The humble beginnings of the Original Funimation Cast.

[WittyUsername]

If the chatroom thing is true, I'm at least glad most parties involved are capable of enough shame to want to separate themselves from such garbage.

And Dragon Ball Kai, ironically enough, served the purpose of introducing new kids to the franchise, something it seemingly failed to do in Japan. Somebody awhile back made the bold statement that they "grew up with the old Nicktoons broadcast in 2010." I've heard random kids talking about it on the street here and there. It's kind of insane. Sure, holdovers from the old dub suck for those in the know, but a new audience isn't going to care about "destructo disc" or be indoctrined to like Stephanie Nadolny. To say there was zero value in that dub is ridiculous. It's been repeated ad nauseam; the West needed Kai to a far greater length than Japan did.

I'm not really sure if Kai really left that much of a long lasting impact on Dragon Ball in the U.S. I know that it had some pretty strong ratings for Nicktoons, but it's run was ultimately pretty short lived. Sure, it was nice to get a dub that was more accurate to the original version with more experienced actors, but in hindsight, it sort of just came and went. I'm not sure if it even necessarily was responsible for introducing that many new kids to the series, considering what a niche network that Nicktoons is.

[NitroEX]

For the record, Chris Sabat wanted to give up the role of Piccolo in the Kai dub, but it didn't work out.

It's very easy for someone to say that but not mean it though. As far as I'm aware, that was in reference to Sabat wanting to bring in Scott McNeil (a Canadian VA) to reprise Piccolo in Kai, that was never a realistic long term option to begin with but casting a new guy in Texas certainly would have been possible.

The fact remains that he still chose to dub Piccolo himself and we have no idea if he even went through an auditioning process to try and find a new voice like they did with Freeza. As I mentioned before, he's in a position of power when it comes to DB's English dubs and while he's done many good things in that position such as the more faithful direction and the recasting of most (if not all) of the previous unfitting voices, he's still reprising two of DB's most popular characters in a dub which he directs, that can't exactly leave him with an unbiased perspective now can it? When does a guy in that position decide for himself when it's the time to step down? The answer is he doesn't, not unless he physically can't perform anymore. Speaking of which, didn't he mention somewhere that he had problems with his voice when recording for Kai's hurried schedule? Surely that would have been a good time to take some strain off and bring in an understudy for at least one of his characters.

It's worth noting that voice directors in the industry generally frown on this sort of thing. The most well respected ones have only ever cast themselves in minor roles, if any at all. If Sabat was willing to put the previous Freeza and Gohan actors under scrutiny and inevitably replace them then surely he should have put his own Z performances under the same scrutiny. There were many times when his acting in Z was just as bad as Linda Young's and Stephanie Nadolny on top of the voice sounding forced, yet he get's a second shot but they don't? (FYI I'm not a fan of either Linda Young or Stephanie Nadolny, I'm glad they got replaced)

Sabat's Piccolo and Vegeta are plenty different and they're good, so I don't agree with your assessment at all Nitro.

I don't know, "plenty different" seems like a stretch to me, the voices are close in pitch now so it's very easy for him to dip into one or the other, Vegeta's accent and Piccolo's calmer demeanor do help but not always. In fact, I do recall one scene off hand during the Android saga when the two are talking amongst themselves about Gero. There was a brief point when I had to stop and think when Piccolo's lines ended and Vegeta's began (or vice versa). It's just not an ideal casting situation no matter how good his performance is, he's a good director so why not just direct someone else to be just as good and avoid the unnecessary headache? I think a new Piccolo would have been well received, good deep voices aren't that hard to come by and Sabat isn't doing anything particularly special with his.

[ABED]

Pitch, maybe, but they don't dip into each other. Piccolo is just Sabat's voice but deeper. His Vegeta has that rasp to it. It's difficult for me to explain in words, but I've never felt they've sounded to alike. The big difference between the Freeza voices that he recast such as Freeza and Gohan was either the actors no longer worked at FUNi, couldn't keep up with the pace of the dialog, or just weren't good. I see no reason to recast Piccolo or Vegeta as Sabat was good in both roles.

An understudy? This isn't a play.

[TheAldella]

Even Steve Blum, who's widely considered on of the best voice actors around - heck, he barely even does anime any more sadly

Go watch Naruto Shippuden. That boy is all over that dub. And he kills it.

[NitroEX]

An understudy? This isn't a play.

Ok then, a backup or a replacement. Happy?

If something bad had happened to Sabat during the recording of Kai he should have at least had someone in mind to take over for him, I doubt the TV stations would have halted their schedule just for him, on home release maybe but they had deadlines to meet.

