Is Nozawa's voice the only thing that turns people off of the Japanese version?

[ABED]

Meh Kikuchi score is very lacking when it comes to the big moments in Z though like theirs not even a new or unique track for when goku first goes super saiyan like there was in the funi dub. Just the same old kung fu music that overstayed its welcome. The characters fight at a different style and pace in Z than DB that the japanese score no longer suits.

The score has similarities, but the themes change over time. Some are retired and there are new ones that take their place. The music when Goku first turns Super, Faulconer missed the entire point. Instead of "what's going on? What is happening to Goku?", his was "Isn't this awesome!?". The pace increased, but the show is still the show, and that pace increased well before DBZ.

Faulconer's is boring, synthetic, noisy, bland, and doesn't fit

"what's going on, what's happening to Goku??" I got all of that from Faulconer's track when Goku first goes Super Saiyan meanwhile with the japanese version it felt underwhelming in comparison due to the forgettable music playing during the scene.

Maybe forgettable to you, but I remember that theme quite well. It also played during one of Freeza's transformations. Most of Faulconer's stuff is forgettable. I have to keep reminding myself what his Super Saiyan theme sounds like. Dragon Ball is a series that stays with you, so should its music. The music shouldn't be a radically different departure between DB and DBZ because they aren't that different, no matter how much you claim.

[Android 50]

Maybe forgettable to you, but I remember that theme quite well. It also played during one of Freeza's transformations. Most of Faulconer's stuff is forgettable. I have to keep reminding myself what his Super Saiyan theme sounds like. Dragon Ball is a series that stays with you, so should its music. The music shouldn't be a radically different departure between DB and DBZ because they aren't that different, no matter how much you claim.

Are you sure that you actually watched it with the Kikuchi track? I'd say that was memorable for the vast, vast majority of us. Meanwhile, the synthetic tracks of Faulconer (with few exceptions) all bleed together for (once again) the vast majority of us.

Uh yeah I saw it and it was boring and forgettable compared to the US version and barely conveyed anything from me. I still to this day get hyped when watching scenes like Gohan's transformation in the US version or Cell's transformations or the buu saga stuff. Cell and Buu's themes alone outdid anything I ever heard in the japanese version. I can't even remember Cell's japanese theme.

[ABED]

I don't think Cell had a theme, does it matter if he did?

I still to this day get hyped when watching scenes like Gohan's transformation in the US version

Gohan turning Super Saiyan 2? The dub was more memorable than Spirit vs. Spirit?

[Jinzoningen MULE]

I don't think Cell had a theme, does it matter if he did?

I still to this day get hyped when watching scenes like Gohan's transformation in the US version

Gohan turning Super Saiyan 2? The dub was more memorable than Spirit vs. Spirit?

He did have a theme.

Regardless, I'm dropping out, it's obvious that we're arguing against pure nostalgia. To close, like I've said before, I totally understand why kids like the Faulconer score, it's lack of subtlety and constant fast pace is practically bait for young boys. I guarantee when he gets older, if he still cares at all for the show, will come to our preference. I've never met an adult fan who preferred Faulconer score. Until then, there's no use in arguing over musical preference with someone who doesn't understand subtlety or nuance.

[Deathbringer]

I mean who watches Cowboy Bebop, Fullmetal Alchemist, Baccano and Black Lagoon in Japanese?

I do.

And I think Fullmetal Alchemist on that list is a good way to answer your question of, "Would people be more accepting of the Japanese cast of Dragon Ball if adult Goku were voiced by a man?"

I'm sure Fullmetal Alchemist's dub is just fine and dandy, but dear god, I cannot watch it. Edward sounds far too old and Mustang's voice is weirdly deep. Doesn't work for me. Doesn't mesh with how I see those characters or what I'm used to from the Japanese.

So, much like how Nozawa's higher voice is a barrier to entry for a lot of dub fans, the opposite is true for me and Fullmetal Alchemist -- well, that, and the fact I don't really care for dubs in the first place.

In that sense, I can totally understand their perspective, even if I don't agree with it. I do think making yourself understand the appeal of the original show is far more important than getting used to some other company's version of it, though.

Maybe that's me justifying a little bit of hypocrisy here, but eh, I do think that's a big difference that's important to acknowledge.

Side note: I think all of those examples are part of this weird western trend of, "Well, the setting is western-looking, so clearly an English dub is better suited". I hate that argument so much.

