Fact Checker (update: Ep.51)

[RedRibbonSoldier#42]

I heard the japanese word for blue is the same as purple. can someone confirms this so I know Toei either did a freaking wordplay when describing Trunk's hair?.

There is a separate word for purple 紫 rather than the common word for blue 青. However, all color exists on a continuous spectrum of wavelenths, and human words just arbitrarily divide them. It's a stretch, but since there are not that many people with colored hair in the DB verse, It's possible Blooma asked if his hair was blue because it was simpler(less syllables) and can be vague enough to include many different shades. If it was anywhere in the ballpark, it would be most likely Trunks.

[EmmaWinters]

I heard the japanese word for blue is the same as purple. can someone confirms this so I know Toei either did a freaking wordplay when describing Trunk's hair?.

She uses the English word (ブルー/buruu), not the Japanese word (青/ao).
青/ao used to refer to green (not purple) depending on context, but modern Japanese tends to use 緑/midori instead.

[shinmaru]

You say Pan is the youngest character to fly, but what about Tambourine? Wasn't he able to fly shortly after he was born/hatched?

I suppose you're right. I'll clarify.

I don't think Tambourine can be compared as he was a demon-minion that had a job to do.

Aren't the Cell Junior's the youngest beings to fly?

[Polyphase Avatron]

Tambourine was just one example I thought of. The point is that younger characters have flown.

[sailorspazz]

It seems the "youngest character to fly" is being taken way too literally. Yes, there were technically characters who were physically younger than Pan when they flew. But they were also all monsters/clones born into bodies that were already developed, not born as infants and then matured. So I guess a more literal way to phrase it would be that Pan is the "least physically developed" character to fly, if just saying "youngest" is an issue.

[dbgtFO]

So what is the proper title of episode 50?
Here on Kanzenshuu it's listed as:

"Goku vs Black!
The path to the sealed future"

But Dragon Team has it as:

"Goku vs Black!
The path to the future gets closed"

From what I gather from latest news, Black will find Trunks' time-machine and apparently destroy it, thus "closing the path to the future" as per Dragon Team, but is this really how it's supposed to be translated? The Kanzenshuu title gives off another impression, as if the future has already been sealed and now they need to find another path to it.

[Vegard Aune]

So what is the proper title of episode 50?
Here on Kanzenshuu it's listed as:

"Goku vs Black!
The path to the sealed future"

But Dragon Team has it as:

"Goku vs Black!
The path to the future gets closed"

From what I gather from latest news, Black will find Trunks' time-machine and apparently destroy it, thus "closing the path to the future" as per Dragon Team, but is this really how it's supposed to be translated? The Kanzenshuu title gives off another impression, as if the future has already been sealed and now they need to find another path to it.

The problem there is, the Japanese phrasing is vague enough that both translations are equally sound, and until we see the episode itself and what the title is actually referring to, we just don't know if "Path to the Sealed Future" or "Sealed Path to the Future" is correct.

[TheDevilsCorpse]

Yeah, it seems tricky in this case because the "future" is technically already sealed in the past tense as Kanzenshuu translated it, as the time machine is out of fuel and apparently needs some maintenance too. But, as already mentioned, if Black outright destroys the time machine, they it can be sealed in the present tense for that episode.

I'll be interesting to see which interpretation ends up being correct, though it doesn't seem like either option is that big of a deal. Bluma has the notebook from her future self, so they could get around either option with enough time.

[alakazam^]

I always read it as the path being the one being closed off.

[dbgtFO]

Thanks for the responses all of you, I did have an inkling the differences in translations was caused by vagueness in the japanese text.. as per usual.
Guess we'll find out soon enough though ^_^

[Neo-Makaiōshin]

As of DBS Episode 50, "Sealed Path to the Future" seens to be appropiate translation.

[Herms]

Well, Black blows up the time machine, sealing the future. But then Bulma in the end brings out the other time machine, providing a new path to that sealed future. So both interpretations still seem applicable.