I see no reason to recast Piccolo or Vegeta as Sabat was good in both roles.

I'm not saying he was bad in Kai, I do think his performance in Z was bad but that's not really the point I'm trying to make. If someone other than Sabat was directing the Kai dub and genuinely felt Sabat was the only man able to play Vegeta and Piccolo in English then I'd have no right to complain, I'd certainly think the director was wrong in their judgement but it would be a choice made by an unbiased third party, not the actor himself. Obviously that's not the way it happened though, Sabat was the director and he seems to have basically recast himself in those roles whilst choosing to drop other actors who really weren't that much worse than he was in Z. Him and Schemmel are good buddies too now that I think about it so for all I know that's probably the only reason he got to reprise King Kai. My point is why weren't these roles also up for grabs to new actors? Why was he more qualified to reprise his roles than others? Surely they should have all gone through a fair casting process or else it just sets a bad precedent of cronyism.

Despite Sabat being good in Kai you don't know if someone else might have been better had new actors been given a chance to compete for the role in casting. Had a casting actually happened we might've ended up loving a new Piccolo voice just like we do with Ayres' Freeza.

either the actors no longer worked at FUNi, couldn't keep up with the pace of the dialog, or just weren't good.

Good according to what? Sabat's opinion?

Either way he could've been more humble and re-auditioned against newer talent. After all, he didn't originally win the roles by merit. They were originally cast because they were the most affordable soundalikes.

[jjgp1112]

Piccolo and Vegeta are two of the most well-known voices in the series among American fans. There was as much chance of their voices being changed as Krillin's or Goku's. But really, the vast majority of people have praised Sabat's performances as both guys in Kai, so I'd say he made the right choice anyway.

[NitroEX]

Piccolo and Vegeta are two of the most well-known voices in the series among American fans. There was as much chance of their voices being changed as Krillin's or Goku's. But really, the vast majority of people have praised Sabat's performances as both guys in Kai, so I'd say he made the right choice anyway.

Ehh... You could say the same of Freeza's voice prior to Kai to be honest, he's a pretty iconic anime character and the new voice was very different to American audiences. Changing Goku's voice would have definitely caused a stir and maybe Vegeta as well although many casuals already believed Vegeta had a new voice actor anyway due to alterations Sabat made. At the end of the day, Dragonball is bigger than Sabat, it doesn't revolve around him so I really don't think it would have made that much of an impact.

Also, if a new replacement actor was good (which would likely have been the case if a director chose him over Sabat) then it no doubt would have quickly swayed the opinions of viewers and they'd grow to like it too.

[ABED]

Ok then, a backup or a replacement. Happy?

You missed the point. Film is forever. An understudy can stand in if an actor gets sick because the audience will only see that night's performance. It's much different if you are recording a voice. That recording exists forever, so why would you give up the role if you aren't seriously ill? And what about when he gets better, does he take back the role?

himself in those roles whilst choosing to drop other actors who really weren't that much worse than he was in Z.

Maybe not at the beginning, but it didn't take him long to become FAR better than Nadolny or Young.

Despite Sabat being good in Kai you don't know if someone else might have been better had new actors been given a chance to compete for the role in casting. Had a casting actually happened we might've ended up loving a new Piccolo voice just like we do with Ayres' Freeza.

The thing is Vegeta and Piccolo were never miscast, they were voiced by a green VA. Freeza was completely mischaracterized and miscast. Freeza absolutely needed a new actor.

Good according to what? Sabat's opinion?

No, mine. Vollmer, Nadolny, and Young are bad actors.

Either way he could've been more humble and re-auditioned against newer talent. After all, he didn't originally win the roles by merit. They were originally cast because they were the most affordable soundalikes.

No, but I could see Sabat winning the roles now. I'd rather Sabat remain proud of his work and not give them up if he honestly believes he's good in those roles. Sabat strikes me as a guy that can call a spade a spade.

[jjgp1112]

Piccolo and Vegeta are two of the most well-known voices in the series among American fans. There was as much chance of their voices being changed as Krillin's or Goku's. But really, the vast majority of people have praised Sabat's performances as both guys in Kai, so I'd say he made the right choice anyway.

Ehh... You could say the same of Freeza's voice prior to Kai to be honest, he's a pretty iconic anime character and the new voice was very different to American audiences. Changing Goku's voice would have definitely caused a stir and maybe Vegeta as well although many casuals already believed Vegeta had a new voice actor anyway due to alterations Sabat made. At the end of the day, Dragonball is bigger than Sabat, it doesn't revolve around him so I really don't think it would have made that much of an impact.

