GT or Super? Which one is the best?

[Fionordequester]

...when they first introduced the concept... did anyone hear that idea and not think "This sounds like a bad fanfic written by a 12-year-old"?

I certainly did. Cue me being blown away at just how awesome he ended up being.

[fadeddreams5]

I don't recall a single moment in GT where things were left to air, besides the ending, which was intentional.

Super Saiyan 4 was never explained in the show. It just... happened. Plus, the Black Star Dragon Balls come out thin air with zero explanation. The lack of explanation of the Black Star Dragon Balls is the biggest offender, because that se of wish-granting MacGuffins single-handedly kick start the entire plot of the show. GT flat out doesn't happen if the Black Star Dragon Balls don't exist. So the entire concept of GT is essentially built on a plot hole, or at best, a major contrivance. Because how the hell does barely anybody, except for Popo, King Kai and for some reason the Pilaf Gang, which in itself is another plot hole, know that the Black Star Dragon Balls even exist?

Wasn't it explained that they were dragon balls created when Kami and Piccolo were still one being? They were dangerous, so nobody ever bothered to mention them.

SSJ4 is pretty self-explanatory. It's a form that combines the attributes of the SSJ form and Oozaru. We see that visually.

[Lord Beerus]

I don't recall a single moment in GT where things were left to air, besides the ending, which was intentional.

Super Saiyan 4 was never explained in the show. It just... happened. Plus, the Black Star Dragon Balls come out thin air with zero explanation. The lack of explanation of the Black Star Dragon Balls is the biggest offender, because that se of wish-granting MacGuffins single-handedly kick start the entire plot of the show. GT flat out doesn't happen if the Black Star Dragon Balls don't exist. So the entire concept of GT is essentially built on a plot hole, or at best, a major contrivance. Because how the hell does barely anybody, except for Popo, King Kai and for some reason the Pilaf Gang, which in itself is another plot hole, know that the Black Star Dragon Balls even exist?

Wasn't it explained that they were dragon balls created when Kami and Piccolo were still one being? They were dangerous, so nobody ever bothered to mention them.

SSJ4 is pretty self-explanatory. It's a form that combines the attributes of the SSJ form and Oozaru. We see that visually.

Just re-watched the first episode of GT subbed, and you're right. An explanation was given about the origin of the Black Star Dragon Balls. I take back my previous complaint. But have to wonder that if the Black Star Dragon Ball were so were dangerous that nobody ever bothered to mention them, how did the Pilaf Gang know about them?

[Soppa Saia People]

GT. GT has some really bad parts, but it had I lot stuff I like, plus it has the best opening and ending (the second one) theme IMO. I straight up think Super is a bad show.

[Bansho64]

GT. GT has some really bad parts, but it had I lot stuff I like, plus it has the best opening and ending (the second one) theme IMO. I straight up think Super is a bad show.

Well, at least I got some fellow GT brethren in here

[Soppa Saia People]

GT. GT has some really bad parts, but it had I lot stuff I like, plus it has the best opening and ending (the second one) theme IMO. I straight up think Super is a bad show.

Well, at least I got one fellow GT brethren in here

I watched GT at the perfect time, I had just read volume 42 and to see that ending was awesome, after I spent about 5 years reading this series.

[Cetra]

GT. GT has some really bad parts, but it had I lot stuff I like, plus it has the best opening and ending (the second one) theme IMO. I straight up think Super is a bad show.

Well, at least I got one fellow GT brethren in here

Pretty sure I am an obvious one.

Super Saiyan 4 was never explained in the show. It just... happened. Plus, the Black Star Dragon Balls come out thin air with zero explanation. The lack of explanation of the Black Star Dragon Balls is the biggest offender, because that se of wish-granting MacGuffins single-handedly kick start the entire plot of the show. GT flat out doesn't happen if the Black Star Dragon Balls don't exist. So the entire concept of GT is essentially built on a plot hole, or at best, a major contrivance. Because how the hell does barely anybody, except for Popo, King Kai and for some reason the Pilaf Gang, which in itself is another plot hole, know that the Black Star Dragon Balls even exist?

Wasn't it explained that they were dragon balls created when Kami and Piccolo were still one being? They were dangerous, so nobody ever bothered to mention them.

SSJ4 is pretty self-explanatory. It's a form that combines the attributes of the SSJ form and Oozaru. We see that visually.