[LightBing]

Does Black speak in any specific way that might be lost in translation? Like Goku speaking like a hick. It might be useful to point out such a characteristic, at least for the more important new characters.

Keep up the good work, this thread is much appreciated.

[sailorspazz]

His speech is quite formal, which is an interesting juxtaposition with Nozawa's evil voice (I mean, Gohan is often polite, but has a gentle voice to match it). Basically, he speaks the proper kind of Japanese that teachers want you to learn, rather than speaking like the large majority of rude, informal anime characters I think he's the only Nozawa-voiced character in Dragon Ball who uses "watashi" regularly.

[LightBing]

His speech is quite formal, which is an interesting juxtaposition with Nozawa's evil voice (I mean, Gohan is often polite, but has a gentle voice to match it). Basically, he speaks the proper kind of Japanese that teachers want you to learn, rather than speaking like the large majority of rude, informal anime characters I think he's the only Nozawa-voiced character in Dragon Ball who uses "watashi" regularly.

Thank you. That's quite interesting, a nice bit of insight. It further separates him from Goku. For what it's worth, Kaioshin uses "watashi" as well. Polite villains are much more threatening than foul-mouthed ones, to me.

[GodKaio-Ken]

His speech is quite formal, which is an interesting juxtaposition with Nozawa's evil voice (I mean, Gohan is often polite, but has a gentle voice to match it). Basically, he speaks the proper kind of Japanese that teachers want you to learn, rather than speaking like the large majority of rude, informal anime characters I think he's the only Nozawa-voiced character in Dragon Ball who uses "watashi" regularly.

Thank you. That's quite interesting, a nice bit of insight. It further separates him from Goku. For what it's worth, Kaioshin uses "watashi" as well. Polite villains are much more threatening than foul-mouthed ones, to me.

Agreed!

That is why I loved Cell so much. He was sophisticated and had reasoning behind what he was doing. When he tells Gohan "Another dead fighter YOU could have saved..." it was actually chilling and menacing.

[Sandubadear]

Herms' summary says that Black was stronger now than in the future, while DragonTeam's subs says he was stronger in the future. Which is the correct?

[spoiler][/spoiler]

[Herms]

Herms' summary says that Black was stronger now than in the future, while DragonTeam's subs says he was stronger in the future. Which is the correct?

[spoiler][/spoiler]

It's supposed to be in the future. I messed up, but it's fixed now in the first post of the episode 50 thread. Sorry for any confusion.

[EmmaWinters]

Updated. Phew!

Spoiler:

Context: Pilaf, Shu, Mai and Trunks don't know who Future Trunks is.

　04:56 | Pilaf: "He says you're his father and you're his mother, and they're both Trunks!"
　04:58 | Pilaf: "Us kids don't have a clue what's going on!"
　05:04 | Bulma: "Would you pipe down?!"
　05:06 | Bulma: "Everything's fine, both of them are mine and Vegeta's child!"
　05:11 | Bulma: "See, this kid here... is this kid, just from the future."
　05:21 | Trunks: "So this guy's... Me from the future?!"

Significance: Reveals that Trunks was never told about Future Trunks.

---

Context: Whis speaks.

　07:22 | Whis: "Manipulating time to travel between the past and future is a serious felony. Time is only supposed to flow in one, single direction. If you turn back time and change the past, even if you only, say, pick a single flower, it affects subsequent history. Cities and even entire cultures could be greatly altered, and ultimately, it might result in a planet being erased from the universe."

Significance: Whis' explanation of time travel. Reemphasizes that time travel is a crime.

---

Context: Whis continues.

