The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread

[Steven Bloodriver]

Note: I will be using the incarnation of the characters from Dragon Ball: Heroes such as the God Mission 5 animated promo version of Gohan if he had been trained by Whis (for nine months) right after Super Saiyan 4 Full Power Broly had been defeated and the stronger than GT canon what if version of Trunks that can go Super Saiyan 3. But as for the case of Cooler and Frieza, they will be using the same form King Cold had used against Bra in Dragon Ball Multiverse.

1) GT Gohan (Saiyan Beyond God) vs. Super Saiyan!Turles and Super Saiyan!Raditz.

2) Chou Super Saiyan GT Gohan vs. Golden Great Ape!Nappa and Golden Great Ape!Vegeta (Saiyan Saga).

3) Chou Super Saiyan 2 GT Gohan vs. Sixth Form!Cooler and Sixth Form!Frieza (Frieza Saga).

4) Chou Super Saiyan 3 GT Gohan vs. Zetta Perfect Future Cell (if he had achieved a form beyond Super Perfect with another Zenkai to reach his equivalent of Super Saiyan 3) and Zetta Perfect Cell (if he had achieved a form beyond Super Perfect with another Zenkai to reach his equivalent of Super Saiyan 3).

5) Chou Super Saiyan 4 GT Gohan vs. Majin Buu (Janemba Absorbed) and Super Buu (Super Janemba Absorbed).

6) Super Saiyan Blue GT Gohan vs. Zamasu (from his fight with Super Saiyan 2 Goku).

7) Super Saiyan Blue GT Gohanks vs. Goku Black (from his fight with Super Saiyan 2 Future Trunks).

Bonus Note: Both Future Gohan and GT Trunks have trained together in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber with Goku from the Resurrection F movie for two years before they teamed up against the monsters below.

Eight) Future Gohan and GT Trunks (Saiyans Beyond God) vs. Future Super Android 17 and Future Android 18.

9) Chou Super Saiyan Future Gohan and Chou Super Saiyan GT Trunks vs. Perfect Great Ape!Future Cell (if Future Cell in his normal Perfect form had somehow turned into a Great Ape).

10) Chou Super Saiyan 2 Future Gohan and Chou Super Saiyan 2 GT Trunks vs. Legendary Super Saiyan 2 Future Broly.

11) Super Saiyan Blue Future Gohan and Super Saiyan Blue GT Trunks vs. Future Zamasu.

Note: For the previous four battles I meant to say Goku from Dragon Ball Z: Resurrection F to have trained them, but for the rest of this post will feature a what if scenario in that Goku and the crew had somehow recruited GT Gohan from the conclusion of the Assault on the Hell Gate Saga to help them in taking on the competition of the Universe 6 vs Universe 7 Tournament For Earth Saga before the entire team of Universe 7 (with the more than likely possible exception of their secret weapon in the form of Monaka, the alien Mr. Satan) decide to go train within the Hyperbolic Time Chamber for three days in order to prepare themselves against the newest members of Babidi's insidious army of Majins.

The team will consist in order of Goku, Vegeta, Gohan (not the same one who decided that a conference was more important than the fate of his loved ones and home planet), Piccolo, Majin Buu, and Monaka (introduced by Beerus to be the very last to fight as he is the weakest member of the team, so much so I believe in that even Spike the Devilman from the original series of Dragon Ball could beat him) with Beerus and Whis as the team's supervisors.

12) Versus Majin Botamo.

13) Versus Majin First Form Frost.

14) Versus Majin Assault Form Frost.

15) Versus Majin Ruthless Final Form Frost.

16) Versus Majin Auta Magetta.

17) Versus Majin Prince Cabba.

18) Versus Super Saiyan Majin Prince Cabba.

19) Versus Majin Hit.

P.S. Since I assume that Cabba is the counterpart of Vegeta from Universe 6, I decided to call him a Prince.

I changed my list of battles slightly to make them much more even.

[nickzambuto]

Jaco Runs the Gauntlet-

1. BoDB Goku
2. Nam/Namu
3. General Blue
4. Taopaipai
5. Kame-Sennin/Master Roshi

Run-down of Jaco's abilities-
http://comicvine.gamespot.com/profile/n ... ad/104396/

[DanielSSJ]

Jaco Runs the Gauntlet-

1. BoDB Goku
2. Nam/Namu
3. General Blue
4. Taopaipai
5. Kame-Sennin/Master Roshi

Run-down of Jaco's abilities-
http://comicvine.gamespot.com/profile/n ... ad/104396/

In my mind, Jaco rivals 23rd Budokai/Raditz Goku, so he easily clears the list.