Also, if a new replacement actor was good (which would likely have been the case if a director chose him over Sabat) then it no doubt would have quickly swayed the opinions of viewers and they'd grow to like it too.

Frieza is a (incredibly miscast and the most egregious case of the old dub's follies) villain that appeared in one portion of the series, while Piccolo and Vegeta are among the main characters that have appeared over and over again across countless Dragon Ball properties. it's not very comparable.

A the end of the day, Sabat's performances as Piccolo and Vegeta were excellent, so it really shouldn't even matter. Sabat's given up the majority of the other roles he's had throughout the original dub and it's absolutely not unreasonable that he'd continue playing his two most prominent roles that he's very good at. Especially considering he was willing to drop Piccolo anyway. I don't get why you're harping on the guy's character for a casting decision that went well anyway.

[MetaMoss]

I'm not really sure if Kai really left that much of a long lasting impact on Dragon Ball in the U.S. I know that it had some pretty strong ratings for Nicktoons, but it's run was ultimately pretty short lived. Sure, it was nice to get a dub that was more accurate to the original version with more experienced actors, but in hindsight, it sort of just came and went. I'm not sure if it even necessarily was responsible for introducing that many new kids to the series, considering what a niche network that Nicktoons is.

What about it's airings on the CW? That's a channel you don't even need cable to watch, and it stayed on there longer than Nicktoons. And now that it's on Toonami... No other shows on that block can beat it.

[huzaifa_ahmed]

I agree with TheBalish's point about Gohan. I think the lady who does him now is obviously given better direction, but on the opposite end of Nadolny...I would say that Gohan now sounds TOO childish.

Masako Nozawa didn't/doesn't have NEARLY as high a pitch as Colleen. Colleen isn't the sort of actress you go for that sort of character. & I'm also gonna say that I feel like the actors in FUNimation's DB aren't anything like the sort of varied talent in the original, which is like Japan's equivalent of Futurama/Simpsons-level competitive.

If I mentioned this on Reddit DBZ or Anime, I'd probably be slaughtered, because, after all...the first rule of sub/dub is "whichever one I saw first is better because I saw it first".


And NitroEX, it is pure BS that FUNimation didn't have a ton of money for actors - "their" show became a HUGE success over here, & while *I* would prefer faithful adaptations, it'd sure help support the anime industry if Toei, Aniplex, Bandai, or other anime companies in Japan would license their shows for "Americanized" adaptations. The hardcore fans (like me) would seek out the originals.

The only difference is that the Japanese/whatever networks picked up the shows, would actually pay FAIRLY, as opposed to FUNimation, who reaped a TON of $$$ off of Dragon Ball-related merchandise, while paying about $15k/yearly for the main actors - & for WHAT purpose?

As far as I'm concerned, all that cash that FUNimation made on DBZ made over here...went down the toilet.

FUNimation (basically one American Toei relative, his waifu Cindy, & his garage band editor Carly in a small apartment building...& with like no funding) wasn't necessary - Toei should have either dubbed it at a US studio, or given if off to Pioneer or an actual piece of the industry, if not the "Americanized network show" route.

FUNimation does a serious disservice to the anime industry by not simply integrating itself into a real company, the way that Viz bought Shueisha.

They are a bunch of crooks as far as I'm concerned, & their employees need to get a life & move to Viz.

Also must say that BlackPaladin & B. never cease to impress me with their boundless flowing of that cool, wise feel.

[ABED]

The only difference is that the Japanese/whatever networks picked up the shows, would actually pay FAIRLY, as opposed to FUNimation, who reaped a TON of $$$ off of Dragon Ball-related merchandise, while paying about $15/yearly for the main actors - & for WHAT purpose?

What do you consider fair? No, Funi doesn't pay a lot, but those actors have every right to negotiate for what they believe they are worth or go elsewhere. Crooks steal, FUNi is just cheap, there's a difference.

[saiyanvegetable]

What funimation did with Dragonball Z was pretty amazing. Dubs were notorious for being giant piles of shit back then, I know all the purists here will raise their pretentious eyebrows in anger but Funimation absolutely nailed it especially in the later seasons.

[huzaifa_ahmed]

What funimation did with Dragonball Z was pretty amazing. Dubs were notorious for being giant piles of shit back then, I know all the purists here will raise their pretentious eyebrows in anger but Funimation absolutely nailed it especially in the later seasons.

Slayers dub (1995 dub)>Cowboy Bebop dub (1999 dub)>>>>>>>>>>most dubs of 2000>>>giant piles of shit>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>FUNimation's adaptation of Dragon Ball Z.

I may be banned for this - it is worth it.