I wasn't trying to say that the English dubs of those shows are way above the Japanese versions or anything, I was just trying to think of examples of shows that more people watch in English than Japanese, not that I have statistics or anything. Especially Cowboy Bebop cos I'm pretty sure that was more popular in America on its first airing than it was on its first airing in Japan. Really i was just going through the possible scenarios of what life experience someone would have to have to end up in a situation where they vehemently watch all of their anime in Japanese but make an exception for DBZ it just confuses me, and that particular sentence you quoted was just me thinking out loud "if they don't like dubs why would they only watch a dub that represents how not to do a dub as opposed to these shows that are some of the best anime dubs of all time". Like if I saw someone who only watches subs I would expect them to give DBZ as a reason why, not as their only exception.

other side notes: when i learned that Romi Park voiced Edward in Japanese i did think to myself "damn if i saw that in japanese first I would probably find the dub weird", however, lets just think about a show like Baccano which is set in America, i personally think that the reasoning of "It's set in America so english dub would be better suited" is a perfectly fine reason to want to watch a show like that. However when people use that argument to such a degree that they make it sound like the only viable option for watching the show is in English then yes I can understand hating that argument in that case.

I mean this is definitely getting off topic now but I'm personally fine with watching the occasional english dub, I started out years ago only watching dubs until one day i realised "these are Japanese shows, I should be watching them in Japanese", I mean I think I've seen all the dubs I want to see and any new shows that come out I'm watching those in Japanese regardless of setting before a dub ever even comes out but sometimes there are some shows that for one reason or another I watched dubbed a random example would be Persona 4 the anime which I watched dubbed because the original game only has the English voices available so I was used to them and I think it was like that for a lot of people.


-- edit (relating to the music conversation currently going on) -- The only characters that have their own themes in the Kikuchi score for DBZ specifically as far as I can remember are Piccolo (using his dad's theme music) and Gohan (and no it doesn't play when he goes SSJ2 but it is used a lot) and those are some of the most memorable bits of dragon ball music of all time

[Bansho64]

I have that same SS Goku track on my phone actually. Got it the other day. The creepyness of it, the horror, the ominous feeling, it's all perfect to me. One of Kikuchi's most memorable tracks. I have most of his stuff and I remember the names/numbers. Kikuchi's tracks always manage to hit a deep note in me that Faulconer never manages to even get close to touching. And when Kikuchi hits the mark, which is 99.9% of the time for me, he freaking bashes it. I seriously can't think of one track that I don't think fondly of. He orchestrates all of it beautifully and includes every emotion that I can think of into specific tracks. He makes the cool moments, badass. The sad moments, heartwrenching. He exceeds every expectation for me.

[Android 50]

I don't think Cell had a theme, does it matter if he did?

I still to this day get hyped when watching scenes like Gohan's transformation in the US version

Gohan turning Super Saiyan 2? The dub was more memorable than Spirit vs. Spirit?

It was alright but didn't give me the same goosebump vibes I got when watching the US version.

I don't think Cell had a theme, does it matter if he did?

I still to this day get hyped when watching scenes like Gohan's transformation in the US version

Gohan turning Super Saiyan 2? The dub was more memorable than Spirit vs. Spirit?

He did have a theme.

Regardless, I'm dropping out, it's obvious that we're arguing against pure nostalgia. To close, like I've said before, I totally understand why kids like the Faulconer score, it's lack of subtlety and constant fast pace is practically bait for young boys. I guarantee when he gets older, if he still cares at all for the show, will come to our preference. I've never met an adult fan who preferred Faulconer score. Until then, there's no use in arguing over musical preference with someone who doesn't understand subtlety or nuance.

I'm not as young as you seem to think. 27 years old and still prefer the faluconer tracks over the dull and uninspired japanese ones. I find it funny you say you haven't found any adults that prefer the US tracks over the japanese tracks because its quite the opposite for me.

[Jinzoningen MULE]

I don't think Cell had a theme, does it matter if he did?

I still to this day get hyped when watching scenes like Gohan's transformation in the US version

Gohan turning Super Saiyan 2? The dub was more memorable than Spirit vs. Spirit?

It was alright but didn't give me the same goosebump vibes I got when watching the US version.

I don't think Cell had a theme, does it matter if he did?


Gohan turning Super Saiyan 2? The dub was more memorable than Spirit vs. Spirit?

He did have a theme.

Regardless, I'm dropping out, it's obvious that we're arguing against pure nostalgia. To close, like I've said before, I totally understand why kids like the Faulconer score, it's lack of subtlety and constant fast pace is practically bait for young boys. I guarantee when he gets older, if he still cares at all for the show, will come to our preference. I've never met an adult fan who preferred Faulconer score. Until then, there's no use in arguing over musical preference with someone who doesn't understand subtlety or nuance.