[nickzambuto]

Kame-Sennin vs Edward "Whitebeard" Newgate

The idea of this battle has always fascinated me. I see it as a battle of true equals. Whitebeard is undoubtedly stronger, with his strikes being absolutely devastating to the Muten Roshi, but the old timer possesses speed and reaction time that could allow him to avoid almost everything Newgate throws out. Newgate's ungodly resilience is going to keep him in the game a long time, but Kame-Sennin's mastery of martial arts and many amazing techniques gives him an advantage. They're both extremely old, wise veterans who should not be taken lightly. I think this is a true-and-blue stalemate.

[nickzambuto]

Jaco Runs the Gauntlet-

1. BoDB Goku
2. Nam/Namu
3. General Blue
4. Taopaipai
5. Kame-Sennin/Master Roshi

Run-down of Jaco's abilities-
http://comicvine.gamespot.com/profile/n ... ad/104396/

In my mind, Jaco rivals 23rd Budokai/Raditz Goku, so he easily clears the list.

Whoa now, I dunno about THAT.

Actually, Jaco does become vastly more powerful once he enters Dragon Ball. I'm not current with Super and was more thinking of the manga.

[Steven Bloodriver]

20) Super Saiyan Blue: Kaioken 10x Goku vs. Hakaishin
Beerus.

21) Super Saiyan 4 Goku (Baby Saga) vs. Base Hirudegarn.

22) Super Saiyan 3 Goku (During the 28th World Tournament) vs. Super Janemba.

23) Super Saiyan 2 Goku (Wrath of the Dragon) vs. Bio-Broly.

24) Full Power Super Saiyan Goku (Cell Games Saga) vs. Super Saiyan Broly (Second Coming).

25) A hypothetical Super Saiyan God Goku (Frieza Saga) vs. Full Power Bojack.

26) A hypothetical Ultra Super Saiyan Goku (Frieza Saga) vs. Restricted Super Saiyan Broly.

27) A hypothetical Super Saiyan 2 Goku (Captain Ginyu Saga) vs. Super Android 13.

28) A hypothetical Super Saiyan Blue Goku (Saiyan Saga) vs. Meta Cooler.

29) A hypothetical Ascended Super Saiyan Teen Goku (23th Tenkaichi Budokai) vs. Fifth Form Cooler.

30) A hypothetical Super Saiyan 4 Kid Goku (Path To Power) vs. Great Namek Lord Slug.

31) A hypothetical Super Saiyan Kid Goku (Quest for the Dragon Balls Saga) vs. Turles.

[DanielSSJ]

Whoa now, I dunno about THAT.

Actually, Jaco does become vastly more powerful once he enters Dragon Ball. I'm not current with Super and was more thinking of the manga.

In Jaco: The Galactic Patrolman, Jaco says that he could defeat a Saiyan child, but wouldn't be able to beat an adult. At age 18~23, Goku was a lot weaker than the average Saiyan adult. I should clarify that, when I said Jaco would be a match for Goku, I meant his resting power level of 416. I wasn't considering his 924 power level that he had when he uses the Kamehameha, since it seems that Jaco can't use Ki.

[nickzambuto]

Whoa now, I dunno about THAT.

Actually, Jaco does become vastly more powerful once he enters Dragon Ball. I'm not current with Super and was more thinking of the manga.

In Jaco: The Galactic Patrolman, Jaco says that he could defeat a Saiyan child, but wouldn't be able to beat an adult. At age 18~23, Goku was a lot weaker than the average Saiyan adult. I should clarify that, when I said Jaco would be a match for Goku, I meant his resting power level of 416. I wasn't considering his 924 power level that he had when he uses the Kamehameha, since it seems that Jaco can't use Ki.

That proves there's nothing explicitly and specifically stating Jaco couldn't fight 23ed Goku, not any indication that he could. There's also no direct indication that Turtle couldn't fight Majin Boo. Goku might not have been as strong as an average Saiyan adult during the 23ed, but he was a helluva lot stronger than a baby.