[TheAldella]

Slayers dub (1995 dub)>Cowboy Bebop dub (1999 dub)>>>>>>>>>>most dubs of 2000>>>giant piles of shit>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>FUNimation's adaptation of Dragon Ball Z.

I may be banned for this - it is worth it.

Bebop was a 2001 dub, champ.

[Kamiccolo9]

What funimation did with Dragonball Z was pretty amazing. Dubs were notorious for being giant piles of shit back then, I know all the purists here will raise their pretentious eyebrows in anger but Funimation absolutely nailed it especially in the later seasons.

Aren't you the guy who's always blasting people for their terrible taste?

[DemonRin]

This is an interesting thread and gave some insight into stuff I wasn't aware of. One thing I didn't see touched on here that I'm wondering if anyone knows about.

How much truth is there to the entire "Cynthia Cranz was Chris Sabat's librarian" thing? Is there an actual story there? That one was always kinda interesting/neat to me.


Also, plenty of folks already tackled this guy's post overall, but one point I notice got missed that I wanna tackle:

The funny thing is that Sean Schemmel and Chris Sabat have recently spoken out against their original attempt at dubbing Dragon Ball Z, saying that they were simply following the orders of the "higher-ups" at FUNimation, which at the time would've been Barry Watson and Daniel Cocanougher. They say that they disagreed with how the show was being handled even as early as 1999, but alas couldn't do anything about it. This is a lie, however. Back when the Dragon Ball Z website had a chatroom, sometimes the actors would come in as "celebrity guest stars" and talk to the fans. I believe DBZUncensored or some other early Dragon Ball Z fansite had documented that Sean Schemmel himself took credit for coming up with King Kai's line in "89 - Frieza Defeated!!" in which he says "AWW YEAH! OKAY! GIVE IT TO HIM GOKU! OH BOY, UH-HUH! MAKE HIM REAAALLLY FEEL IT! YEAH, YEAH, YEAAAHHH!" The site emphasized the fact that Sean was, apparently, very proud of his work. Additionally, Chris Sabat took credit for the whole, "cat loves food" thing, as well as completely butchering Killa's character by telling Dameon Clarke to go ahead with the guttural and inaudible farce of a voice that they'd come up with while brainstorming in the booth. In the Westwood dub however, Killa's lines could be easily understood without the use of subtitles, which shows that FUNimation's abomination was simply the result of a group of guys dicking around during a recording session rather than treating the property professionally.

I've seen countless people on these forums say in the past that both Sean and Chris were always champions for trying to put out a faithful interpretation of the show, and while that may be true for Dragon Ball Z Kai, the exact opposite is true for Dragon Ball Z. Putting the blame solely on the higher ups at FUNimation at the time is simply wrong.

I find it funny that you are outright calling the things they've said here a "Lie" like you're so sure of it, when there's about 100 different reasons for a discrepency here than "They lied".

"Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by incompetence" is I believe the rule that applies here.

A more logical answer for why they'd seem proud of some of the stuff they did in 1999 vs. regretting some of those decisions now is simple. The show was airing at the time they were doing that. Regardless of what they may have felt about the material and regardless of whether or not they wanted a more faithful product is honestly irrelevant to what they said back in the day. As others here have pointed out, Sean Schemmel was broke, and this job basically saved him from near homelessness. There was a momentary scare about paying his bills during the Cyborg arc since Goku spent so much time out of comission and he wasn't working as a result.

These actors who are brand new Voice actors without a union to back them, on the ground floor of a rather new and not so financially stable company are not going to publically complain about the product they are putting out. On the contrary, statements from around that time are probably less trustworthy than anything they say these days because I'm sure at the time they were trying to any good publicity they could get for the show. They WANTED DBZ to be a success, regardless of any reservations they may or may not have had about the faithfulness.


That being said, do I think they may exadgerate a bit when they say lately that they were always on the side of doing a faithful dub? Yeah, probably, but to say that them saying positive things about it back when they had EVERY reason to say positive things about it.

[Cure Dragon 255]

Rin, that was Monika Antonelli and she was a librarian, but she DID receive actoral training and had actual actoral credentials. She was according to Vegetto EX among the few good voices of Season 3 and beyond.

[DemonRin]

Huh... Wonder where I heard it was Chichi....

Either way, thanks for the answer!!! Looking up her name, it looks like Sabat actually offered her the job because she had acting experience before. Apparently the Library had a mascot named Whiffles the Bunny and she voiced the character in commercials and the like.

That's actually kinda neat.

[Cure Dragon 255]

REALLY!? That sounds soooooo cute! Do link me to that stuff you found, if you dont mind. Hehehehe.