This franchise has become a joke now

[AnimeMaakuo]

What is happening to this franchise?

I can remember being a child and literally dropping my jaw when I first saw Goku turn Super Saiyan. It was literally the most coolest thing to ever happen with Dragon Ball Z. Even Ryūsei Nakao voicing Freeza was terrifying. The ending of Goku, Freeza, and Namek felt bitter sweet. After some time had passed, there was a promo in Japan starring Trunks. At first, I thought this person came from outer space, but he was literally a Saiyan from the future.

Trunks was not your ordinary Saiyan, either. Turns out he was Vegeta's son! Wow. The franchise took off yet again when we discovered that a creature named Cell, was lurking around sucking his victims through a green straw. One of the most memorable moments was seeing Vegeta reach Super Saiyan, Cell become Perfect, and Gohan surpass what nobody ever thought was imaginable. Once Majin Buu came around, we got to see Gotenks, Vegetto, Majin Vegeta, Super Saiyan 3 Goku, and Ultimate Gohan. Now, I understand that there's quite a bit of distaste here for DBGT, but I absolutely adored it! The music was fantastic, and everything else just screamed nostalgia.

After that, we got to see some side films here and there, but Dragon Ball Z: Battle of Gods? That was IMHO a ginormous slap to the face. The franchise was being squeezed tremendously at that point, despite the plot holes. "Super Saiyan God", though? Haven't we already had enough of this? Why do we need MORE transformations and BIGGER explosions?

I was appalled when I learned that soon after, Dragon Ball Z: Revival of F would be in the making. Oh boy, Freeza is back somehow and stronger than ever. Wait, what?! Let's see.. Cooler came back, Broly came back, and now they want Freeza to come back? Couldn't they have thought of something different than to copy what was used back then? They even went as far as to introduce "Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan" ("BLUPER SAIYAN"). It sounds and looks absolutely ridiculous! Also, how could Freeza be so much more stronger than before?

But wait, there's more! We now have Dragon Ball Super Episode 56: Rematch with Goku Black! Introducing Super Saiyan Rose!

..Are you kidding me?! Now we've got "Super Saiyan God" with violet hair, "Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan" ("BLUPER SAIYAN") with blue hair, and now Mr. Goku Black(?) with "Super Saiyan Rose"? You can't be serious!? What's next, "Super Saiyan God Dandelion Super Saiyan" and "Super Saiyan God Sunflower Super Saiyan"? Is it just me, or has anybody else noticed how awful the franchise has gotten? They might as well turn Piccolo into "Super Saiyan God Hulk Super Saiyan" and explain how Piccolo inherited Saiyan genes from Broly and Goku Orange because that's how senseless this series has gotten.

[Boo Machine]

I'm sorry if the point is flying over my head, but is it just the transformations that are bothering you?

Or are there other factors?

Edit: I know you mentioned Villains coming back, but that's really only happened in movies.

I can see why more transformation in general could bother someone, especially since these new ones have bright colors, but they at least seem to be sticking to this one Bluper saiyan. Rose is a thing sure, but so far it appears to be a form exclusive to the villain which I feel shouldn't be brushed off simply because it seems like a super saiyan form. Freeza, cell, and Majin buu had many more tranformations.

[Zephyr]

Well, it did start as a gag manga. It being a joke is fitting.

[AnimeMaakuo]

I'm sorry if the point is flying over my head, but is it just the transformations that are bothering you?

Or are there other factors?

The story, the transformations, the plot holes, the animation, the change in sound effects, etc.

[Dbzfan94]

My opinions on God Ki aside, I actually like how SSJ Rose looks. The series always has had plot holes though. But the new sound affects are admittedly very distracting

[Boo Machine]

I'm sorry if the point is flying over my head, but is it just the transformations that are bothering you?

Or are there other factors?

The story, the transformations, the plot holes, the animation, the change in sound effects, etc.

I don't know if I would go as far as calling it a joke, but it is different, that for sure. If one is too used to how the older shows did things, the newer material would understandably be bothersome with the story arguably hitting different beats and the transformations being handled another way than it was previously. The series has always had plot holes and I barely noticed the sound effects till it was pointed out.
I personally love most of the newer material outside of the movie retellings.

But I am one who usually eats up anything Dragonball so take that for what you will.

[Anime Kitten]

I don't understand the intention behind these complaints. No one is forcing you to watch or enjoy this content. If it's just because it's Dragon Ball, then you always have the original manga and anime. And if you want new content, then enjoy it instead of complaining. There's nothing wrong with sharing your opinion, but if you aren't enjoying what's coming out now, then simply don't watch it. Otherwise, just enjoy it for what it is and don't take it so seriously.

[AnimeMaakuo]

I don't understand the intention behind these complaints.

What is happening to this franchise?

Is it just me, or has anybody else noticed how awful the franchise has gotten?

[Anime Kitten]

Neither of those quotes responded to my post. Could you elaborate, please?

[AnimeMaakuo]

Neither of those quotes responded to my post. Could you elaborate, please?

I'm appalled by the drastic change in the franchise, therefore I've decided to post my opinion and would like to know if anybody else see's it from my perspective. Does that make sense?

[Anime Kitten]

I'm appalled by the drastic change in the franchise, therefore I've decided to post my opinion and would like to know if anybody else see's it from my perspective. Does that make sense?

Yes, thank you. My point is, if you want to like the new content, then just enjoy it for what it is. Personally, I love Super Saiyan Blue, it's my favorite form. If not, then I can't help you other than to say you'll probably want to stick to pre-BOG.

[OWmyDragonBallz]

I agree Maakuo. Sure the golden era of DB had plot holes. But they are seriously insignificant ones compared to Super and they were fun to try and get around. . Now there are just plot holes at every turn. Piccolo going from weaker than Cell to stronger than Vegetto and far beyond that with all these other random characters popping out of nowhere that make Boo look like nothing when it was established that he would have destroyed the whole universe with everyone in it...yeah, no.

