Question about the Janken Rock, Scissors and Paper

Tyro · Post by **Tyro** » Fri Mar 02, 2007 9:21 pm

Well, my question isn't about the technique specifically, but a time it's used. In the beginning of Dragonball Goku uses this technique against a giant bear warrior. He says all of the words (without striking with "rock" and "scissors", mind you) but when he says "paper" he doesn't do an open hand smash like it should have been. Instead he used the rock portion of the attack which is just a punch.

And yes, I'm fully aware you can use different attacks without saying the correct words.

My question is, was this a simple slip up by Mr. Toriyama? Did he already have the technique planned out? Did he know "rock" meant punch, "scissors" meant eye poke, and "paper" meant palm smash? Or did the move just become that over time?

Post by **TripleRach** » Fri Mar 02, 2007 9:41 pm

Where are you seeing this? I just checked in my Japanese manga, and all he says is Janken, then Guu/Rock and gives a punch.

...Hmm, decided to check the Japanese anime, too, and he also just says "Janken Guu" and gives a punch.

This sounds like some kind of translation error.

MisterFlashdude · Post by **MisterFlashdude** » Fri Mar 02, 2007 9:48 pm

It is. In the Viz version, they keep the order 'Rock, Scissors, Paper' through out the first volume. So when he first uses it, instead of 'Jan... Ken...' he says 'Rock... Scissors...' and then what's left is paper.

Tyro · Post by **Tyro** » Fri Mar 02, 2007 10:22 pm

Just so I'm fully understanding this, in the Japanese version of the manga Goku says "Jan...ken..." in the place of where he says "Rock...Scissors..." in the Viz version? I'd have never thought Viz would have translated something that wrongly.

The S · Post by **The S** » Sat Mar 03, 2007 1:17 am

I have a question related to a Wikipedia reference to the attack. It is said that Kamesennin is the inventor of the technique, but I don't recall any mention that he even used it. As far as I know, it was Son Gohan's secret technique he taught Gokuu.

Lavender Saiyan · Post by **Lavender Saiyan** » Sat Mar 03, 2007 2:34 am

Yeah that's wrong. I believe even Roshi himself states that the Janken is Gohan's move.

MisterFlashdude · Post by **MisterFlashdude** » Sat Mar 03, 2007 9:56 am

Tyro wrote:Just so I'm fully understanding this, in the Japanese version of the manga Goku says "Jan...ken..." in the place of where he says "Rock...Scissors..." in the Viz version? I'd have never thought Viz would have translated something that wrongly.

Yep, that's how it goes. They later changed all references of Janken to Rochambeau (or as they spell it, Roshambo) which, from what I can gather, is a UK equivalent to rock, paper, scissors. Why? Possibly because when it came time to fill the word bubbles, it had the same sylables as Janken in the execution. ('Ro-Sham-Bo!' 'Jan-Ken-Pon!')
Unfortunately, no one really knows about Rochambeau in American, and (as mentioned on one of the podcast episodes) the South Park writers used the name Roshambo for a game that involves kicking eachother in the balls until you can't continue anymore.
As for Goku's move, he shouts 'Jan Ken!' and instead of Pon! (which is like rock, scissors, paper, SHOOT!) he shouts out the japanese equivalent of rock, paper or scissors.

Translations are funny.. they feel they have to change Janken, but a few pages later they left Kame-sennin in.

I don't get their decision making process sometimes...

lets go swimming · Post by **lets go swimming** » Sun Mar 04, 2007 2:14 pm

in volume 5 roshi says he's seen the move a lot, and being gohans teacher.

and goku throws rock scissors paper and the words match up

in the viz translation

caejones · Post by **caejones** » Tue Mar 06, 2007 8:25 am

And they actually said Jankin at the 21st Budokai, all be it with a pronunciation I don't remember clearly...
Translating is hard for large audiences.