Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

[DBZGTKOSDH]

SSB Vegetto should be much stronger than Beerus, since he should be thousands of times stronger than SSB Goku & Vegeta, and Beerus isn't thousands of times stronger than them. So, let's see how Merged Zamasu will compare to him first, and what power-ups he will get during their fight. For this episode, I personally don't believe Zamasu was going all-out against the Saiyans since he is underestimating them, which is why they could resist him.

[Legion]

Guys, these numbers in super are not the answer. Not anymore.

I say Merged Zamasu is nowhere near Beerus and I also feel that Hit at max will destroy Merged Zamasu easily.

Are you high? Hit is a technique character, he doesn't really have that much battle strength. Merged Zamasu is definitely stronger than Beerus. You guys just want to keep Beerus at the top, even though there are other more powerful characters out there including Vegetto...

And again, i don't see any evidence since we have never seen Beerus full power. Zamasu can be stronger than Beerus, but is not a fact, for now.

I think it is useless to discuss at this point, we'll see.

[Bullza]

Yeah we should probably see the episode first. Is Zamasu going to overpower Goku's or not?

They're obviously going to be overwhelmed somehow otherwise they wouldn't become Vegito. It depends what this life risking attack of Goku's does and if it has any affect. Is that why Zamasu looks so weird?

But yeah it is a little odd at the moment because he was overpowered by Vegeta and Trunks because then in the preview you can see him keeping up fight Vegito who has scratches on him.

[ZombieVito]

Now let's go straight to this brand new saga. We have:
1. In the first fight, Ssj2 Trunks manages to hit SsjR Goku (who one-shots SsjB Vegeta) and Future Zamasu. Ssj2 Trunks should not even be initial Hit level, who was below SsjB Goku and Vegeta. Absurd, literally absurd.
2. Trunks gets God Ki, or something like thatm out of nowhere. Vegeta at least trained a year straight with Whis. What the fuck has Trunks done? Nothing. That's the fact.
3. Super Trunks, in episode 63, did better than SsjB Goku and Vegeta had done the previous two times. Why? How?
4. Last but not least, in episode 65, Super Trunks manages to keep up Merged Zamasu, a being who should be hundreds of time stronger than him.
5. How the fuck can Goku, Vegeta and Trunk rival Merged Zamasu and push him back? Oh god.

1.- Well, Trunks got a rage boost and Zamasu was stated to let his guard down so him getting hit by weaker fighters is no problem.
2.- We don't know what his transformation is. Best to wait for an official explanation to it.
3.- The transformation gives more power than SSB, easy.
4.- Huh? It's pretty obvious Zamasu is not even close to using his full power.
5.- Rival? Like what fight did you see? The only one truly rivaling him his SSB Vegetto.

[HeroR]

I say Merged Zamasu is nowhere near Beerus and I also feel that Hit at max will destroy Merged Zamasu easily.

Hit has technique over power. Power and speed-wise, he was inferior to Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan Goku. What makes him deadly is his Time-Skip which he kept improving and his killing techniques. Since Merged Zamasu is an immortal, Hit would be lucky to tickle Merged Zamasu, if he can even hit him.

[buutenks]

Maybe wait till nexp ep, instead of arguing for 10 pages.

[TheUltimateNinja]

So, Goku is the strongest after all? He was able to overpower Zamasu's attack singlehandedly so he's top dog now, right?

[Zamasu55]

So, Goku is the strongest after all? He was able to overpower Zamasu's attack singlehandedly so he's top dog now, right?

Yes.

[Zamasu55]

Now let's go straight to this brand new saga. We have:
1. In the first fight, Ssj2 Trunks manages to hit SsjR Goku (who one-shots SsjB Vegeta) and Future Zamasu. Ssj2 Trunks should not even be initial Hit level, who was below SsjB Goku and Vegeta. Absurd, literally absurd.
2. Trunks gets God Ki, or something like thatm out of nowhere. Vegeta at least trained a year straight with Whis. What the fuck has Trunks done? Nothing. That's the fact.
3. Super Trunks, in episode 63, did better than SsjB Goku and Vegeta had done the previous two times. Why? How?
4. Last but not least, in episode 65, Super Trunks manages to keep up Merged Zamasu, a being who should be hundreds of time stronger than him.
5. How the fuck can Goku, Vegeta and Trunk rival Merged Zamasu and push him back? Oh god.

1.- Well, Trunks got a rage boost and Zamasu was stated to let his guard down so him getting hit by weaker fighters is no problem.
2.- We don't know what his transformation is. Best to wait for an official explanation to it.
3.- The transformation gives more power than SSB, easy.
4.- Huh? It's pretty obvious Zamasu is not even close to using his full power.
5.- Rival? Like what fight did you see? The only one truly rivaling him his SSB Vegetto.

