Super Animation Catalogue 2.0

[Ajay]

Focus less on how long supervisors have had and look at the schedules of the key animators. A lot of these episodes are made in tandem with one another. People are all over the place.

Higashide is the best example. While Karasawa had plenty of free time (despite working on #56), Higashide's been working his ass off on episodes sequentially for months now. Luckily, the rest of the bunch on this week's episode don't seem to have been on many other projects.

You'll see this is the case with quite a lot of animators, actually. They're either working a crap load of Super episodes or they're off working in other places. Doesn't always matter how long the supervisor's had.

With shows like Shippuuden and Pokémon, the best episodes are made up of animators like Shida who haven't been anywhere near the series and just pop up to blow people away with plenty of time to do so. Super doesn't often have that.

[ArchedThunder]

Focus less on how long supervisors have had and look at the schedules of the key animators. A lot of these episodes are made in tandem with one another. People are all over the place.

Higashide is the best example. While Karasawa had plenty of free time (despite working on #56), Higashide's been working his ass off on episodes sequentially for months now. Luckily, the rest of the bunch on this week's episode don't seem to have been on many other projects.

You'll see this is the case with quite a lot of animators, actually. They're either working a crap load of Super episodes or they're off working in other places. Doesn't always matter how long the supervisor's had.

With shows like Shippuuden and Pokémon, the best episodes are made up of animators like Shida who haven't been anywhere near the series and just pop up to blow people away with plenty of time to do so. Super doesn't often have that.

I'm not sure exactly what this has to do with what I was saying. I was saying that for other shows like Super(including Shippuden) the supervisors have their episodes release 6-12 months after each other and that I find it very hard to believe that Shippuuden episodes have 4 to 6 months of animation time. Google turns up nothing, the only shows I can find with schedules like that are ones that are 1 or a few cours and planned from start to finish.

[Avok]

Focus less on how long supervisors have had and look at the schedules of the key animators. A lot of these episodes are made in tandem with one another. People are all over the place.

Higashide is the best example. While Karasawa had plenty of free time (despite working on #56), Higashide's been working his ass off on episodes sequentially for months now. Luckily, the rest of the bunch on this week's episode don't seem to have been on many other projects.

You'll see this is the case with quite a lot of animators, actually. They're either working a crap load of Super episodes or they're off working in other places. Doesn't always matter how long the supervisor's had.

With shows like Shippuuden and Pokémon, the best episodes are made up of animators like Shida who haven't been anywhere near the series and just pop up to blow people away with plenty of time to do so. Super doesn't often have that.

Just clicking on random names for animators for Shippuuden and a lot of them pop up very frequently, not as frequently as Higashide in Super, but very frequently like a lot of Super's regulars.
I find it very hard to believe that Shippuuden episodes have 4 to 6 months of animation time, that was my point.

Some of them do, but those are the prime episodes. For example, ep #463 which aired in June was being produced since January, iirc. The result is an episode that's almost movie-quality, not just in the animation, but the storyboards and the art.

[ArchedThunder]

Some of them do, but those are the prime episodes. For example, ep #463 which aired in June was being produced since January, iirc. The result is an episode that's almost movie-quality, not just in the animation, but the storyboards and the art.

I can't find anything on when the animation work started for any Naruto episode.
If any Naruto episodes actually have the animation being worked on for that long I would assume that's thanks to the fact that they have a ton of manga built up to work off of since they've done so much filler.

[Ajay]

I'm not sure exactly what this has to do with what I was saying.

Wasn't specifically directed at you. I was making a general comment.

It's just that a lot of people seem hung up on the schedule of the supervisor without considering what the schedule is for the people actually animating alongside them.

Jacob's posted an example of Pokémon's schedule for a major episode in the past:

November 05, 2009: DP #150 airs.
November 10, 2009: Iwane Masa'aki posts about working on Diamond & Pearl Episode #170.
November 12, 2009: DP #151-152 airs, Iwane works on both.
April 01, 2010: Natsume Kunihiko-supervised Pocket Monster Diamond & Pearl Episode #170 airs with action cuts by Iwane Masa'aki.
That's about twenty episodes of buffer.