[Kanassa]

Piccolo going from weaker than Cell to stronger than Vegetto

The hell ar eyou talking about?

and far beyond that with all these other random characters popping out of nowhere that make Boo look like nothing when it was established that he would have destroyed the whole universe with everyone in it...yeah, no.

You could say that about every villain in the entire series before the next one appears.

[Clayton]

Neither of those quotes responded to my post. Could you elaborate, please?

I'm appalled by the drastic change in the franchise, therefore I've decided to post my opinion and would like to know if anybody else see's it from my perspective. Does that make sense?

hmm yea i've felt this way for a long time but i dont watch super. at first i was going to just accept it for what it was as a spin off but after reviewing the terrible ratings it got in Japan i didn't care especially for the red hair god form lol

[Zephyr]

I'm appalled by the drastic change in the franchise, therefore I've decided to post my opinion and would like to know if anybody else see's it from my perspective.

Loads of people do, and it feels as if they've hardly let a week go by without letting everyone know.

[Hero]

1. The series has always had plot holes. Example one: Goku begins searching for his dragonball in the Red Ribbon Arc even though a year hasn't passed since the first wish.

2. Agreed on the new sound effects being garbage.

3. Agreed with anyone who says that the score for Super is usually garbage.

4. Agreed with anyone who says the animation and art of Super is many times beyond garbage.

5. However, the series is still selling in Japan, so it is anything but a joke.

6. Battle of Gods was amazing. Resurrection F was fun for what it was. Still better than GT (minus GT's score).

[SaintEvolution]

Oldfags are complicated.


Also, you said you loved Dragon Ball GT, that was just atrocious in plot and character development. Super has some problems, but it couldn't be worse than GT even if the anime wanted it. Just because of that I cannot take your commentary seriously.

[clutchins]

1. The series has always had plot holes. Example one: Goku begins searching for his dragonball in the Red Ribbon Arc even though a year hasn't passed since the first wish.

2. Agreed on the new sound effects being garbage.

3. Agreed with anyone who says that the score for Super is usually garbage.

4. Agreed with anyone who says the animation and art of Super is many times beyond garbage.

5. However, the series is still selling in Japan, so it is anything but a joke.

6. Battle of Gods was amazing. Resurrection F was fun for what it was. Still better than GT (minus GT's score).

Agreed. Super is a far cry from the greatness that Z was, but I still enjoy it week to week. I think the story is a little too Goku-focused compared to Z, though.

Oldfags are complicated.


Also, you said you loved Dragon Ball GT, that was just atrocious in plot and character development. Super has some problems, but it couldn't be worse than GT even if the anime wanted it. Just because of that I cannot take your commentary seriously.

Having an opinion on GT is not the same as stating an objective fact. Don't conflate the two. You have a valid opinion only insofar as Maakuo also has a valid opinion. I'm not defending GT myself, rather I'm defending the right for people to defend GT.

[Cipher]

It's going to be interesting to see how the next generation of fans wind up feeling about Super. As in, ones who come into the series through it or wind up reading/watching the series after Super has long-concluded.

My initial reaction is that I ... largely agree with the opening post. Not because of its Super Saiyan forms or story content in concept (those really seem all that different from Super Saiyan 2-4?). I don't think Super is worth endlessly complaining about, nor do I think its story content is appalling -- indeed, I really like the two recent movies, and think any of this could play nearly as well as the original content in Toriyama's hands. The real issue is that, for any number of reasons, it's not up to par with the original TV run direction wise. And yes, that includes GT, which for whatever storytelling gaffes may bother you, manages to be wonderfully directed.

This isn't simply a gripe about the rushed animation either, though that doesn't help. Nor do some of the elements that impact the feeling of scenes that are constant to the series aid it in any way-- the character models, the color palette, the soundtrack, none of which I think are stellar. It may stem from the same place of rushed production, but scenes are simply rarely directed with impact or flow, and it's compounded by the other problems above. Some lack of coordination seems to have extended to the writers as well -- never have characters been quite this inconsistent, and never have comedy-beats-per-episode felt this mandatory.

So, yeah. As an adult fan with longstanding familiarity with earlier portions of the series, I don't think Super holds up in execution to any of the previous three anime. Story-wise, I think it might be able to, as all of its ideas are interesting, but it's difficult to say given its inconsistent and often juvenile writing out of Toriyama's hands.

That all said -- and this is why I brought up that next group of fans at the beginning of this post -- I can still easily see this hooking a child. With a less critical eye, and with less Dragon Ball material to compare it to, I can imagine rapturously tuning in each week to see what will happen when Freeza shows up on Earth, who will win the tournament against Champa, etc., wondering about all the previous material and trying to watch/view whatever earlier portions are most easily available. It's still an imaginative, engaging serial, even if it has innumerable shortcomings as a production compared to previous content.

tl;dr: I do think it's worse -- unfortunately so, given what this material might look like with Toriyama fully scripting each portion -- but how much worse, I don't think I'm in a position to fully say as an established, adult fan. Tune back in fifteen years from now, because I think this material is still very much capable of doing the job the original run once did for most of us, in whatever form we saw it.

[Saikyo no Senshi]

When selling toys is given more importance by the writers/producers than telling a story what more can you expect?

Reviving the franchise is always something I never wanted so I agree that for me personally the franchise is at its absolute worst now.

But you can't deny that commercially it is soaring. BOG and ROF did well broke records Super is also doing well so mission accomplished for Toei. As long as their pockets are filled Super will go on. It is like the Fast&Furious franchise no organic storytelling but still a commercial success.

- Travis