[DanielSSJ]

That proves there's nothing explicitly and specifically stating Jaco couldn't fight 23ed Goku, not any indication that he could. There's also no direct indication that Turtle couldn't fight Majin Boo. Goku might not have been as strong as an average Saiyan adult during the 23ed, but he was a helluva lot stronger than a baby.

I didn't say that it was conclusive evidence or anything. My thought process was ore like "Well Goku was a lot weaker than Raditz, who seems to be the bench mark for the average Saiyan adult, but is probably a lot stronger than the average Saiyan kid. That seems like a nice spot for Jaco!"

20) Super Saiyan Blue: Kaioken 10x Goku vs. Hakaishin Beerus.

Toriyama says that Goku and Vegeta aren't gonna surpass Beerus for a while, so yeah, Beerus wins.

21) Super Saiyan 4 Goku (Baby Saga) vs. Base Hirudegarn.

Goku beat the powered up version of Hirudegarn at Super Saiyan 3. Sure that was with the crazy powerful Dragon Fist, but GT Goku is overpowered out the wazoo. His base form is arguably Majin Boo tier, and his Super Saiyan 4 form outranks everyone from Z except Vegetto. Goku slaps the Kaiju around like nothing.

22) Super Saiyan 3 Goku (During the 28th World Tournament) vs. Super Janemba.

Going off the manga and only the manga, Janemba. I believe that Toriyama once said that the characters in the Boo arc where sort of maxed out in terms of their growth and potential and that they wouldn't experience any humongous growth anymore.

23) Super Saiyan 2 Goku (Wrath of the Dragon) vs. Bio-Broly.

Given that Goten, Trunks, and No. 18 can sort of put up a fight against her, I'd say that Sludge-head doesn't even match up to any of the adult Super Saiyans. Goku murks Broli's clone.

24) Full Power Super Saiyan Goku (Cell Games Saga) vs. Super Saiyan Broly (Second Coming).

I'm one of those who say that the Super Saiyans in the first Broli movie aren't quite as strong as their Cell Games counterparts. Even considering that, Movie 10 Broly is probably even stronger than Boo arc SS Goku, so his Cell Games counterpart is in way over his head.

25) A hypothetical Super Saiyan God Goku (Frieza Saga) vs. Full Power Bojack.

Don't actually have a standard boost for SS God (partially because I gave up on doing a Super power scale ages ago) but I'm willing to bet that Freeza arc Godku would be overkill for Bojack.

26) A hypothetical Ultra Super Saiyan Goku (Frieza Saga) vs. Restricted Super Saiyan Broly.

Grade 3 is borderline useless, due to the crippling speed deficiency and the energy drain and Goku would probably have a better shot if he used the regular form anyways. Broli wins.

27) A hypothetical Super Saiyan 2 Goku (Captain Ginyu Saga) vs. Super Android 13.

Going Super Saiyan 2 during that time period would put Goku at around 9 million, about 16 times weaker than he was when he first went Super Saiyan. Unlucky 13 indeed.

29) A hypothetical Ascended Super Saiyan Teen Goku (23th Tenkaichi Budokai) vs. Fifth Form Cooler.

Goku has no chance in hell. Even if he went Super Saiyan 3, he wouldn't even match first form Freeza.

30) A hypothetical Super Saiyan 4 Kid Goku (Path To Power) vs. Great Namek Lord Slug.

Dunno. If Path to Power Goku is as strong as BoDB Goku, then Slug stomps him into the ground, but Goku seemed stronger than that in that movie, so who knows?

31) A hypothetical Super Saiyan Kid Goku (Quest for the Dragon Balls Saga) vs. Turles.

10 (Goku's power level) x 50 (Super Saiyan power boost) is 500. Tullece is well into the thousands. Goku gets wrecked.

[nickzambuto]

That proves there's nothing explicitly and specifically stating Jaco couldn't fight 23ed Goku, not any indication that he could. There's also no direct indication that Turtle couldn't fight Majin Boo. Goku might not have been as strong as an average Saiyan adult during the 23ed, but he was a helluva lot stronger than a baby.

I didn't say that it was conclusive evidence or anything. My thought process was ore like "Well Goku was a lot weaker than Raditz, who seems to be the bench mark for the average Saiyan adult, but is probably a lot stronger than the average Saiyan kid. That seems like a nice spot for Jaco!"

Yes perhaps current Jaco, but like I said, I was thinking mostly of manga Jaco. Just comparing his abilities with 23ed Goku side by side, it really isn't close.