　07:53 | Bulma: "I understand how serious it can be, but..."
　07:56 | Whis: "That is why casual time travel is strictly prohibited, even among the gods."
　08:04 | Future Trunks: "The gods?"
　08:05 | Kid Trunks: "These two are from the world of the gods."
　08:09 | Beerus: "You most definitely deserve being destroyed for this."
　08:13 | Future Trunks: "Destroyed?!"
　08:24 | Future Trunks: "N-No! P-Please wait a moment, God!"
　08:30 | Whis: "He is the god."
　08:33 | Bulma: "And while he is a god, he's a God of Destruction."
　08:36 | Whis: "I am nothing more than his attendant."
　08:40 | Future Trunks: "Oh. I was certain that you were the god."

Significance: An interesting exchange where Whis' relation to Beerus is restated.

---

Context: Bulma examines/analyzes the time machine, but can't figure out how to make it work.

　11:38 | Bulma: "If only I could look into my future self's mind!"
　11:45 | Bulma: "What's this? This... This is..."
　12:03 | Bulma: "This is my handwriting! It's my notebook!"

Significance: Bulma finds the notebook from Future Bulma inside the time machine.

---

Context: Conversation.

　12:09 | Goku: "So what happened in the future?"
　12:11 | Vegeta: "Was it Majin Boo?"
　12:13 | Future Trunks: "No, Majin Boo's emergence was... It was an extremely difficult battle. However, I had received instructions from Kaioshin-sama. And so I somehow managed to defeat both Dabra and Bobbidi, and prevent Majin Boo from emerging. But then after that, an even more fearsome foe appeared."

Significance: Reveals that Dabra and Babidi appeared in Trunks' time. Notably, Trunks claims to have received "instructions" from Kaioshin, rather than simply "training".

---

Context: Trunks continues.

　13:32 | Future Trunks: "He called himself "Son Goku"."
　13:38 | Vegeta: "So you're saying this enemy calls himself "Son Goku" and looks just like him, right?"
　13:43 | Future Trunks: "Yes, that's right. He wears black clothing, so we call him "Goku Black"."
　13:52 | Goku: "For real?! That name's way cooler than mine!"
　13:56 | Bulma: "That name's so cliché!"
　14:00 | Future Trunks: "But, Mother... it was your future self who named him that."
　14:06 | Bulma: "Well, I might have been the one to come up with it, but it wasn't really me."
　14:12 | Future Trunks: "The day he appeared on Earth, he told us... that he would now proceed to exterminate all Earthlings in the name of justice. He also said he had already wiped out several planets and their inhabitants in this manner. I fought against him for a year. But now there are barely any humans left on the world's surface. Right before I came to this era, even Mother was..."
　15:24 | Bulma: "Y-You mean I died?"

Significance: Explains that Black has "wiped out several planets" already, and that his current goal is to exterminate the people of Earth "in the name of justice". Reveals that Black refers to himself as Son Goku, and that "Goku Black" is a name attributed to him by Bulma.

---

Context: Goku and Trunks prepare to spar.

　17:29 | Goku: "Trunks, let's do a bit of sparrin'!"
　17:32 | Goku: "I wanna have some kinda reference for how strong this Black guy is."
　17:36 | Future Trunks: "Understood."
　17:47 | Goku: "Super Saiyan 2 right out of the gate, huh?"

Significance: Reveals that Future Trunks has learned Super Saiyan 2 in the future.

　18:59 | Goku: "You ain't half bad!"
　19:01 | Future Trunks: "No, even like this I was no match for him. Each time we fought, he powered up more and more."

Significance: Black's power increases each time he fights Trunks. This is touched on in the following episode as well.

　19:10 | Goku: "In that case, try this on for size! Super Saiyan 3! Can you handle it?"
　19:28 | Future Trunks: "A-Amazing! I can't believe you've further surpassed the Super Saiyan that surpassed Super Saiyan."

Significance: Shows that Trunks is unfamiliar with Super Saiyan 3. Since the Super Saiyan forms weren't given numbers until the Boo arc, Trunks refers to it in a rather convoluted way.

