The All-Purpose "Versus" Thread

[Angelus]

Alright, so after noticing that there was one overpowered person in the last tournament bracket, I remade it to be more balanced.

Tourney of the "Casuals"

Who'll win each match? And who'll become the World Champion of Martial Arts?
*No Devilmite Beam/drinking blood/stripping*

[TheUltimateNinja]

Anime SSJ2 Goku vs Manga Super Vegetto.

[dragonball0900]

But couldn't King Piccolo have been a 250?

Tien is always training. He was already stronger than King Piccolo in the 23rd Tournament because he witnessed Goku's battle with King Piccolo and compared Goku's speed with 3 years later on the tournament, and said that Goku was already much stronger than he was 3 years before, and was fighting nearly equally with him. If he was already stronger than King Piccolo in the 23rd Tournament, then after 5 years to Raditz' arrival, he's obviously going to get stronger.

King Piccolo - 220
Tien (23rd Budokai) - 230
Tien (Raditz' arrival) - 250

[TheUltimateNinja]

But couldn't King Piccolo have been a 250?

Tien is always training. He was already stronger than King Piccolo in the 23rd Tournament because he witnessed Goku's battle with King Piccolo and compared Goku's speed with 3 years later on the tournament, and said that Goku was already much stronger than he was 3 years before, and was fighting nearly equally with him. If he was already stronger than King Piccolo in the 23rd Tournament, then after 5 years to Raditz' arrival, he's obviously going to get stronger.

King Piccolo - 220
Tien (23rd Budokai) - 230
Tien (Raditz' arrival) - 250

There is no way to fit all the DB power levels in between the farmer's 5 and Goku's 416 at the start of DBZ, the gap is too small. Even if you massively lowball Beginning of DB Goku and have him at 10 or something you still can't do it.

[PelicanDynasty]

Alright, so after noticing that there was one overpowered person in the last tournament bracket, I remade it to be more balanced.

Tourney of the "Casuals"

Who'll win each match? And who'll become the World Champion of Martial Arts?
*No Devilmite Beam/drinking blood/stripping*

Bandages beats Nam fairly comfortably.

Bacterian vs Ranfan is a toss up. Doesn't matter who wins, Bandages crushes them.


On the other side I will take Fangs but it's pretty close since there is no blood drinking.

And I'll take Devilman to beat Metallitron and then beat Fangs in the semis to set up a Bandages-Devilman final.

With no Devilmite beam allowed I think Bandages wins the whole thing. He's never lost to anybody besides Goku and doesn't rely on one trick the way Devilman does.

[TheUltimateNinja]

Here's a few:
22nd WMAT Krillin vs 21st WMAT Roshi.
Goku (Pre Divine Water) vs Drum.
23rd WMAT Yamcha vs Tambourine.
23rd WMAT Tenshinhan vs Piccolo Daimao (Young) + all of his minions.
23rd WMAT Krillin vs Piccolo Daimao (Old) and Drum
Saiyan Saga Goku + Vegeta team up vs Cui, Dodoria and Zarbon.

[ZombieVito]

Here's a few:
22nd WMAT Krillin vs 21st WMAT Roshi.
Goku (Pre Divine Water) vs Drum.
23rd WMAT Yamcha vs Tambourine.
23rd WMAT Tenshinhan vs Piccolo Daimao (Young) + all of his minions.
23rd WMAT Krillin vs Piccolo Daimao (Old) and Drum
Saiyan Saga Goku + Vegeta team up vs Cui, Dodoria and Zarbon.

The only chance of victory for Roshi is his Full Power Kamehameha but I doubt Kuririn will just stand there and get hit. Kuririn one shots.
Drum wins with medium difficulty.
Yamcha avenges all the TB fighters that got killed.
Daimao alone wins but with high difficulty thanks to Tenshinhan's superior speed.
Piccolo laughs at Kuririn and orders Drum to kill him. Kuririn puts a decent fight but dies a second time by the hand of Daimao's sons.
While Goku surpasses all of his opponents, the Kaioken will be his downfall. Team Freeza wins.

[Angelus]

changed it up a little bit XD

I had a feeling that Spike would have been OP

[dragonball0900]

But couldn't King Piccolo have been a 250?

Tien is always training. He was already stronger than King Piccolo in the 23rd Tournament because he witnessed Goku's battle with King Piccolo and compared Goku's speed with 3 years later on the tournament, and said that Goku was already much stronger than he was 3 years before, and was fighting nearly equally with him. If he was already stronger than King Piccolo in the 23rd Tournament, then after 5 years to Raditz' arrival, he's obviously going to get stronger.

