"Dragon Ball Super" Series Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

[Cetra]

You're just throwing in assumptions here.

You mean like you do as well?

We aren't making huge leaps in logic, we're just throwing out possibilities. You're going on saying that Black has Goku's memories, even though we've had no indication of that.

Having knowledge (Zamas I mean, not me) is no huge leap in logic. It being even more classified as "muscle memory" just to rule out that it is ordinary memory is way more of a huge leap.

[ryou766]

You mean like you do as well?

Don't be that person. I'm giving valid explanations in each of my posts. You're claiming Zamasu has Goku's memories, which has NEVER been confirmed; you're suggesting that Black and Zamasu simply just know how the time machine works and where it's hidden enough to simply destroy it. And then you want to throw the unnecessary jab at ME saying I don't know what I'M talking about.

Black/Zamas is vastly different from Ginyu because even if Ginyu would have had time to get used to Goku's body we never saw Goku having this weird "growing stronger" power. So we do not know what special case Black actually is.

OK? Aside from that, there's nothing else that really differentiates the two. Of course that one sort can't be compared to Ginyu because this time, the wielder to Goku's body isn't a mortal. So he must have tampered with it somehow.

[Jinzoningen MULE]

You mean like you do as well?

We aren't making huge leaps in logic, we're just throwing out possibilities. You're going on saying that Black has Goku's memories, even though we've had no indication of that.

Having knowledge is no huge leap in logic. It being even more classified as "muscle memory" just to rule out that it is ordinary memory is way more of a huge leap.

Muscle memory is an actual thing that happens. I don't even necessarily think that's the explanation, it's just more likely by way of Occam's Razor. Either way, it's not even my job to rule "ordinary memory" out, that's not how proof works. The burden is on you, the one who has made a committal claim while having not provided any substance, to prove your position.

[dbzfan7]

I really FAIL to understand how this is pissing people off. Each time they retreated served a purpose.

Because it's boring. We have to sit through sobby Mai scenes and tedious dinners. It's repetitive, that's all.

Excuse me if my attitude is inappropriate.

I can't really say how it all plays out, but going back and forth honestly gives the Digimon 02 feeling, where the kids could keep porting home, and sucking away some of the tension. Would much rather Black and Zamasu actually be competent and stop them from going back. Though really it's honestly baffling to me there is still a resistance. But I guess we'll see how it plays out.

[Cetra]

Don't be that person. I'm giving valid explanations in each of my posts.

Which you aren't. You exactly are not. You are exactly like other people who are making assumptions and then try to contradict those of others by acting like yours are no assumptions. The only difference between you and me is that I admit when both sides are making assumptions, which I never have any problems with. My explanation of why he has Goku's memories is not any more "impossible" than what you say. You just don't like the possibility that he knows the moves from Goku's personal data storage.

OK? Aside from that, there's nothing else that really differentiates the two. Of course that one sort can't be compared to Ginyu because this time, the wielder to Goku's body isn't a mortal. So he must have tampered with it somehow.

Good that we agree about that difference.

The burden is on you, the one who has made a committal claim while having not provided any substance, to prove your position.

Just as it is your burden to stand for what you say, which did not have any more substance than what I said.

[ryou766]

Which you aren't. You exactly are not. You are exactly like other people who are making assumptions and then try to contradict those of others by acting like yours are no assumptions. The only difference between you and me is that I admit when both sides are making assumptions, which I never have any problems with. My explanation of why he has Goku's memories is not any more "impossible" than what you say. You just don't like the possibility that he knows the moves from Goku's personal data storage.

Oh, so now it's assumptions?

Of course he knows how Capsules work. He has Goku's moves therefore his memories.

This isn't an assumption. Do you believe stating something as if it's an absolute fact counts as it being an "assumption"?

[Jinzoningen MULE]

The burden is on you, the one who has made a committal claim while having not provided any substance, to prove your position.

Just as it is your burden to stand for what you say, which did not have any more substance than what I said.

No, no, that's not how this works. I have made no committal claim, I just listed it as a possibility. You're can't respond with "Nuh-uh" or "You too" without any substance to back it, and still expect to be taken seriously. The second you give substantial evidence that what you say is plausible, I'll back down from this.

[Hellspawn28]

I had a feeling that the Mafuba will return somehow. Maybe they will create a new Z sword and trap him inside stronger than a rice cooker.

[Cetra]

Oh, so now it's assumptions?

I don't know what exactly you mean with that. Of course it was an assumption.

This isn't an assumption. Do you believe stating something as if it's an absolute fact counts as it being an "assumption"?

You phrased it exactly the same way with your destruction stuff so sin me for it, sin you for it.

No, no, that's not how this works. I have made no committal claim, I just listed it as a possibility. You're can't respond with "Nuh-uh" or "You too" without any substance to back it, and still expect to be taken seriously. The second you give substantial evidence that what you say is plausible, I'll back down from this.