　20:20 | Goku: "Awesome, Trunks! I'm impressed you improved so much all on your own."
　20:26 | Future Trunks: "Thank you very much. But..."
　20:28 | Goku: "Black is even stronger, huh?"
　20:31 | Future Trunks: "He's on par... No, maybe even stronger than you."

Significance: Trunks claims that Black is stronger than a Super Saiyan 3 Goku. Maybe.

Spoiler:

Context: Black arrives.

　02:59 | Whis: "Beerus-sama, take a look at his right hand."
　03:05 | Beerus: "That's..."
　03:07 | Whis: "Indeed."

Significance: Shows that Whis and Beerus recognize Black's Time Ring.

---

Context: Black arrives.

　03:13 | Black: "Vegeta... And even the God of Destruction, Beerus."

Significance: Shows that Black somehow recognizes Beerus and Vegeta.

　03:24 | Future Trunks: "How did you make it here?!"
　03:26 | Black: "It seems I've somehow followed you through the same path in space-time."

Significance: Explains that Black followed Trunks through spacetime via his Time Ring.

---

Context: Goku and Black meet.

　03:56 | Goku: "You really do look just like me!"
　04:00 | Black: "Good day to you, Son Goku."
　04:05 | Goku: "I dunno who you are, but whatever. You're supposed to be strong, right? Let's fight!"
　04:18 | Black: "What a privilege this is. I wanted to fight you too, with this body."
　04:25 | Goku: "What's that mean?"
　04:27 | Black: "There is no need for you to know."

Significance: Implies that Black's body is not his original body, and that he knows of Goku already.

---

Context: After exchanging blows.

　06:08 | Black: "Magnificent! So this is the power of Super Saiyan Son Goku."
　06:14 | Goku: "You're just like me. You get excited when facin' a strong opponent, don't you?"
　06:19 | Black: "Indeed."

Significance: Like Goku, Black gets excited while facing strong opponents. Notable? Maybe!

---

Context: The fight continunes.

　06:25 | Goku: "His ki went up!"
　06:59 | Kuririn: "The black one's power keeps rising!"
　07:02 | Future Trunks: "What is wrong with Goku-san? Why isn't he using the power he fought me with?"
　07:09 | Vegeta: "This is Kakarrotto's bad habit of holding back in the beginning."

Significance: Black's ki rises as the fight goes on. Vegeta mentions Goku's "bad habit" of holding back.

---

Context: Whis and Beerus watch the fight unfold.

　08:00 | Whis: "That "Black" is quite powerful."
　08:05 | Beerus: "Son Goku, yet not Son Goku... That's what I feel from that "Black" person's ki."

Significance: Speedsubs mishandled this line, claiming Goku and Black's ki had no similarities whatsoever.

---

Context: More punching happens.

　08:27 | Black: "Just what I wanted. Magnificent. This pain will make me even stronger!"
　09:12 | Goku: "You're kinda creepy."
　09:18 | Kuririn: "He raised his power again!"

Significance: Black's ki rises yet again. This time, he claims that the pain will make him stronger.

---

Context: The time machine gets knocked over during the fight.

　09:35 | Future Trunks: "The time machine!"
　09:42 | Black: "'Time machine', you say?"
　09:44 | Black: "So that's... He transcended time using that, huh?"

Significance: Trunks reveals the Time Machine to Black, who promptly destroys it.

---

Context: A black hole-looking thing appears in the sky.

　10:33 | Goku: "Hey, what's goin' on?"
　10:39 | Black: "The distortion in time and space is trying to correct itself?"
　10:55 | Kuririn: "Hey, what happened to that guy?"
　10:59 | Piccolo: "I can't sense his ki. He's vanished completely."
　11:03 | Beerus: "It doesn't look like he vanished willingly."
　11:07 | Whis: "This is just my hypothesis, but... It seems the distortion in time and space created by the time machine's journey reacted to the power of the Time Ring, and pulled Black into this era. But that distortion attempted to return to its usual state, much like a wound healing. And for that reason, the Time Ring must have forcibly pulled Black back to the era he came from. You might say... he ran out of time."

