How to Make 6/10/15 and Super Work

[Hero]

So, many people adopted the 6/10/15 power rankings (or whatever you want to call it) for SSJG Goku, Beerus, and Whis respectively in BoG. They also used it for Resurrection F, especially due to Whis's line that Goku and Vegeta working together could be a match for Beerus.

Dragon Ball Super, on the other hand, pretty much destroyed these numbers. In particular, the KKx10 moment from Goku made it appear as if SSJB was still less than 10% Beerus, and my response is, that's not necessarily the case.

Yes, KKx10 SSJB Goku can be weaker than Beerus, but not due to power. Similar to how SSJ Grade 3 Trunks was stronger than Cell power wise but still his inferior, Goku is much stronger than Beerus with his KKx10, but would be beaten die to kaioken's problems.

Proof: Champa tells Hit to simply dodge Goku until his kaioken drains him. Beerus is made out to be a better fighter than Champa, so if Champa could easily see the faults of kaioken, then so would Beerus. So even though Goku is stronger than the god of destruction, his power would not necessarily win him the fight. This also preserves the 6/10/15 numbers.

Tl;dr:

Power wise-

SSJB Goku < Beerus <<<< KKx10 SSJB

But Beerus would still win, just like how SSJG3 Trunks couldn't beat Cell even though he was stronger. I find it interesting how Trunks losing to Cell, even with a power advantage, is accepted so easily by everyone, but this can cause some heads to scratch.

[MadSaiyantist]

Dodging a hypothetical 60 Goku when you're only a 10 is a lot easier said than done. You think Beerus could outrun someone who is six times faster than he is? Whis managed to knock out Beerus in one shot while he was only 50% stronger than Beerus. Technically, Beerus can't even be touched one time. 6/10/15 just doesn't make sense in terms of the anime anymore.

[MadSaiyantist]

Also, this isn't comparable to Grade 3 Trunks vs Perfect Cell. Trunks sacrificed speed/mobility for raw strength. Kaioken multiplies all abilities including speed with the only drawback being immense pain.

[TheMikado]

You poor guys
Trust me I feel your pain.

[Hero]

Dodging a hypothetical 60 Goku when you're only a 10 is a lot easier said than done. You think Beerus could outrun someone who is six times faster than he is? Whis managed to knock out Beerus in one shot while he was only 50% stronger than Beerus. Technically, Beerus can't even be touched one time. 6/10/15 just doesn't make sense in terms of the anime anymore.

But here's the thing: Hit, whose weaker than Beerus, survived being hit by KKx10 SSJB Goku. So if he survived, then why wouldn't Beerus?

[MadSaiyantist]

But here's the thing: Hit, whose weaker than Beerus, survived being hit by KKx10 SSJB Goku. So if he survived, then why wouldn't Beerus?

Because Beerus wouldn't be wearing plot armor.

[Sandubadear]

The only way to make it work is: Beerus and Whis weren't at full power, 10 and 15 are just their relaxed states. Of course, there's the 70% line from BoG, but you may disregard that just like the fifty times Beerus said he was at full power in Super.

[Lord Beerus]

The 10% line fuck ups everything and makes power scaling damn near impossible when trying to work with the context of the 6-10-15 scale. You really have no other choice but to believe that Beerus was bullshitting.

[Hero]

But here's the thing: Hit, whose weaker than Beerus, survived being hit by KKx10 SSJB Goku. So if he survived, then why wouldn't Beerus?

Because Beerus wouldn't be wearing plot armor.

That's not an in-universe reason, though, and frankly, an overused excuse not to give an actual answer. If someone wanted to, they could answer every in-universe power discussion question with "plot."

Super showed Hit surviving Goku's KKx10, meaning that someone weaker than Champa can survive it. Thus, Beerus could too.