King Piccolo - 220
Tien (23rd Budokai) - 230
Tien (Raditz' arrival) - 250

There is no way to fit all the DB power levels in between the farmer's 5 and Goku's 416 at the start of DBZ, the gap is too small. Even if you massively lowball Beginning of DB Goku and have him at 10 or something you still can't do it.

Well, I managed to do it actually, it is possible. I might show a list soon. For example, if Roshi was 139 in Z, considering he didn't train between those 8 years since the King Piccolo arc, he's probably at 145, and Goku and Tien are possibly 150. But let's forget the numbers for a moment and let's just say that King Piccolo (and Kid Goku from that arc) is not as strong as Tien was in the 23rd Budokai, who himself is not as strong as Weighted Goku in the same tournament (who is greatly surpassed by Tien's speed)

Here's a few:
22nd WMAT Krillin vs 21st WMAT Roshi.
Goku (Pre Divine Water) vs Drum.
23rd WMAT Yamcha vs Tambourine.
23rd WMAT Tenshinhan vs Piccolo Daimao (Young) + all of his minions.
23rd WMAT Krillin vs Piccolo Daimao (Old) and Drum
Saiyan Saga Goku + Vegeta team up vs Cui, Dodoria and Zarbon.

1.The first one I give it to Krillin, unless Roshi powers up to his max, he might have a chance. But Krillin managed to battle Goku who was much stronger than 3 years before. It's possible that Krillin might have surpass him even after his Korin's training and battles against Tao Pai Pai, Red Ribbon and Grandpa Gohan.

2. I give it to Drum, since he was able to beat Tenshinhan, who was equal to him, but I suppose Goku would manage to land hits on him.

3. Yamcha beats this, since he's stronger than Cyborg Tao, who is stronger than Tenshinhan and Goku in the 22nd Budokai, who are stronger than Tambourine.

4. Tenshinhan wins this for reasons I mentioned above in this post.

5. Krillin beats Old Piccolo and Drum, since he manages to battle against Piccolo Jr so well. I don't think he can handle the young one though.

6. I give it to Cui, Dodoria and Zarbon. Vegeta is only at Cui's level, and Goku would need a Kaioken X3 to defeat all 3 of them. Maybe Cui would fight Vegeta, while Goku would finish either Cui or Dodoria as easy as how Vegeta beat Dodoria in the Namek saga. Unfortunately, with Zarbon, even if he doesn't transform, is a bit stronger than Dodoria, and with 3 fighters against 2 would be a problem for Goku and Vegeta, so I give the win to Cui, Dodoria and Zarbon.

[DBZ Macky]

Here's a few:
1.22nd WMAT Krillin vs 21st WMAT Roshi.
2.Goku (Pre Divine Water) vs Drum.
3.23rd WMAT Yamcha vs Tambourine.
4.23rd WMAT Tenshinhan vs Piccolo Daimao (Young) + all of his minions.
5.23rd WMAT Krillin vs Piccolo Daimao (Old) and Drum
6.Saiyan Saga Goku + Vegeta team up vs Cui, Dodoria and Zarbon.

1.Kuririn far surpasses Base!Roshi in power. He was able to fight on par for a while with Goku's match-level. The same Goku who was able to stomp Tao Pai Pai who was able to stomp 21st WMAT Goku.
2.I'll be using my "Powar Levul" logic, so Tenshinhan is a little higher than 180 when he fights Drum, possibly a little lower due to fatigue. In the Anime at least, it seems Tenshinhan puts up somewhat of a fight. So Drum would be around 200 IMO.
According to Karin, Goku has surpassed him. Karin has a official BP of 190. Therefore, Goku would be around ~195. My explanation for this is the so called "Zenkai Boost". So Goku would be able to fight better against Drum, and with a well aimed Kamehameha, he'd win.
3.Again, BoZ Yamcha has an official BP of 177, which is close to 22nd WMAT Goku's 180. Considering how Goku pulverized Tambourine, He'd stand no chance against 23rd WMAT Yamcha. On that note, I also have 23rd WMAT Yamcha being way stronger than BoZ Yamcha.
4.Tenshinhan would be a bit weaker than Daimao going by official numbers, but his speed would be on a whole 'nother level. Besides, he just needs a well aimed Kikoho to finish Daimao off. The rest of his spawn are small fry.
5.Kuririn would be able to defeat Drum, one on one. But would lose to Daimao horribly.
6.Saiyan Saga Goku has Kaioken x4, Saiyan Saga Vegeta has the Oozaru transformation. If Goku get's lucky enough, he alone would be able to wipe out Transformed Zarbon and the rest would just be small fry.