Significance: Whis explains to the audience why Black was forced to return to Trunks' time.

---

Context: Black returns to the future.

　12:13 | Black: "So this is the power of Super Saiyan Son Goku. I was able to engrave his fighting style into my own being. This will further perfect my own strength! I suppose I can't return to that era again. Well, it doesn't matter. I destroyed the time machine. Trunks can no longer leave that era."

Significance: Mysterious exposition. Black "engraves" (刻む) Goku's fighting style into himself.

---

Context: Trunks is upset that his time machine was destroyed.

　13:30 | Future Trunks: "He must have gone back to the future. But now I'll never be able to return there! And after Father and Goku-san agreed to fight alongside me... There's nobody left in the future who can stand up to him! He's sure to kill every last human, just as he declared he would!"
　14:08 | Goku: "Trunks. How strong was he now, compared to when you fought him in the future?"
　14:19 | Future Trunks: "I feel like he was a little stronger in the future..."
　14:22 | Goku: "Not way stronger, just a little?"
　14:24 | Future Trunks: "Yes, I think so."
　14:26 | Vegeta: "In that case, you don't have to worry. Kakarrotto's actual battle power is much greater than that. And for the record, so is mine."

Significance: Re-confirms that Black is no match for Goku and Vegeta. At least not from what we've seen so far.

---

Context: Piccolo speaks with Goku.

　14:41 | Piccolo: "It seemed to me that Black's ki kept rising throughout his fight against you."
　14:47 | Goku: "Yeah. I dunno how strong he might get."

Significance: Another reference to Black's ki rising.

---

Context: Exposition.

　16:28 | Whis: "Did you notice the ring Black had on his right hand?"
　16:34 | Whis: "That was a Time Ring, something only the Kaioshin are permitted to use."
　16:41 | Piccolo: "Does that mean that Black person is a Kaioshin?"
　16:44 | Beerus: "Nope. There's no Kaioshin that looks like Goku."
　16:53 | Future Trunks: "Then what could Black be?"
　16:56 | Beerus: "Now that I don't know."
　16:58 | Whis: "The Time Ring only allows one to go to the future, and then, from that future, back to the present day. Going further back in time was suppose to be impossible. Not only that, but even in the world of the gods, going back to the past is strictly prohibited."

Significance: Reveals that the Kaioshin are the only ones permitted to use Time Rings, and that ordinarily, they only go to the future and back.

While Black went to the past via the Time Ring, he did so by following Trunks through a distortion in spacetime, and ultimately, was forced to return to the future. Now that the distortion has closed itself, Black cannot pursue Trunks.

---

Context: More exposition.

　17:25 | Future Trunks: "Then, if we had that ring, we'd be able to return to the future, right?"
　17:30 | Future Trunks: "Please lend me a ring, God!"
　17:33 | Beerus: "You're really starting to get on my nerves. Keep nagging me like this and I'll destroy you."
　17:41 | Beerus: "I am a God of Destruction. Only the Kaioshin have the right to use the Time Rings."

Significance: Shows that not even a God of Destruction is allowed to use a Time Ring.

---

Context: Bulma leaves to search for something, then returns.

　20:56 | Bulma: "I looked all over the place for it! It was really hard to find!"
　21:00 | Kid Trunks: "Looked for what?"
　21:14 | Bulma: "Ta-da! A time machine! There was another one, remember?"

Significance: Reveals that Bulma kept the time machine that Cell arrived in.

Spoiler:

Context: Trunks examines the time machine.

　03:52 | Future Trunks: "Look at this. I wrote the word "HOPE!!" here right before I took off."

