they tend to do that. That doesn't mean he is an alternative Freeza, he is just from the same clan and has a similar line of work.

The stuff you named on Black Goku is so subtile that it barely counts. The fully outline eyes, for example, is to highlight that he's evil since all evil characters in the series have outline eyes. Him being thinner can easily be an artistic choice since Toriyama tend to draw his characters thin and they wanted to reflect that, much like Future Trunks' hair color is now blue, just like Toriyama's drawing.

[Hit!!]

PLEASE NOTE

There's nothing like "people duplicates". Universes share the same geography and planets (at least nominally), but not the same people. Kaioshins are a simple example of that. U6 kaioshins where different people. And in U7 no "machine people" like Magetta.

So, there's nothing like an "another universe Goku". (things could be retconned, but until then, no way).

That's exactly what i've been trying to say for a while now.

My theory is that black Goku or "Black" is from timeline number 2, the "unseen timeline", the one that was created by Future Trunks from the timeline 1 "the original timeline" where Cell comes from.

If they do this right, they can use that to solve one of the biggest plotholes in DB history, which is the lack of explanation as to how the History of Trunks timeline was created. Because we already know that the main timeline (the one where the series takes place) was created by cell from the original timeline, when he went back to age 763 and hid under the ground after going back to his larval state, so how did the History of Trunks Timeline come to be?? Maybe it was created by Black Goku because he traveled back in time, before age 763 or the point of that year where Cell arrived in the main timeline.

That would also explain why Future Trunks arrived in the main timeline, instead of creating a totally new one.

[Dbzfan94]

As crazy and dumb as the Goten theory is, I wouldn't be totally against it as Goten is really underrated in my opinion, especially EOZ Goten, and needs something to make him relevant somehow. He has like absolutely no presence in Heroes compared to everyone else lol

[ryou766]

I can't help but be biased here because I absolutely can't stand Goten's character.

[Big Black Sayian]

Goku Black could be an android because Future Trunks is that unlucky

[Rozay]

I think Rhymestyle and Geekdom's latest Unlikely Theories video does a great job pointing out why it isn't Goten, Bardock, etc. Check it out:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kc-ovahk9_c

Of all the plausible theories, the heart virus one is still the one I like the most. But the "Black is Super's version of Baby" is the most realistic, I would say. Still don't like the shapeshifter theory.

[dbs fanboy]

I have a theory, Black Goku is another Goku from another timeline.
Our friend became the strongest in his universe so he managed to find a way to travel between universes and dimensions to get stronger. But when he returned to Earth, he found out the terrible truth, people stoped making muffins, and as our friend couldn't cook, the muffin button was his only salvation, but there were no muffin buttons.
However, Goku managed to save one muffin from the destruction and he decided to keep it so someday he would be able to replicate it. But somehow, Trunks, a saiyan, was able to find it, eating it, and making Goku get mad, destroy his world and travel between timelines to create Havoc.
The end.

[ryou766]

I have a theory, Black Goku is another Goku from another timeline.
Our friend became the strongest in his universe so he managed to find a way to travel between universes and dimensions to get stronger. But when he returned to Earth, he found out the terrible truth, people stoped making muffins, and as our friend couldn't cook, the muffin button was his only salvation, but there were no muffin buttons.
However, Goku managed to save one muffin from the destruction and he decided to keep it so someday he would be able to replicate it. But somehow, Trunks, a saiyan, was able to find it, eating it, and making Goku get mad, destroy his world and travel between timelines to create Havoc.
The end.

That's a certainly a joke that will never get old.

[MajinVegetaPD]

The whole Goten thing needs to die. Goten was not even conceived in the Future timeline, as Goku died way before that.

It's obvious from this episode that it is some alien type of being. He uses the word "Saiyan" with such disdain, like he despises them.

My guess is that he is a god of destruction from a destroyed universe.

[Marlowe89]

Honestly, I really do hope it's an alternate version of Goku. So many interesting possibilities for backstory there.

At the very least I think the idea is far more intriguing than yet another shapeshifter or possession, those have already been done in the franchise in some way or another and I'd frankly rather not see them again.

[GodKaio-Ken]

I think Whis is a huge clue to this. He has stated several times that Goku "Needs to become stronger". Why would Whis EVER say that unless he knew there was a threat? He is from the realm of Gods who obviously give less than two F's about humanity to the point even the ultimate God Zeno has destroyed 6 universe on a whim. Why would any of them care if Goku became stronger? There is some legitimate threat whether you believe that threat is Black or someone after him.

I 100% believe he is not a Makaioshin for reasons I posted in another thread. I also wish he was Goten...but its pretty obvious he's not. What does that leave us with? Is Gero dead in the future of Trunks? After all Trunks had never seen Androids 17 and 18 who killed Gero don't exist. If he is dead please correct me

A lot of people say that it would be a ripoff of the Android Saga but I see it more as a logical continuation.