[Anime Kitten]

20) Super Saiyan Blue: Kaioken 10x Goku vs. Hakaishin
Beerus.

As you can see from this post, I say that Goku wins.

[DanielSSJ]

Yes perhaps current Jaco, but like I said, I was thinking mostly of manga Jaco. Just comparing his abilities with 23ed Goku side by side, it really isn't close.

To be honest, I don't think Jaco has improved all that much, if at all. Besides, while Jaco (in my head) may be as strong as 18~23 year-old Goku in terms of raw power, Goku gets more mileage out of that power due to the fact that he can manipulate Ki and Jaco can't.

[MaxZ]

I think that #18 is still the same in power, more or less. Kuririn is the one who went back to his peak after his training is what I'd like to believe. So #17 is still greater than #18.

I don't look at it as a power thing, but a technique thing. I don't see 17 as ever having been more than maybe 5-10% stronger than 18 at the very most, but in the Cell Saga, neither of them knew a thing about martial arts. Krillin is an exceptionally skilled martial artist, despite his relatively weak power. So I kinda thing the martial arts 18 has learned from Krillin would even the playing field with 17 so to speak. a weaker fighter can beat a slightly stronger one if they have superior skill, and I think 18 most definitely has superior skill to 17 from sparring with Krillin for several years.

they both have endless stamina, so skill becomes even more important since neither will ever tire.

[DBZ Macky]

I think that #18 is still the same in power, more or less. Kuririn is the one who went back to his peak after his training is what I'd like to believe. So #17 is still greater than #18.

I don't look at it as a power thing, but a technique thing. I don't see 17 as ever having been more than maybe 5-10% stronger than 18 at the very most, but in the Cell Saga, neither of them knew a thing about martial arts. Krillin is an exceptionally skilled martial artist, despite his relatively weak power. So I kinda thing the martial arts 18 has learned from Krillin would even the playing field with 17 so to speak. a weaker fighter can beat a slightly stronger one if they have superior skill, and I think 18 most definitely has superior skill to 17 from sparring with Krillin for several years.

they both have endless stamina, so skill becomes even more important since neither will ever tire.

I see, I can agree with that.
Also, I'd be grateful if anyone could tell me how much time had passed between Gohan visiting Kuririn and the tournament starting, I can't recall

20) Super Saiyan Blue: Kaioken 10x Goku vs. Hakaishin
Beerus.

As you can see from this post, I say that Goku wins.

I don't want to start a debate and neither do I want to impose my opinion onto others, but it seems VERY unlikely to me that this would be the case. I think that when Whis asks/teases Beerus if Goku's stronger than him and he replies "Of course not!", It's the same as the fans asking Toei the same question and getting the same reply.
It's pretty much the same when Gowasu states that SSJ2 Goku is Hakaishin tier and Beerus denies it while he earlier stated (Albeit implied to be lying) that he was using close to full power against Godku.
I see this as a way of poking fun at a subject that has CLEARLY been retconned

Two-base theory or not, It's pretty apparent now that Beerus's power has been completely retconned.
What's more, I think that the Hakaishin-Kaioshin link was established for the sole purpose of introducing enemies that could pose a threat to Goku and co. without being stronger than the Hakaishin.

Anyways, that's just my two cents and I can respect your opinion even if you'd think otherwise.

That proves there's nothing explicitly and specifically stating Jaco couldn't fight 23ed Goku, not any indication that he could. There's also no direct indication that Turtle couldn't fight Majin Boo. Goku might not have been as strong as an average Saiyan adult during the 23ed, but he was a helluva lot stronger than a baby.

I didn't say that it was conclusive evidence or anything. My thought process was ore like "Well Goku was a lot weaker than Raditz, who seems to be the bench mark for the average Saiyan adult, but is probably a lot stronger than the average Saiyan kid. That seems like a nice spot for Jaco!"

Yes perhaps current Jaco, but like I said, I was thinking mostly of manga Jaco. Just comparing his abilities with 23ed Goku side by side, it really isn't close.

If you're familiar with Jaco manga, this is the power chain IIRC:
Adult Saiyans (Raditz?) > Galactic King > Jaco > Kid Saiyans (BP 10 Goku? Maybe even BP 100 Ozaru Goku)

I'd think that Jaco is probably definitely maybe stronger than Raditz at this point while The Galactic King is still at his former level.
One more thing, It's implied that Galactic King could destroy asteroids so he should at least be above Piccolo Daimao anyways IMO.

