"Dragon Ball Super" Series Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

[Anime Kitten]

You really think that Black>Beerus? seriously?

As do I. Seeing that I place SSJBKKx10 Goku above Beerus, I'd say an essential SSJB Black (being Rosé) whose Base is now far past SSJ2 Goku is above Beerus.

But, uh... That's off-topic.

[HeroR]

Zamasu clearly let Trunks stab him to show off his immortality and the other half of your statement is speculative since we haven't seen Black go all out.

You really think that Black>Beerus? seriously? I'm pretty sure you're wrong, but think what you want.

When did I say that. I said Future Zamasu is stronger than Present Zamasu and Goku said that Zamasu could someday surpass Beerus.

We know Black in his base equals or even surpasses Goku and Vegeta at their full power. So he's closer to Beerus than either of them.

[Noah]

Goku witnessed the Mafuba when Kami fought Piccolo Jr in the 23rd TB. He should had been able to learn Mafuba by himself. Muten Roshi and Tenshinhan (as well as Piccolo and Kami) learned how to use it by just watching it performed once. Yeah sure they might have trained to master it but they didn't need explicit guidance/lessons for it. And don't tell me that Roshi (someone who still hasn't learned how to fly and needed 50 years for the Kamehameha) could learned a technique by just seeing it once (when Mutaito performed it) while Goku not. Also don't tell me Goku forgot it since the 23rd TB as Roshi still remembered it after 300 years. But anyway this is nitpicking for a show that doesn't care to maintain a basic consistency on more obvious and more important cases.

By the way I very much doubt Mafuba will be the resolution in defeating Black/Zamasu. I have a strong feeling that this whole thing is 100% Toei. They have a hard-on in using old/forgotten techniques: Piccolo's makankosappo, Vegeta's final flash & Gallick gun, Goku's kaioken, Chaozu's paralysis - none of which appeared in Toyotaro's manga so not in Toriyama's manuscript. So even if Mafuba is used I am pretty sure (although ultimately cool) it will be ultimately inconsequential.

You made a really good point, I identified myself with that bold part

I was thinking about that... So if Mafuba will be the ultimate resource to defeat Black/Zamasu, then will we have for the first time a arc where the villain is not defeated by just being overmatched or by strong blast?

[LightBing]

Goku witnessed the Mafuba when Kami fought Piccolo Jr in the 23rd TB. He should had been able to learn Mafuba by himself. Muten Roshi and Tenshinhan (as well as Piccolo and Kami) learned how to use it by just watching it performed once. Yeah sure they might have trained to master it but they didn't need explicit guidance/lessons for it. And don't tell me that Roshi (someone who still hasn't learned how to fly and needed 50 years for the Kamehameha) could learned a technique by just seeing it once (when Mutaito performed it) while Goku not. Also don't tell me Goku forgot it since the 23rd TB as Roshi still remembered it after 300 years. But anyway this is nitpicking for a show that doesn't care to maintain a basic consistency on more obvious and more important cases.

By the way I very much doubt Mafuba will be the resolution in defeating Black/Zamasu. I have a strong feeling that this whole thing is 100% Toei. They have a hard-on in using old/forgotten techniques: Piccolo's makankosappo, Vegeta's final flash & Gallick gun, Goku's kaioken, Chaozu's paralysis - none of which appeared in Toyotaro's manga so not in Toriyama's manuscript. So even if Mafuba is used I am pretty sure (although ultimately cool) it will be ultimately inconsequential.

Master Roshi took fifty years to invent the Kamehameha, not learn it, that's a significant difference. Whatever time Goku might need to learn the technique, it should be in the same time-frame as Tenshinhan. Since both we're able to use the Kamehameha just by seeing it once. In this regards their skills should be similar.
I agree with you that it's likely the Mafuba won't be the resolution to this conflict. It's 50/50 if it's from Mr.Toriyama or from Toei, both sides are likely to bring back the attack. For Toei, it seems like a bit too far into the past (before Z) to be from them. We'll find out in a couple of months in the manga.

[Helios518]

Zamasu clearly let Trunks stab him to show off his immortality and the other half of your statement is speculative since we haven't seen Black go all out.

You really think that Black>Beerus? seriously? I'm pretty sure you're wrong, but think what you want.

When did I say that. I said Future Zamasu is stronger than Present Zamasu and Goku said that Zamasu could someday surpass Beerus.

We know Black in his base equals or even surpasses Goku and Vegeta at their full power. So he's closer to Beerus than either of them.

Well the SSJR Black was said to rival SSJB, So they're pretty much the same distance away from Beerus. viewtopic.php?f=25&t=30157&start=24260#p1155742

[Legion]

As do I. Seeing that I place SSJBKKx10 Goku above Beerus, I'd say an essential SSJB Black (being Rosé) whose Base is now far past SSJ2 Goku is above Beerus.