[DainIronfoot]

The thing I found interesting about Black is how he used the word Saiyan in his statements. It's clear he does not like Saiyans at all. The one thing that stood out though was when he said something about "an end to a proud warrior race". Idk why but I got a weird vibes from it. He literally came to Earth to kill a single saiyan? Is it possible that Black is an alternate Goku that despised Vegeta and now is after his son? Also, at one point Black did call Trunks by his name.

So many possibilities!

[GodKaio-Ken]

The thing I found interesting about Black is how he used the word Saiyan in his statements. It's clear he does not like Saiyans at all. The one thing that stood out though was when he said something about "an end to a proud warrior race". Idk why but I got a weird vibes from it. He literally came to Earth to kill a single saiyan? Is it possible that Black is an alternate Goku that despised Vegeta and now is after his son? Also, at one point Black did call Trunks by his name.

So many possibilities!

I noticed that too but I also had this thought.

If you were a human who obtained Godly powers....would you still consider yourself a human? Is it possible Black is so power hungry and also powerful that he no longer even considers himself part of his own race?

[Shinomori]

I 100% believe he is not a Makaioshin for reasons I posted in another thread. I also wish he was Goten

You have my curiosity. Why do you wish Black was Goten?

The thing I found interesting about Black is how he used the word Saiyan in his statements. It's clear he does not like Saiyans at all. The one thing that stood out though was when he said something about "an end to a proud warrior race". Idk why but I got a weird vibes from it. He literally came to Earth to kill a single saiyan? Is it possible that Black is an alternate Goku that despised Vegeta and now is after his son? Also, at one point Black did call Trunks by his name.

So many possibilities!

He also talked disparagingly of humans as well. If memory serves correctly he stated that death was fitting for them. So it seems Black wanted to wipe out all life on the planet. I think it's safe to assume he is a god of some kind, perhaps fused with Goku's dead body.

[GodKaio-Ken]

I 100% believe he is not a Makaioshin for reasons I posted in another thread. I also wish he was Goten

You have my curiosity. Why do you wish Black was Goten?

The thing I found interesting about Black is how he used the word Saiyan in his statements. It's clear he does not like Saiyans at all. The one thing that stood out though was when he said something about "an end to a proud warrior race". Idk why but I got a weird vibes from it. He literally came to Earth to kill a single saiyan? Is it possible that Black is an alternate Goku that despised Vegeta and now is after his son? Also, at one point Black did call Trunks by his name.

So many possibilities!

He also talked disparagingly of humans as well. If memory serves correctly he stated that death was fitting for them. So it seems Black wanted to wipe out all life on the planet. I think it's safe to assume he is a god of some kind, perhaps fused with Goku's dead body.

I just find it hard to believe it took a God in Goku's body a year to learn to locate Ki when even Krillin can do it. That is my main issue with the Makaioshin theory, otherwise it seems to fit.

As for Goten...I've just always loved him since he was created. I've been EXTREMELY disappointed with the way all of Goku's sons have been disregarded. Trunks has too in a way but at least he has future Trunks to make you go "Wow, Trunks might grow up super cool".

Goten needs something to add to his character in some way...that is basically it. I acknowledge there is literally 0.00001% chance of it happening though.

[UpFromTheSkies]

I think the green potara are used to either body swap, or to split a person into good and evil halves like Piccolo and Kami, and someone else is wearing the other potara. I'm leaning more towards it being a body swap, because Goku or Goten would have killed their evil half. Maybe Goku finds a God/Kaioshin imprisoned, and they convince Goku to put on the other potara to help them escape, but instead they body swap and Goku is stuck in a prison designed to hold a God.

As for why he would want to kill Trunks, maybe he wants to eliminate anyone that might attempt to free Goku, or Saiyans were responsible for his imprisonment.

[Kishido]

I 100% believe he is not a Makaioshin for reasons I posted in another thread. I also wish he was Goten

You have my curiosity. Why do you wish Black was Goten?

The thing I found interesting about Black is how he used the word Saiyan in his statements. It's clear he does not like Saiyans at all. The one thing that stood out though was when he said something about "an end to a proud warrior race". Idk why but I got a weird vibes from it. He literally came to Earth to kill a single saiyan? Is it possible that Black is an alternate Goku that despised Vegeta and now is after his son? Also, at one point Black did call Trunks by his name.

So many possibilities!

He also talked disparagingly of humans as well. If memory serves correctly he stated that death was fitting for them. So it seems Black wanted to wipe out all life on the planet. I think it's safe to assume he is a god of some kind, perhaps fused with Goku's dead body.

I just find it hard to believe it took a God in Goku's body a year to learn to locate Ki when even Krillin can do it. That is my main issue with the Makaioshin theory, otherwise it seems to fit.

As for Goten...I've just always loved him since he was created. I've been EXTREMELY disappointed with the way all of Goku's sons have been disregarded. Trunks has too in a way but at least he has future Trunks to make you go "Wow, Trunks might grow up super cool".

Goten needs something to add to his character in some way...that is basically it. I acknowledge there is literally 0.00001% chance of it happening though.

So you want future X characters cuz our timeline kids are handled badly?

No thanks...