[nickzambuto]

I think that #18 is still the same in power, more or less. Kuririn is the one who went back to his peak after his training is what I'd like to believe. So #17 is still greater than #18.

I don't look at it as a power thing, but a technique thing. I don't see 17 as ever having been more than maybe 5-10% stronger than 18 at the very most, but in the Cell Saga, neither of them knew a thing about martial arts. Krillin is an exceptionally skilled martial artist, despite his relatively weak power. So I kinda thing the martial arts 18 has learned from Krillin would even the playing field with 17 so to speak. a weaker fighter can beat a slightly stronger one if they have superior skill, and I think 18 most definitely has superior skill to 17 from sparring with Krillin for several years.

they both have endless stamina, so skill becomes even more important since neither will ever tire.

17 put Tenshinhan in a headlock and went blow for blow with Piccolo. Arguably he wasn't the most experienced martial artist ever, but it seems Gero programmed them with all kinds of skills.

[Polyphase Avatron]

Current Roshi vs. Current Yamcha.

Before you answer, keep in mind that Toriyama said that during the events of Resurrection F, Roshi was nearly or maybe just as powerful as Krillin.

[LightBing]

Current Roshi vs. Current Yamcha.

Before you answer, keep in mind that Toriyama said that during the events of Resurrection F, Roshi was nearly or maybe just as powerful as Krillin.

Are you sure he said that? What I remember is that Kame-sennin could get as powerful as he was in the movie if he trained, not that he was even with Kuririn.

0%/100%- Kame-sennin was no chance whatever. I assume his boost in RoF came from mastering his Buff Form, which to me puts him in the 1xxx range. Yamcha, I have him in the low millions. This isn't even a fight, just a stomp.

[Anime Kitten]

I think that when Whis asks/teases Beerus if Goku's stronger than him and he replies "Of course not!", It's the same as the fans asking Toei the same question and getting the same reply.
It's pretty much the same when Gowasu states that SSJ2 Goku is Hakaishin tier and Beerus denies it while he earlier stated (Albeit implied to be lying) that he was using close to full power against Godku.
I see this as a way of poking fun at a subject that has CLEARLY been retconned

In both the Kaioken and Super Saiyan 2 cases, Beerus was clearly nervous about it. Sure, maybe he gets irritated when people compare other people to him, but he would just menacingly say, "Don't say that," if he wasn't nervous.
Let's say ~60/65% Beerus = Godku and 70% Beerus > Godku by a small margin. We know that Blue Goku is a lot more powerful than Godku, and using the Kaioken multiplies that. I'd say about ~80/85% Beerus = Blue Kaioken Goku in that case. And then multiplying that 10 times brings him up to 100% Beerus < Blue Kaioken x10 Goku, if any of that makes sense.

[Berserker1921]

I think that when Whis asks/teases Beerus if Goku's stronger than him and he replies "Of course not!", It's the same as the fans asking Toei the same question and getting the same reply.
It's pretty much the same when Gowasu states that SSJ2 Goku is Hakaishin tier and Beerus denies it while he earlier stated (Albeit implied to be lying) that he was using close to full power against Godku.
I see this as a way of poking fun at a subject that has CLEARLY been retconned

In both the Kaioken and Super Saiyan 2 cases, Beerus was clearly nervous about it. Sure, maybe he gets irritated when people compare other people to him, but he would just menacingly say, "Don't say that," if he wasn't nervous.
Let's say ~60/65% Beerus = Godku and 70% Beerus > Godku by a small margin. We know that Blue Goku is a lot more powerful than Godku, and using the Kaioken multiplies that. I'd say about ~80/85% Beerus = Blue Kaioken Goku in that case. And then multiplying that 10 times brings him up to 100% Beerus < Blue Kaioken x10 Goku, if any of that makes sense.

I don't think the power scale that toriyama mentioned. I think that Beerus lies a lot. I think personally that when he fought Godku; Beerus used 30%. At the tournament Goku and Vegeta are at least 45%. Then kaioken is 60-75%. Remember take the kaioken x 10 with a grain of salt.

[Anime Kitten]

I don't believe a lot of what Beerus says, but I do believe he was using 70% against Godku. But I guess that's just me personally.