It's what I'm trying to get at. While Natsume's last supervised episode was #164 before #170 aired, the episode was being worked on long before that even aired. It's not always a linear production and it's important to consider what key animators are doing, too.

[Avok]

I can't find anything on when the animation work started for any Naruto episode.
If any Naruto episodes actually have the animation being worked on for that long I would assume that's thanks to the fact that they have a ton of manga built up to work off of since they've done so much filler.

Some of the staff will tweet about it, for example.

[DragonBalllKaiHD]

We also have to remember an animation supervisor's role. Their main job is to supervise key animators' work and correct it if it's necessary to ensure that the character model is consistent within an episode. A supervisor can have 6 to 12 weeks to check on their work. But a key animator's schedule is more important than the supervisor's because they are the one producing drawings. So someone with high-end talents like Shida or Ken who almost needs no correction from a supervisor would need a lot more than 12 weeks to make cuts more spectacular than we are accustomed to seeing each week. That's why I said they need 16 to 20 weeks on a consistent basis.

[ArchedThunder]

I'm not sure exactly what this has to do with what I was saying.

Wasn't specifically directed at you. I was making a general comment.

It's just that a lot of people seem hung up on the schedule of the supervisor without considering what the schedule is for the people actually animating alongside them.

Jacob's posted an example of Pokémon's schedule for a major episode in the past:

November 05, 2009: DP #150 airs.
November 10, 2009: Iwane Masa'aki posts about working on Diamond & Pearl Episode #170.
November 12, 2009: DP #151-152 airs, Iwane works on both.
April 01, 2010: Natsume Kunihiko-supervised Pocket Monster Diamond & Pearl Episode #170 airs with action cuts by Iwane Masa'aki.
That's about twenty episodes of buffer.

It's what I'm trying to get at. While Natsume's last supervised episode was #164 before #170 aired, the episode was being worked on long before that even aired. It's not always a linear production and it's important to consider what key animators are doing, too.

So for normal episodes they're pretty close to normal, but for important episodes they're still less than half of what Pokemon has? That's kinda depressing, but with what they've managed to achieve with the schedule right now(and when it was much worse) getting up to 12 weeks of animation and having 15+ animators for important episodes would probably be "enough" for some episodes that look great front to back. How is One Piece in this regard, does it ever have episodes with an insane number of weeks for animation?

We also have to remember an animation supervisor's role. Their main job is to supervise key animators' work and correct it if it's necessary to ensure that the character model is consistent within an episode. A supervisor can have 6 to 12 weeks to check on their work. But a key animator's schedule is more important than the supervisor's because they are the one producing drawings. So someone with high-end talents like Shida or Ken who almost needs no correction from a supervisor would need a lot more than 12 weeks to make cuts more spectacular than we are accustomed to seeing each week. That's why I said they need 16 to 20 weeks on a consistent basis.

Supervisors also often do plenty of animation work on their episodes. Even if important episodes of Pokemon and Naruto can get up to 20 weeks of animation there is no way that's what every episode gets.

[Alee9977]

Wow, if this people can make episodes like 56, 56 in only 8 weeks, imagine what they could do with 20 weeks or so.
Does anybody know how much time an episode of One Piece needs to be produced? Is It like DOS or they have more time?

[JulieYBM]

Wow, if this people can make episodes like 56, 56 in only 8 weeks, imagine what they could do with 20 weeks or so.
Does anybody know how much time an episode of One Piece needs to be produced? Is It like DOS or they have more time?

Animation is usually done about a month ahead of schedule, unless the schedule is messed up due to a shortage of animators. I think Studio Guts is working on Episode #758 right now and Episode #755 just aired.