I'm not as young as you seem to think. 27 years old and still prefer the faluconer tracks over the dull and uninspired japanese ones. I find it funny you say you haven't found any adults that prefer the US tracks over the japanese tracks because its quite the opposite for me.

Sorry, I don't believe for a second that you're 27. Your very sentence structure oozes the smell of a 14-ish year old. Don't take that as an insult either, you write pretty well, but coming from someone who's always written and read for fun, that's how it comes off.

[Android 50]

I don't think Cell had a theme, does it matter if he did?


Gohan turning Super Saiyan 2? The dub was more memorable than Spirit vs. Spirit?

It was alright but didn't give me the same goosebump vibes I got when watching the US version.

He did have a theme.

Regardless, I'm dropping out, it's obvious that we're arguing against pure nostalgia. To close, like I've said before, I totally understand why kids like the Faulconer score, it's lack of subtlety and constant fast pace is practically bait for young boys. I guarantee when he gets older, if he still cares at all for the show, will come to our preference. I've never met an adult fan who preferred Faulconer score. Until then, there's no use in arguing over musical preference with someone who doesn't understand subtlety or nuance.

I'm not as young as you seem to think. 27 years old and still prefer the faluconer tracks over the dull and uninspired japanese ones. I find it funny you say you haven't found any adults that prefer the US tracks over the japanese tracks because its quite the opposite for me.

Sorry, I don't believe for a second that you're 27. Your very sentence structure oozes the smell of a 14-ish year old. Don't take that as an insult either, you write pretty well, but coming from someone who's always written and read for fun, that's how it comes off.

Um wow..okay. I'm a little insulted. haha I'm not sure how my sentence structure looks to others but I usually try my best to get my point across. I also don't see how preferring the US soundtrack over the japanese version would make me come off as a child. Its not like the japanese version is so much more sophisticated than the US one. lol

[Jinzoningen MULE]

It was alright but didn't give me the same goosebump vibes I got when watching the US version.


I'm not as young as you seem to think. 27 years old and still prefer the faluconer tracks over the dull and uninspired japanese ones. I find it funny you say you haven't found any adults that prefer the US tracks over the japanese tracks because its quite the opposite for me.

Sorry, I don't believe for a second that you're 27. Your very sentence structure oozes the smell of a 14-ish year old. Don't take that as an insult either, you write pretty well, but coming from someone who's always written and read for fun, that's how it comes off.

Um wow..okay. I'm a little insulted. haha I'm not sure how my sentence structure looks to others but I usually try my best to get my point across. I also don't see how preferring the US soundtrack over the japanese version would make me come off as a child. Its not like the japanese version is so much more sophisticated than the US one. lol

It's not your music preference, it's your vocabulary. Sorry if it's insulting, but that's honestly the vibe I get from reading you.

[Soppa Saia People]

I don't think Cell had a theme, does it matter if he did?


Gohan turning Super Saiyan 2? The dub was more memorable than Spirit vs. Spirit?

It was alright but didn't give me the same goosebump vibes I got when watching the US version.

He did have a theme.

Regardless, I'm dropping out, it's obvious that we're arguing against pure nostalgia. To close, like I've said before, I totally understand why kids like the Faulconer score, it's lack of subtlety and constant fast pace is practically bait for young boys. I guarantee when he gets older, if he still cares at all for the show, will come to our preference. I've never met an adult fan who preferred Faulconer score. Until then, there's no use in arguing over musical preference with someone who doesn't understand subtlety or nuance.

I'm not as young as you seem to think. 27 years old and still prefer the faluconer tracks over the dull and uninspired japanese ones. I find it funny you say you haven't found any adults that prefer the US tracks over the japanese tracks because its quite the opposite for me.

Sorry, I don't believe for a second that you're 27. Your very sentence structure oozes the smell of a 14-ish year old. Don't take that as an insult either, you write pretty well, but coming from someone who's always written and read for fun, that's how it comes off.

"Checks user profile"
"AGE: 17"
Wat ?

[Jinzoningen MULE]

It was alright but didn't give me the same goosebump vibes I got when watching the US version.


I'm not as young as you seem to think. 27 years old and still prefer the faluconer tracks over the dull and uninspired japanese ones. I find it funny you say you haven't found any adults that prefer the US tracks over the japanese tracks because its quite the opposite for me.

Sorry, I don't believe for a second that you're 27. Your very sentence structure oozes the smell of a 14-ish year old. Don't take that as an insult either, you write pretty well, but coming from someone who's always written and read for fun, that's how it comes off.

"Checks user profile"
"AGE: 17"
Wat ?