I already gave evidence about the possibility of why it is very possible. Whether you like it or not. Circumstancial evidence.

[ryou766]

You phrased it exactly the same way with your destruction stuff so sin me for it, sin you for it.

Really? I gave plausible REASONS as to why Zamasu and Black haven't thought of/are going to destroy the time machine a second time. You flat out just say that Zamasu now has Goku's memories; THEN went on to act as though it was fact because they switched bodies and he knows Goku's moves. That's not an assumption, that's you trying to clarify something as though it's an absolute fact in the franchise.

[Hellspawn28]

Here's a question. What difference does it make if something is Toei's idea or Toriyama's as long as it's done well and explained. This forum in particular has a nasty habit of Everything Toei = bad, Everything Toriyama = good.

Well it's not just this forum, a lot of people had mix-negative feelings to original content from Toei. Most of the old DBZ movies are not very good and GT was consider to be mediocre at best. Toriyama tries to something new while Toei has been known to rehash things (Like most of the old movie villains and GT villains being rehashes).

[Jinzoningen MULE]

First off: don't PM me in a conversation to decrease your chances of being called out. It's transparent and cowardly.

Second: Nonsense? No, it's a basic logical principle that applies everywhere from science to fandom, and everywhere in-between.

Third: I don't care what you do for a living, it's totally irrelevant. There's no magic to this, I'm not even arguing a position. I'm only saying that you can't prove yours, even though you say it as if it's absolute fact.

[Cetra]

You flat out just say that Zamasu now has Goku's memories; THEN went on to act as though it was fact because they switched bodies and he knows Goku's moves. That's not an assumption, that's you trying to clarify something as though it's an absolute fact in the franchise.

Oh and now you are claiming it to be an absolute fact what I intended to write just because of phrasing without actually knowing my intention. Which you can't - except if I explained, which I did just now.

Really? I gave plausible REASONS as to why Zamasu and Black haven't thought of/are going to destroy the time machine a second time.

Exactly. And reasons or not, it is an assumption that it was not possible because of that.

First off, don't PM me in a conversation to decrease your chances of being called out. It's transparent and cowardly.

If I were a coward I would not have continued writing here. The level you are on for actually copying in a private message just calls out for a report though.

Second: Nonsense? No, it's a basic logical principle that applies everywhere from science to fandom, and everywhere in-between.

Yes, it is nonsense. Burden of proof is perfectly fine overall but totally nitpicky in a conversation about fictional stuff where no side actually has anything and one side just wants to disqualify the other one by using this "burden of proof" comment.

I'm only saying that you can't prove yours, even though you say it as if it's absolute fact.

I already explained that. That was actually my bad. Phrasing.

[ryou766]

Oh and now you are claiming it to be an absolute fact what I intended to write just because of phrasing without actually knowing my intention. Which you can't - except if I explained, which I did just now.

And with that, I'm done here.

Exactly. And reasons or not, it is an assumption that it was not possible because of that.

When have I EVER said that what I'm saying is absolute fact? I said this time, and time again, what I detailed are PLAUSIBLE REASONS! Not facts.

[Cetra]

Oh and now you are claiming it to be an absolute fact what I intended to write just because of phrasing without actually knowing my intention. Which you can't - except if I explained, which I did just now.

And with that, I'm done here.

Exactly. And reasons or not, it is an assumption that it was not possible because of that.

When have I EVER said that what I'm saying is absolute fact? I said this time, and time again, what I detailed are PLAUSIBLE REASONS! Not facts.

Then it is better to stop here as it is.

[ArchedThunder]

Didn't feel like catching up on three pages.

*inhale*
[spoiler]I'M GETTING SO SICK OF THE RETREATING TO THE PAST!

Officially not my favorite arc anymore.[/spoiler]

Trunks is staying behind and if episode titles are anything to go by so is Vegeta. As mentioned before it loojs like they might be doing what Z did where we get characters holding off the villain while waiting for Goku. Besides, they only retreated once before.

[Anime Kitten]

Of course he knows how Capsules work. He has Goku's moves therefore his memories.

How does having someone's moves give you their memories?

[Cetra]

Of course he knows how Capsules work. He has Goku's moves therefore his memories.

How does having someone's moves give you their memories?

Every information we have is stored in memories eventually. I am gonna converse with you about that in a PM if you want to.

[Jinzoningen MULE]

The level you are on for actually copying in a private message just calls out for a report though.

I'm not too concerned about a mundane PM with no personal information that belonged in this open forum anyway.

[Cetra]

The level you are on for actually copying in a private message just calls out for a report though.

I'm not too concerned about a mundane PM with no personal information that belonged in this open forum anyway.

It is not your decision though to decide whether my words stand in a forum or not. That is exactly why people do not publish PMs. And no matter what you would have answered, no matter which argument would have happened probably, I would have never done that.

EDIT: The PM got deleted now from your post after the report. Just as it should be.