Significance: Contrary to the FUNimation dub and the official DBZ/Kai English subtitles, Trunks (not Bulma) is the one that wrote “ＨＯＰＥ” on his time machine.

---

Context: Flashback.

　04:44 | Bulma: "You have two of those capsules, right?"
　04:47 | Bulma: "Is it okay if I take one?"
　04:51 | Future Trunks: "What... You mean one of these?"
　04:54 | Future Trunks: "But this is the one Cell used..."
　04:56 | Bulma: "Well, I did build both of them."
　04:59 | Bulma: "Either way, it's a time machine, right?"
　05:01 | Bulma: "I want to see what makes it tick."
　05:06 | Future Trunks: "Okay, then."
　05:07 | Future Trunks: "I'll let you have that one, Mother."
　05:10 | Bulma: "Thanks, Trunks."

　05:13 | Bulma: "Immediately after Trunks went back to the future,"
　05:16 | Bulma: "I started analysing the time machine, but..."
　05:21 | Bulma: "I just couldn't figure out how it worked."
　05:25 | Goku: "But you were the one who built it, weren'tcha?"
　05:27 | Bulma: "That was the future me. In the end, I threw in the towel, put it away, and just forgot about it."


Significance: Explains how Bulma came to possess the time machine that Trunks took with him.

---

Context: Black to the future.

　08:37 | Black: "The memories from that battle are being deeply engraved into my body and mind. These movements... This body... I'm growing accustomed to them. So this is Son Goku? More... I want to learn more about Son Goku. If I do, I'll be able to grow even stronger!"

Significance: Another strong "hint" that Black's body is not his own.

---

Context: Trunks discusses the future.

　13:17 | Kid Mai: "Tell me about my future self."
　13:22 | Future Trunks: "In the future, Mai was older than you are now, about the same age as me."

Significance: In case there was any doubt, Future Mai is around Trunks' age (at least physically).

　13:44 | Future Trunks: "Black's first attack wiped out most of humanity. But humanity struck back. Every national army staged an attack on Black, but... The survivors went into hiding underground, and before long, banded together and formed a resistance army to continue the fight. And the key person to this was your future self."

Significance: Explains that Mai plays an important role in the resistance.

　16:44 | Black: "Humans are unnecessary. They should be wiped out."
　16:48 | Future Trunks: "That's not for you to decide!"
　16:50 | Black: "I am looking at things from a far higher perspective than you. I observe this world, this universe, the truth of all things. And I have realised that humans must be destroyed. Out of all which the gods have made, humans are their sole failure. In order to make this world, this universe, into a more beautiful utopia, I must remove humanity, in place of the gods who refuse to admit their mistake."

Significance: Black cryptically explains his motives.

　18:27 | Future Mai: "If only we had Sage Beans, these injuries wouldn't be a problem..."
　18:32 | Future Trunks: "But Karin-sama is long gone."

Significance: Reveals that Karin is no longer around.

---

Context: Trunks finishes his story.

　19:36 | Kid Trunks: "But why didn't that other Mai come with you?"
　19:42 | Future Trunks: "Because..."
　19:55 | Kid Mai: "Then, my future self is..."
　19:59 | Pilaf & Shu: "What about my future self?"
　20:02 | Future Trunks: "Uh... I have no idea, I've never met them."

Significance: Reveals that Trunks does not know Pilaf and Shuu in the future.

---

Context: Future Trunks leaves. Dreamily.

　21:11 | Kid Trunks: "What's the matter, Mai-chan?"
　21:13 | Kid Mai: "That handsome, brooding visage... He's so cool..."
　21:19 | Bulma: "For a little squirt, you sure talk like an old biddy."

This line was mishandled by speedsubs, causing a bit of confusion.

[alakazam^]

Context: Black arrives.

　03:13 | Black: "Vegeta... And even the God of Destruction, Beerus."

Significance: Shows that Black somehow recognizes Beerus and Whis.

Shouldn't that be Vegeta and Beers?