[Kaboom]

The answer to the question of "how to make Toriyama's 6/10/15 scaling work with Super" is a simple "don't." You probably can't, and there's really no need to bother trying. Toriyama gave those numbers in regards to specifically the Battle of Gods film version of the story, which he essentially wrote, and they still worked fine later in Resurrection F, which he straight-up did write.

Super, meanwhile, has just gone balls-to-the-wall wild with its reinterpretation of both those stories and the new ones derived from Toriyama's outlines, and in typical Toei fashion there's essentially zero care or attention to consistency. This nicely put-together little scale for Goku, Beerus, and Whis' respective powers is just one of the many casualties of the story downgrade from the films to Super.

[TheMikado]

The answer to the question of "how to make Toriyama's 6/10/15 scaling work with Super" is a simple "don't." You probably can't, and there's really no need to bother trying. Toriyama gave those numbers in regards to specifically the Battle of Gods film version of the story, which he essentially wrote, and they still worked fine later in Resurrection F, which he straight-up did write.

Super, meanwhile, has just gone balls-to-the-wall wild with its reinterpretation of both those stories and the new ones derived from Toriyama's outlines, and in typical Toei fashion there's essentially zero care or attention to consistency. This nicely put-together little scale for Goku, Beerus, and Whis' respective powers is just one of the many casualties of the story downgrade from the films to Super.

And there's your answer folks

[ChiefWamsutta]

Question: Was there a statement in an interview where Beerus was supposed to be the one who sealed Old Kai away in the Z Sword? If I recall correctly, that statement mentioned Beerus being around Majin Buu's strength ... so couldn't Beerus have just gotten stronger after the SSG fight?

[RandomGuy96]

The answer to the question of "how to make Toriyama's 6/10/15 scaling work with Super" is a simple "don't." You probably can't, and there's really no need to bother trying. Toriyama gave those numbers in regards to specifically the Battle of Gods film version of the story, which he essentially wrote, and they still worked fine later in Resurrection F, which he straight-up did write.

Super, meanwhile, has just gone balls-to-the-wall wild with its reinterpretation of both those stories and the new ones derived from Toriyama's outlines, and in typical Toei fashion there's essentially zero care or attention to consistency. This nicely put-together little scale for Goku, Beerus, and Whis' respective powers is just one of the many casualties of the story downgrade from the films to Super.

I think the 6/10/15 scale still works fine in the manga version of Super, which he supervises, iirc.

[Kaboom]

I think the 6/10/15 scale still works fine in the manga version of Super, which he supervises, iirc.

Yeah, come to think of it you're probably right. Goku's SS Blue Kaio-Ken in the anime is the only thing I know of that really flies in its face.

[miguelnuva1]

Here's what you do

Goku with his God Ki is a 7(SSJB is stronger than SSJG)

Kaio-Ken multiplies his normal ki not God ki. This makes him only a 7.5 to a 9 Not a 70.

[TheMikado]

Simpler answer to your question- The goal posts have now moved. It is now a 6-100-150 scale.

This reason isn't thing new..
Think Frieza's hahaha this is not even my final form, then hands tied behind back, only using 50% power, etc.
Same with android's to not finally android's to Cell, to not perfect cell, to Perfect, to hahaha, I have generated into Super Cell!
I don't even have to go into Buu, Evil buu, Super Buu, Buuhan, kid buu, etc.

The big difference is that it's handled so casually with no exposition. If Beerus has said in RoF "Remember that 70% I said? Yeah I was totally lying, I'm 100x stronger than that." We probably would have been ok with it because that's what we are use to in Dragonball Z. Admittedly it was less of a guessing game in Z but it still had the classic out of no where power pulls.

[ekrolo2]

Here's what you do

Goku with his God Ki is a 7(SSJB is stronger than SSJG)

Kaio-Ken multiplies his normal ki not God ki. This makes him only a 7.5 to a 9 Not a 70.

I don't even want to think about the logistics of this.

[Chiki]

It's important to keep in mind that Beerus was scared/nervous about Kaioken x2 before Goku said anything about x10.