But, uh... That's off-topic.

SSJBKKx10 Goku is not stronger than Beerus,with or without Akira interviews i thought it was clear. If Hit can deal with SSJBKKx10 Goku ( he beats him actually) and then is scared of Champa....well... but yeah, is off-topic.

I said Future Zamasu is stronger than Present Zamasu and Goku said that Zamasu could someday surpass Beerus.

Goku he only said that Zamasu can become a stronger God like Beerus. That's all.

[alakazam^]

No, actually they didn't give any, Gohan lack of interest in Future Trunks and Goten being absent are just assumptions made by us.

Piccolo warned Trunks that Gohan wasn't a fighter and Trunks never acted like something was up. Gohan doesn't know he had to ask him anything and, for him, Trunks is just a guy he met years back and helped with the current threat, they aren't buddies.

Chichi made Goten study because he's having a test.

[Yomi]

You really think that Black>Beerus? seriously?

As do I. Seeing that I place SSJBKKx10 Goku above Beerus, I'd say an essential SSJB Black (being Rosé) whose Base is now far past SSJ2 Goku is above Beerus.

But, uh... That's off-topic.

I believe that DBS Beerus is still far above Goku. Due to this scene.

[spoiler][/spoiler]

[alakazam^]

Goku witnessed the Mafuba when Kami fought Piccolo Jr in the 23rd TB. He should had been able to learn Mafuba by himself. Muten Roshi and Tenshinhan (as well as Piccolo and Kami) learned how to use it by just watching it performed once. Yeah sure they might have trained to master it but they didn't need explicit guidance/lessons for it. And don't tell me that Roshi (someone who still hasn't learned how to fly and needed 50 years for the Kamehameha) could learned a technique by just seeing it once (when Mutaito performed it) while Goku not. Also don't tell me Goku forgot it since the 23rd TB as Roshi still remembered it after 300 years. But anyway this is nitpicking for a show that doesn't care to maintain a basic consistency on more obvious and more important cases.

By the way I very much doubt Mafuba will be the resolution in defeating Black/Zamasu. I have a strong feeling that this whole thing is 100% Toei. They have a hard-on in using old/forgotten techniques: Piccolo's makankosappo, Vegeta's final flash & Gallick gun, Goku's kaioken, Chaozu's paralysis - none of which appeared in Toyotaro's manga so not in Toriyama's manuscript. So even if Mafuba is used I am pretty sure (although ultimately cool) it will be ultimately inconsequential.

Not every technique works the same so Goku having seen the Mafuuba does not mean a thing whether he could have learn it or not. And him forgetting about it is pretty much believable because the technique was rendered obsolete as soon as it was introduced to him and it's not the kind of technique he'd personally want to learn and rely on. You have a problem with Super/anime and it shows.

Toyotarou's manga isn't Toriyama's manuscript. It could be another Toei original but we don't know yet. Every technique could and should be considered because they're still in each fighter's arsenal and not using them is what's strange.

[HeroR]

You really think that Black>Beerus? seriously? I'm pretty sure you're wrong, but think what you want.

When did I say that. I said Future Zamasu is stronger than Present Zamasu and Goku said that Zamasu could someday surpass Beerus.

We know Black in his base equals or even surpasses Goku and Vegeta at their full power. So he's closer to Beerus than either of them.

Well the SSJR Black was said to rival SSJB, So they're pretty much the same distance away from Beerus. viewtopic.php?f=25&t=30157&start=24260#p1155742

And Black'a form is much stronger than Goku and Vegeta, so even if the multipler is the same, Black comes out ahead by a country mile.

[HeroR]

Goku witnessed the Mafuba when Kami fought Piccolo Jr in the 23rd TB. He should had been able to learn Mafuba by himself. Muten Roshi and Tenshinhan (as well as Piccolo and Kami) learned how to use it by just watching it performed once. Yeah sure they might have trained to master it but they didn't need explicit guidance/lessons for it. And don't tell me that Roshi (someone who still hasn't learned how to fly and needed 50 years for the Kamehameha) could learned a technique by just seeing it once (when Mutaito performed it) while Goku not. Also don't tell me Goku forgot it since the 23rd TB as Roshi still remembered it after 300 years. But anyway this is nitpicking for a show that doesn't care to maintain a basic consistency on more obvious and more important cases.