Production on Dragon Ball Super wouldn't be so bad if the animators being hired were more skilled and didn't need to be corrected all the time, but there's a shortage of staff already, so that's not going to get resolved with the series still running.

[Metalwario64]

Shida's cut was fantastic, and I'm so glad that he didn't adhere to Yamamuro's current character models.

Though, the rest of the episode looked good, but it would have been even better with Yamamuro's Buu arc character designs and colors (click for full size images):
Super:


Corrected to Yamamuro's 90s model:


On this shot, the way the nose was drawn and the shading made his nose have a really odd perspective with his nose, and I don't like how the eyes are straight with the current designs.

Also, for personal preference, I made the colors match Z. Here is the shot with Super's palette:


I'm tempted to make a thread for my style corrections...

[Anime Kitten]

I'm tempted to make a thread for my style corrections...

Do it, do it! I'd love to see that.

[Bansho64]

I'm tempted to make a thread for my style corrections...

Do it, do it! I'd love to see that.

Count me in as a vote! Metalwario64 always does some really good corrections!

[nite_jay]

I'm tempted to make a thread for my style corrections...

I'd be a happy dude if you did that. I'd rather see some more accurate representations than just that Salvamakoto guy's work.

[ArchedThunder]

Animation is usually done about a month ahead of schedule, unless the schedule is messed up due to a shortage of animators. I think Studio Guts is working on Episode #758 right now and Episode #755 just aired.

Production on Dragon Ball Super wouldn't be so bad if the animators being hired were more skilled and didn't need to be corrected all the time, but there's a shortage of staff already, so that's not going to get resolved with the series still running.

How is this not a problem that can be solved while the show is still running? Every other long running show gets new animators to hop on board during its run, and even Super sees new animators from time to time (like Shida in this most recent episode). Wasn't the problem with getting talent on the show up to this point simply that the schedule was so bad that animators didn't want to work on the show? With them potentially having upwards of 9 weeks of animation after the next break it shouldn't be as hard for Toei to get more talent on board.

[Cipher]

Also, for personal preference, I made the colors match Z. Here is the shot with Super's palette:

1) Nice job.

2) Ugh, I hate Super's color palette so much.

[samuo2]

Shida's cut was fantastic, and I'm so glad that he didn't adhere to Yamamuro's current character models.

Though, the rest of the episode looked good, but it would have been even better with Yamamuro's Buu arc character designs and colors (click for full size images):
[spoiler]Super:


Corrected to Yamamuro's 90s model:


On this shot, the way the nose was drawn and the shading made his nose have a really odd perspective with his nose, and I don't like how the eyes are straight with the current designs.

Also, for personal preference, I made the colors match Z. Here is the shot with Super's palette:
[/spoiler]

I'm tempted to make a thread for my style corrections...

I like a lot your correction, it gives to this shot a more "Retro" DB feel on it.
But I think you should say Yamamuro's Movies Character designs, because Buu arc had Nakatsuru as a Character Designer and not Yamamuro.
Anyway, it would be interesting to see your own corrections in a separate thread! Especially when you don't add a shitty grain filter like all other who does their corrections uhuh

[SaiyanGod117]

Hey Ajay or anyone what do you think of this Goku vs Gohan cut in the HTC, I was always thought it looked pretty impressive.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=FsWPu7GXAN0

[DragonBalllKaiHD]

That scene was done by Hisada Kazuya, one of the best action animators at the time. He was a part of the studio that included Masahiro Shimanuki and Naoki Tate, both of whom works for Dragon Ball Super now. His works were pretty dynamic which are known for containing flashy battle scenes.

[JulieYBM]

Hisada Kazuya was big into the Kanada Yoshinori style. Kanada was the animator that really revolutionized the Japanese animation industry--more so than anyone else--so he had a lot of imitators, even today with Kameda Yoshimichi, Imaishi Hiroyuki and the like. Hisada's current work isn't particularly good anymore, though. He and Shimanuki really began to fall apart in the mid-to-late 1990s.