Just re-watched the first episode of GT subbed, and you're right. An explanation was given about the origin of the Black Star Dragon Balls. I take back my previous complaint. But have to wonder that if the Black Star Dragon Ball were so were dangerous that nobody ever bothered to mention them, how did the Pilaf Gang know about them?

I could bring up the same argument about Piccolo Daimaou's rice cooker but remembering how I brought that up in the past I expect someone to justify that and not the Black Star Dragon Balls.

[Cipher]

Super never explained how or why Pilaf became kids.

We got a manga special chapter a while back with Pilaf, Shu and Mai becoming younger when #17 and #18 where attacking. It's likely the same in Goku's timeline, they probably wish be younger before #19 and Dr. Gero show up.

I mean, we all know how, because we saw the movie version and follow ancillary media. With that, it's not so much that the TV series never explains it -- as in, we have unanswered questions -- as it is an indication of its enormous sloppiness early in production. I genuinely feel that their story was meant to be included in one of the early episodes, but never made it in. Thus, something that was "meant" to act as a stand-alone product and bring people who never watched the movies up to speed, winds up ... not being a stand-alone product or being fully capable of bringing people who never watched the movies up to speed.

It shouldn't carry that much weight, I guess, but it still stands out as this huge black mark against the series, because it's so unbelievable something like that happened in the first place.

Take a shot every time the phrase "good ideas but bad execution" comes up in this thread.

GT had some decent ideas like Baby being a Tuffle and the Shadow Dragons being a result of the overuse of the Dragon Balls but they were executed so poorly.

GT produced many amazing ideas, but executed them poorly.

[Bullza]

Super is drastically better.

The story is far more interesting. GT had some decent ideas like Baby being a Tuffle and the Shadow Dragons being a result of the overuse of the Dragon Balls but they were executed so poorly.

Super has introduced some interesting concepts like the multiple universes, Gods of Destruction, Angels, Time Rings, Super Dragon Balls etc and GT had noting like that.

The cast is much better especially with how they are used. In GT Vegeta was barely even in it at first. Piccolo and Krillin were in a few episodes if that. Some of the other characters barely appeared. Tien practically had a cameo.

It was mainly Goku who was just a kid, Trunks and Pan who was one of the worst anime characters of all time.

The show just feels like filler. You can tell Toriyama had nothing to do with it.

The character designs were so awful for most of the new characters and even some of the existing characters looked a little lousy like mustachio Vegeta.

It was so silly and the comedy was so bad.

Super has its problems but the animation does have standout moments which GT never had. The characters and the character designs are much better because Toriyama did them. It's not overly comedic and the humour is pretty funny. The villains have been pretty good, Beerus and Zamasu are some of the best villains period. The pacing is much better.

It could give more screen to some of the other characters but it's done a much better job than GT. Besides Goku and Vegeta we've had plenty of Trunks and Bulma, we get to see Krillin, Goten, Kid Trunks, Piccolo, Chi-Chi somewhat regularly. Yamcha, Tien and some of the others could appear a bit more but they do now and then.

Overall it's far better, it's not comparable at all.

[Avok]

Both are equally bad and equally good, if that makes sense.

Like, GT was just awful when it came to the actual plot and most of the time the characterisation, but in other aspects it was just spot on.
For example, the concept of the Shadow Dragons and the Golden Oozaru are to me the best in all of Dragon Ball, even though they were pooly executed.

On the other hand we have Super, a series plaged with production problems since the very beginning.
The plot ins't as good as people make it out to be, but this wouldn't be that big of a problem, and I'll say why in just a moment.

Even though I consider the Universe 6 Arc to be appailing overall, it would have been more bearable if the production and direction were done right. And I'm not talking just about animation here (which has sustancially improved since this arc and now we've got some of the best scenes in the franchise) but the colors, the character designs, the composition of the scenes, the music; the overall feel of the series. To me, it's just off and it has been off since Battle of Gods.

And here's the strongest point of GT: It scenes have weight. Whenever it's this, or this, or this. They have effects and colors, camera movements, character acting; soul.

When it comes to the characters, I feel that they're both as bad, but atleast GT did some things a little nicer.
Let's talk about Goku... He's equally awful in both series. In Super he's a handicaped man-child, and in GT he's literally a child. It's like the writers have completely forgot about his character. I mean, you compare Boo Saga/EoZ Goku with either of them and the difference is night and day.