[dragonball0900]

I recommend not to stick to much with those "180" and "260" numbers, since they contradict everything from the manga.

Tien obviously is much stronger in Z than he was in the 23rd Budokai, so if he was 250 then he would be much weaker in the 23rd Budokai. For King Piccolo it would be impossible to beat Tien from Z, since Tien witnessed Goku and King Piccolo's power in their battle 3 years ago then he remarked in the tournament that he was stronger than what he was 3 years ago and they were fighting equally (with Goku having the slight advantage in strenght and Tien in speed, this is weighted Goku). Also with Yamcha, the evidence we have from his power in the 23rd Budokai is that he should be stronger than Cyborg Tao, who was confident in beating Tien (remember that Tao was also his master, and knew of Tien's capabilities and tecniques).

Why is Yamcha stronger than him? Well, he was able to see Tien's movements on the fight with Weighted Goku, and yet I don't think Cyborg Tao (judging by how he ended up in his battle earlier) would do that.

It's 22nd Tien vs Goku<Cyborg Tao<23rd Yamcha<23rd Krillin<King Piccolo vs Goku<23rd Tien<=23rd Weighted Goku

[DBZ Macky]

I recommend not to stick to much with those "180" and "260" numbers, since they contradict everything from the manga.

Tien obviously is much stronger in Z than he was in the 23rd Budokai, so if he was 250 then he would be much weaker in the 23rd Budokai. For King Piccolo it would be impossible to beat Tien from Z, since Tien witnessed Goku and King Piccolo's power in their battle 3 years ago then he remarked in the tournament that he was stronger than what he was 3 years ago and they were fighting equally (with Goku having the slight advantage in strenght and Tien in speed, this is weighted Goku). Also with Yamcha, the evidence we have from his power in the 23rd Budokai is that he should be stronger than Cyborg Tao, who was confident in beating Tien (remember that Tao was also his master, and knew of Tien's capabilities and tecniques).

Why is Yamcha stronger than him? Well, he was able to see Tien's movements on the fight with Weighted Goku, and yet I don't think Cyborg Tao (judging by how he ended up in his battle earlier) would do that.

It's 22nd Tien vs Goku<Cyborg Tao<23rd Yamcha<23rd Krillin<King Piccolo vs Goku<23rd Tien<=23rd Weighted Goku

No harm intended, but I'll go with the Daizenshuu over your or even my own interpretation of the story. Obviously, to both me and you, what you said DOES make the most sense... or does it?
Is it really possible for 23rd Budokai Tenshinhan to be superior to Piccolo Daimao? When it took Goku the Super God Water to reach that realm of power.
"Seeing one's movements" has always been inconsistent always, it has more to be able to "feel" the fighters, and Yamcha and co. would have an advantage in that regard, over Tao, who gets most of his power from cybernetic upgrades anyways.

I won't be so keen on dismissing the few actual numbers that we've been provided. If we're disregarding those, it's actually better to create a BP list ignoring official numbers like a lot of people have done. It is easier to fit all the otherwise contradicting statements that way.

That being said, there's always room for "Head Canon" to come to the rescue:
1. You think Yamcha should be stronger than Tao at the 23rd? Well, alright! Yamcha IS stronger than Tao then... But after 5 years of not training all that much, he becomes weaker than 22nd WMAT Goku. Surely, that must be the case, we've even seen through Gohan that minimal/no training can make you incredibly weak.
2. You think Ten should be able to defeat a Goku stronger than Piccolo Daimao? Well, alright! He can beat him... but only because of his superior speed and techniques.

[TheUltimateNinja]

IMO Goku and Vegeta combined can take down Cui, Dodoria and Zarbon without even having to resort to Vegeta's Oozaru. Dodoria is one-shot material to Kkx3 Goku and Vegeta can handle Cui by himself, Zarbon is the only problem as his monster state would put him above Goku, but with Kkx4 Goku could surpass him again. Sure, he can't maintain it for long and it will completely wreck his body, but with just a single attack he should be able to wreck Zarbon to the extent that he drops back down to his normal form and becomes weakened enough for Vegeta to kill him.

[dragonball0900]

I recommend not to stick to much with those "180" and "260" numbers, since they contradict everything from the manga.