By the way I very much doubt Mafuba will be the resolution in defeating Black/Zamasu. I have a strong feeling that this whole thing is 100% Toei. They have a hard-on in using old/forgotten techniques: Piccolo's makankosappo, Vegeta's final flash & Gallick gun, Goku's kaioken, Chaozu's paralysis - none of which appeared in Toyotaro's manga so not in Toriyama's manuscript. So even if Mafuba is used I am pretty sure (although ultimately cool) it will be ultimately inconsequential.

Master Roshi took fifty years to invent the Kamehameha, not learn it, that's a significant difference. Whatever time Goku might need to learn the technique, it should be in the same time-frame as Tenshinhan. Since both we're able to use the Kamehameha just by seeing it once. In this regards their skills should be similar.
I agree with you that it's likely the Mafuba won't be the resolution to this conflict. It's 50/50 if it's from Mr.Toriyama or from Toei, both sides are likely to bring back the attack. For Toei, it seems like a bit too far into the past (before Z) to be from them. We'll find out in a couple of months in the manga.

It should be pointed out that Tien was older and more experienced than Goku when he copied the Kamehameha so you can't really compare here.

[Helios518]

When did I say that. I said Future Zamasu is stronger than Present Zamasu and Goku said that Zamasu could someday surpass Beerus.

We know Black in his base equals or even surpasses Goku and Vegeta at their full power. So he's closer to Beerus than either of them.

Well the SSJR Black was said to rival SSJB, So they're pretty much the same distance away from Beerus. viewtopic.php?f=25&t=30157&start=24260#p1155742

And Black'a form is much stronger than Goku and Vegeta, so even if the multipler is the same, Black comes out ahead by a country mile.

Not according to that. Black (at best) is probably only strong enough to win 1v1 against SSJB I doubt he could beat two of them at once.

[kinisking]

Does this mean dub in 2017? I'm also convinced someone high up hates Gohan. I mean he's not on this but Roshi is?

[rs_chaosmaster]

While this seems very likely it doesn't mean anything unfortunately. The Buu Saga for Kai already had its international release a year ago and in the US their is still nothing. Funimation and Toei need to get their act together this is becoming absolute BS!!!

Also not 100% sure on this but I expect Funimation to brand it as Dragon Ball Z Super.

[kinisking]

While this seems very likely it doesn't mean anything unfortunately. The Buu Saga for Kai already had its international release a year ago and in the US their is still nothing. Funimation and Toei need to get their act together this is becoming absolute BS!!!

Also not 100% sure on this but I expect Funimation to brand it as Dragon Ball Z Super.

I hope not. These companies need to grow some balls.

[Hellspawn28]

I doubt it. I remember it was Toei that pick "Dragon Ball Z Kai" for Kai outside of Japan, not Funimation.

[Anime Kitten]

[spoiler][/spoiler]
Does this mean dub in 2017? I'm also convinced someone high up hates Gohan. I mean he's not on this but Roshi is?

Recycling, eh?
[spoiler][/spoiler]

Also, the dub is getting closer and closer to confirmation.

[HeroR]

Well the SSJR Black was said to rival SSJB, So they're pretty much the same distance away from Beerus. viewtopic.php?f=25&t=30157&start=24260#p1155742

And Black'a form is much stronger than Goku and Vegeta, so even if the multipler is the same, Black comes out ahead by a country mile.

Not according to that. Black (at best) is probably only strong enough to win 1v1 against SSJB I doubt he could beat two of them at once.

All forms of Super Saiyan are multiplers of a Saiyan's base form. The higher the base, the stronger they are when they transformed. Even if Super Saiyan Rose is only equal to Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan in power, Black is still stronger since his base form is much stronger than Goku and Vegeta's base forms.

And he probably could beat both of them at once since Goku couldn't even touch him the last time they fought.

[rs_chaosmaster]

[spoiler][/spoiler]
Does this mean dub in 2017? I'm also convinced someone high up hates Gohan. I mean he's not on this but Roshi is?

Recycling, eh?
[spoiler][/spoiler]

Also, the dub is getting closer and closer to confirmation.

If the dub really is as close as you say to confirmation it should of been announced at NYCC it is the last big convention for the year. I highly doubt it gets announced before next year.

[kinisking]

And Black'a form is much stronger than Goku and Vegeta, so even if the multipler is the same, Black comes out ahead by a country mile.

Not according to that. Black (at best) is probably only strong enough to win 1v1 against SSJB I doubt he could beat two of them at once.

All forms of Super Saiyan are multiplers of a Saiyan's base form. The higher the base, the stronger they are when they transformed. Even if Super Saiyan Rose is only equal to Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan in power, Black is still stronger since his base form is much stronger than Goku and Vegeta's base forms.

And he probably could beat both of them at once since Goku couldn't even touch him the last time they fought.

I'm pretty sure SSR is blacks version of the regular super saiyan