I am 17, I also read lots of people, people who I know; family members, friends of friends. I proofread papers as a hobby. My age has nothing to do with anything. By the way, a lot more honest than leaving my age totally blank.

[Jinzoningen MULE]

Sorry, I don't believe for a second that you're 27. Your very sentence structure oozes the smell of a 14-ish year old. Don't take that as an insult either, you write pretty well, but coming from someone who's always written and read for fun, that's how it comes off.

Um wow..okay. I'm a little insulted. haha I'm not sure how my sentence structure looks to others but I usually try my best to get my point across. I also don't see how preferring the US soundtrack over the japanese version would make me come off as a child. Its not like the japanese version is so much more sophisticated than the US one. lol

It's not your music preference, it's your vocabulary. Sorry if it's insulting, but that's honestly the vibe I get from reading you.

Realized that I was being a little douchey here, sorry about that. I get carried away when people are wrong about things.

[ABED]

It was alright but didn't give me the same goosebump vibes I got when watching the US version.

You got goosebumps from Gohan turning SS2 in the dub? How did the terrible VO not bother you? That music is so bland and unmemorable. It's uninspired for what is supposed to be a climactic moment.

[DB_Fan1991]

What I notice here with people bitching about Nozawa's Goku & the Kikuchi score for Z only comes from the fans who grew up with the English dubs. Every single other dub whether good (i.e. the Latin Spanish & Brazilian Portuguese dubs) or bad (i.e the French, Portuguese & Greek dubs) has Kikuchi's score and fans of those dubs don't complain about it. I can't say whether or not they hate Nozawa's take on Goku, but the few I've talked to at least appreciate her work. The Catalan dub's fanbase was actually pissed when they found out that in their dub of Kai that Marc Zanni would be doing all of Goku's screams, but in Battle of Gods & Resurrection F they left in Nozawa's screams and fans were happy with it.

[Jinzoningen MULE]

What I notice here with people bitching about Nozawa's Goku & the Kikuchi score for Z only comes from the fans who grew up with the English dubs. Every single other dub whether good (i.e. the Latin Spanish & Brazilian Portuguese dubs) or bad (i.e the French, Portuguese & Greek dubs) has Kikuchi's score and fans of those dubs don't complain about it. I can't say whether or not they hate Nozawa's take on Goku, but the few I've talked to at least appreciate her work. The Catalan dub's fanbase was actually pissed when they found out that in their dub of Kai that Marc Zanni would be doing all of Goku's screams, but in Battle of Gods & Resurrection F they left in Nozawa's screams and fans were happy with it.

Kept her screams? That's a strange prospect.

[DB_Fan1991]

What I notice here with people bitching about Nozawa's Goku & the Kikuchi score for Z only comes from the fans who grew up with the English dubs. Every single other dub whether good (i.e. the Latin Spanish & Brazilian Portuguese dubs) or bad (i.e the French, Portuguese & Greek dubs) has Kikuchi's score and fans of those dubs don't complain about it. I can't say whether or not they hate Nozawa's take on Goku, but the few I've talked to at least appreciate her work. The Catalan dub's fanbase was actually pissed when they found out that in their dub of Kai that Marc Zanni would be doing all of Goku's screams, but in Battle of Gods & Resurrection F they left in Nozawa's screams and fans were happy with it.

Kept her screams? That's a strange prospect.

The old French dub did the same as did the Basque, Galician & Valencian dubs later on.

[Jinzoningen MULE]

What I notice here with people bitching about Nozawa's Goku & the Kikuchi score for Z only comes from the fans who grew up with the English dubs. Every single other dub whether good (i.e. the Latin Spanish & Brazilian Portuguese dubs) or bad (i.e the French, Portuguese & Greek dubs) has Kikuchi's score and fans of those dubs don't complain about it. I can't say whether or not they hate Nozawa's take on Goku, but the few I've talked to at least appreciate her work. The Catalan dub's fanbase was actually pissed when they found out that in their dub of Kai that Marc Zanni would be doing all of Goku's screams, but in Battle of Gods & Resurrection F they left in Nozawa's screams and fans were happy with it.

Kept her screams? That's a strange prospect.

The old French dub did the same as did the Basque, Galician & Valencian dubs later on.

Once I learn French, I'll have to check that out.

[fadeddreams5]

Goku turning Super Saiyan should've been an ominous moment, but I don't get that at all from Faulconer's score.

For those that find Nozawa's voice off putting, I don't get why. Is it simply because it goes against what you expect?