The side characters in GT had some screentime and participation, specially in the Baby Saga like Goten vs Gohan or them vs Vegeta, or Oob vs Baby, etc, but it's not like it was anything too significant as they preffered to introduce a bunch of weird aliens and robots from all over the universe.
Super is no better in this aspect. Almost every character has been a walking meme so far, a gimmick with a name sort to say.

At least in GT they felt somewhat closer to how they were in the anime and the manga.

This arc of Super has been pretty good though. It has had some of the best scenes in all of Super (concept wise) and I think it has been overall better than any of GT, plot wise.
It has a series of problems though, like the way Trunks looks (this has more to do with the overall look of the series in general, but whatever) and too much Goku and Vegeta. I would have preffer something like the Cell Saga where everyone is involved one way or another.

Overall, I would say it's 50/50.

[Trickster]

GT is soooo much better. In Super, me and my friends find millions of incoherences in every single episode.

Neither of them can be compared to the original, but Super is, definitely, worst.

[Baggie_Saiyan]

Super surpasses GT next week that's all you need to know!

But seriously I don't see the comparison at all. Both series are/were trying to do different things and different times. Until Super goes EoZ and beyond I don't see the need for people to keep doing this.
Why not compare all the series together?

[Soppa Saia People]

]
Let's talk about Goku... He's equally awful in both series. In Super he's a handicaped man-child, and in GT he's literally a child. It's like the writers have completely forgot about his character. I mean, you compare Boo Saga/EoZ Goku with either of them and the difference is night and day.

I actual quite like GT Goku, even though he's a kid, he actual seems like an adult and doesn't (Haven't seen GT since last, correct me if I'm wrong) make any dumb descions. Besides the wanking, I really GT Goku. I do wish he went back to an adult after the first saga.

[Cipher]

Why not compare all the series together?

We must live in binaries.

A decision has to be made.

[coola]

Super would be a lot better, if they just went straight to Champa, and didn't made these god awful retellings of BoG and F movies, and if they didn't make Chi-Chi bitch and Goku manchild As of with is better? Hard to tell, I'm waiting when they finally go beyond end of Z part, GT is almost 20 years old, no need to be afraid to go beyond Z If Star Wars finally got past Clone Wars, so can Super go beyond Z

[TheGreatness25]

I don't know, everyone keeps ragging on the first two arcs of Super, but I don't see the problem. DB established that it doesn't consider the movies as continuity, so it only makes sense that the series of Super would present the entire story that it wants to include so that you could watch the series and know what's happening without going to the outside sources (movies) to do it. It's kind of like saying that you could just watch "Path to Power" and skip everything until the Baba arc in Dragon Ball. Yeah it's a little different, but it's kind of the same at the same time. If they wanted the events of Battle of Gods and Resurrection F to be counted in Super's timeline, then it's a smart move that they included it. It might not match up with the movies, but at least there's no question of what counts and doesn't count in Super.

[Super Saiyan Swagger]

I've found myself enjoying Super way more than GT even with its flaws. GT was just so boring. Not at all terrible, just... boring.

I pretty much share the same opinion as MasakoX in this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-WHQZKs_LA

[Ki Breaker]

I've found myself enjoying Super way more than GT even with its flaws. GT was just so boring. Not at all terrible, just... boring.

I pretty much share the same opinion as MasakoX in this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-WHQZKs_LA

I second this

[Noah]

And here's the strongest point of GT: It scenes have weight. Whenever it's this, or this, or this. They have effects and colors, camera movements, character acting; soul.

Wow, those scenes were great! I'd miss scenes like this in Super

[Cipher]

I don't know, everyone keeps ragging on the first two arcs of Super, but I don't see the problem. DB established that it doesn't consider the movies as continuity, so it only makes sense that the series of Super would present the entire story that it wants to include so that you could watch the series and know what's happening without going to the outside sources (movies) to do it.

Even though it flat out fails to include an explanation for the Pilaf Gang and omits the one element of their subplot that would come to bear later in the series?

The "Super was necessary for those who didn't watch the movies" excuse doesn't hold, because its production was too slipshod to ensure people wouldn't actually have to have seen the movies.