Tien obviously is much stronger in Z than he was in the 23rd Budokai, so if he was 250 then he would be much weaker in the 23rd Budokai. For King Piccolo it would be impossible to beat Tien from Z, since Tien witnessed Goku and King Piccolo's power in their battle 3 years ago then he remarked in the tournament that he was stronger than what he was 3 years ago and they were fighting equally (with Goku having the slight advantage in strenght and Tien in speed, this is weighted Goku). Also with Yamcha, the evidence we have from his power in the 23rd Budokai is that he should be stronger than Cyborg Tao, who was confident in beating Tien (remember that Tao was also his master, and knew of Tien's capabilities and tecniques).

Why is Yamcha stronger than him? Well, he was able to see Tien's movements on the fight with Weighted Goku, and yet I don't think Cyborg Tao (judging by how he ended up in his battle earlier) would do that.

It's 22nd Tien vs Goku<Cyborg Tao<23rd Yamcha<23rd Krillin<King Piccolo vs Goku<23rd Tien<=23rd Weighted Goku

No harm intended, but I'll go with the Daizenshuu over your or even my own interpretation of the story. Obviously, to both me and you, what you said DOES make the most sense... or does it?
Is it really possible for 23rd Budokai Tenshinhan to be superior to Piccolo Daimao? When it took Goku the Super God Water to reach that realm of power.
"Seeing one's movements" has always been inconsistent always, it has more to be able to "feel" the fighters, and Yamcha and co. would have an advantage in that regard, over Tao, who gets most of his power from cybernetic upgrades anyways.

I won't be so keen on dismissing the few actual numbers that we've been provided. If we're disregarding those, it's actually better to create a BP list ignoring official numbers like a lot of people have done. It is easier to fit all the otherwise contradicting statements that way.

That being said, there's always room for "Head Canon" to come to the rescue:
1. You think Yamcha should be stronger than Tao at the 23rd? Well, alright! Yamcha IS stronger than Tao then... But after 5 years of not training all that much, he becomes weaker than 22nd WMAT Goku. Surely, that must be the case, we've even seen through Gohan that minimal/no training can make you incredibly weak.
2. You think Ten should be able to defeat a Goku stronger than Piccolo Daimao? Well, alright! He can beat him... but only because of his superior speed and techniques.

Oh yeah, it's alright. I know we can differ opinions on this part since the manga contradicts the 180 and 260 numbers. That said, I don't believe Yamcha got weaker than Goku from the 22nd, yeah, he probably stopped training, but I don't know if there's evidence for him to stop training, maybe he just made light training? Just to keep up a bit? Remember that this was a point of the series where his power was not leagues below the rest of the Z fighters. Maybe he just stayed the same 177 power and had that power at the Budokai? I don't believe the 180 number that it was given to Goku and Tien, specially considering that Tien was fighting nearly equal to Roshi, who was probably at 145 (he was 139 in Z, assuming he stopped the training since the King Piccolo saga, although considering RoF...). Maybe Tien and Goku were at 150 to 155 at the 22nd Budokai, but the 180 number contradicts that.

[Angelus]

Androids Saga Piccolo + Kami Potara Fusion VS Kamiccolo (freshly fused; full power)

[DBZ Macky]

Androids Saga Piccolo + Kami Potara Fusion VS Kamiccolo (freshly fused; full power)

Piccolo's power increase after merging with Kami via potara would be like going from 1,000 to 1,001. In the worst case scenario, he could actually get weaker.

[Sailor Haumea]

SS Bardock vs. 1st Form Frieza

Frieza can only transform once, into 2nd Form.

Who wins?

[Steven Bloodriver]

SS Bardock vs. 1st Form Frieza

Frieza can only transform once, into 2nd Form.

Who wins?

Forgive me if I am mistaken, but did you do a post very similar to this?

[Sailor Haumea]

SS Bardock vs. 1st Form Frieza

Frieza can only transform once, into 2nd Form.

Who wins?

Forgive me if I am mistaken, but did you do a post very similar to this?

Maybe? I don't remember.

[Steven Bloodriver]

SS Bardock vs. 1st Form Frieza

Frieza can only transform once, into 2nd Form.

Who wins?

Forgive me if I am mistaken, but did you do a post very similar to this?

Maybe? I don't remember.

Anyways... Super Saiyan Bardock would have been much stronger than First Form and even Second Form Frieza. So the Emperor of Dread would have been beaten by the legend he had helped create.