There's definitely an ominous side to the scene, but I wouldn't say Goku turning into a Super Saiyan should've been an ominous moment. There's an intensity there I feel Yamamoto and Faulconer capture better.

I think Nozawa's acting is stellar. The actual sound of her voice is grating and off-putting. And yes, seeing masculine characters speak like that is, for the lack of a better word atm, cringey.

Maybe forgettable to you, but I remember that theme quite well. It also played during one of Freeza's transformations. Most of Faulconer's stuff is forgettable. I have to keep reminding myself what his Super Saiyan theme sounds like. Dragon Ball is a series that stays with you, so should its music. The music shouldn't be a radically different departure between DB and DBZ because they aren't that different, no matter how much you claim.

To each his own, but most of Faulconer's stuff is not forgettable to me. That SSJ theme, as a kid, gave me goosebumps and I used to hum it as I played with my action figures. How can stuff like Gohan Angers, SSJ theme, SSJ3 theme, Cell theme, Pikkon theme, Buu theme, Vegeta themes, and so on be deemed forgettable? People listen to these outside the series and create covers all the time.

I find Kikuchi's stuff memorable too though, whether I like it or not.

I still to this day get hyped when watching scenes like Gohan's transformation in the US version

Gohan turning Super Saiyan 2? The dub was more memorable than Spirit vs. Spirit?

Maybe he's referring to the episode right after that one, which plays "Gohan Angers" as Gohan is, once again, transforming for the first time. I agree, the dub made that scene more exciting and memorable. The initial transformation is far superior in the Japanese version.

I don't think Cell had a theme, does it matter if he did?

I still to this day get hyped when watching scenes like Gohan's transformation in the US version

Gohan turning Super Saiyan 2? The dub was more memorable than Spirit vs. Spirit?

He did have a theme.

Regardless, I'm dropping out, it's obvious that we're arguing against pure nostalgia. To close, like I've said before, I totally understand why kids like the Faulconer score, it's lack of subtlety and constant fast pace is practically bait for young boys. I guarantee when he gets older, if he still cares at all for the show, will come to our preference. I've never met an adult fan who preferred Faulconer score. Until then, there's no use in arguing over musical preference with someone who doesn't understand subtlety or nuance.

This is condescending. FYI, every US-born adult fan I've spoken to prefers Faulconer.

If you mean adult fans from other countries that were only exposed to Kikuchi's score, that's also to be expected. People have a connection to whatever they're exposed to and grow up with first. Music preference has little to do with age, even if you come to appreciate some styles of music and the quality behind it as you get older (not the same as liking it). Faulconer and Kikuchi's scores are so vastly different, it's pretty hard to watch the show with one soundtrack and then become accustomed to the other. Music can also influence how you view the tone and mood of a particular scene, so, for example, going from a SSJ3 scene that emphasizes on the ominous side of the event (Kikuchi) to a SSJ3 scene that emphasizes on the chaos (Sumitomo) or intensity (Faulconer) can be very off-putting to someone who feels the scene they grew up with was misinterpreted or just prefer how a particular track captured it.

Incidentally, I was exposed to Kikuchi before Faulconer, but after Ocean dub soundtrack. That latter actually was bland and truly forgettable, but I never paid any mind to it. Kikuchi's sounded dated to me as a kid and turned me off. Faulconer's was awesome and absolutely memorable. As an adult, I appreciate Kikuchi's OST and even really like some of his themes, but I also find the majority of it boring. It pretty much killed my Kai viewing experience. As an adult, I also acknowledge that Faulconer's track never ever shuts up, resulting in bad placements in scenes that deserve silence. But hey, I still like it and feel it works a lot better in other moments.

[Android 50]

It was alright but didn't give me the same goosebump vibes I got when watching the US version.

You got goosebumps from Gohan turning SS2 in the dub? How did the terrible VO not bother you? That music is so bland and unmemorable. It's uninspired for what is supposed to be a climactic moment.

Hardly, Gohan's Anger is probably one of the most memorable themes in the dub. Far from being uninspired or bland. lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OAL0ard3YPw

How couldn't this give me goosebumps?

Um wow..okay. I'm a little insulted. haha I'm not sure how my sentence structure looks to others but I usually try my best to get my point across. I also don't see how preferring the US soundtrack over the japanese version would make me come off as a child. Its not like the japanese version is so much more sophisticated than the US one. lol

It's not your music preference, it's your vocabulary. Sorry if it's insulting, but that's honestly the vibe I get from reading you.

Realized that I was being a little douchey here, sorry about that. I get carried away when people are wrong about things.

Yeah it was especially you thinking I'm wrong for not liking the japanese score. LOL