The "let his guard down" thing is bullshit.

[emperior]

Once again I put together a Power Levels list. It should make as much sense it possibly can (even though DBS hardly makes much sense) anyways if you see something uncorrect, please tell me!

BoG Arc

[spoiler]Goku
Base - 80
SSJ - 4,000
SSJ2 - 8,000
SSJ3 - 16,000
SSG - 480,000

Vegeta
Base - 76
SSJ - 3,800
SSJ2 - 7,600
SSJ2 Enraged - 76,000

Beerus
Unseen True Power - 10,000,000

(I’m going to assume Beerus used 10% of his true power and then scaled his power)

Full Power - 1,000,000
vs SSJ3 Goku, at 5% - 50,000
vs Enraged Vegeta, at 10% - 100,000
vs God Goku, at 50% - 500,000

Whis
Full Power - 15,000,000[/spoiler]

RoF Arc

[spoiler]Goku
Base - 100
Base with God Ki - 10,000
SSB - 500,000

Vegeta
Base - 100
Base with God Ki - 10,000
SSB - 500,000

(Super Saiyan Blue is 50x Base with God Ki and 5000x Base)

Freezer
1st Form - 150
4th Form - 12,000
Golden - 600,000
Exhausted - 400,000

(Golden Form is 50x of Freezer's 4th form)

Gohan
Base - 72
SSJ - 3,600

Tagoma
Base - 10
Post-Training - 3,600
Ginyu - 3,200[/spoiler]

Universal Tournament Arc


Gods

[spoiler]Whis - 15,000,000

Beerus - 10,000,000

Vados - 15,010,000

Champa - 9,990,000[/spoiler]

U7 Fighters

[spoiler]Goku
Base - 150
SSJ - 7,500
Base with God Ki - 15,000
SSB - 750,000
SSB + KKx2 - 1,500,000
SSB + KKx10 - 7,500,000

Vegeta

Base - 150
SSJ - 7,500
Base with God Ki - 15,000
SSB - 750,000

Piccolo - 7,000

Mr Buu - 24,000

Monaka - 1[/spoiler]

U6 Fighters

[spoiler]Botamo - 150

Frost
1st Form - 90
Assault Form - 460
Final Form - 7,200

Otto Magetta - 10,000

Cabba
Base - 150
SSJ - 7,500
SSJ Tired - 5,000

Hit - ???[/spoiler]


Black Arc

Future

[spoiler]Future Trunks
Base - 150
SSJ2 - 15,000

Black
Base Full Power - 25,000

Trunks (1st Fight vs Black)
Base - 80
SSJ2 - 8,000

Black (1st appearance in the Future)
Base - 15,000[/spoiler]

Present

[spoiler]Trunks (1st Zenkai)
Base - 200
SSJ2 - 20,000

Black
Base Full Power - 25,000

Goku
Base - 200
SSJ2 - 20,000
SSJ3 - 40,000

Zamasu - 15,000[/spoiler]

1st Time Travel

[spoiler]Trunks (Post Training)
Base - 220
SSJ2 - 22,000
SSJ2 Full Power - 44,000

Vegeta
Base - 200
Base with God Ki - 20,000
SSB - 1,000,000

Goku
Base - 200
Base with God Ki - 20,000
SSB - 1,000,000
SSB Wounded - 100,000

Black (1st Goku Boost)
Base - 30,000
SSR Full Power - 1,500,000

(Super Saiyan Rosè is exactly the same as Super Saiyan Blue. Black naturally possesses only God Ki as he is a God)

Immortal Zamasu - 500,000[/spoiler]

2nd Time Travel

[spoiler]Goku (1st Zenkai)
Base - 260
Base with God Ki - 26,000
SSB - 1,300,000
SSB Rage - 1,560,000

Vegeta (1st Zenkai)
Base - 260
Base with God Ki - 26,000
SSB - 1,300,000

Trunks (2nd Zenkai)
Base - 270
SSJ2 Full Power - 56,000
Rage God Form - 1,620,000

(Trunks’ God form is 6000x his base due to his rage)

Black (2nd Goku Boost)
SSR - 1,600,000

Immortal Zamasu - 500,000[/spoiler]

3rd Time Travel

[spoiler]Trunks (3rd Zenkai)
Base - 320
SSJ2 Full Power - 64,000
God Form - 1,600,000
SSJ2 Tired - 40,000

(Trunks’ God Form is now 5000x his base, making it as strong as Super Saiyan Blue. It consumes a lot more stamina though)

Vegeta (2nd Zenkai + Training)
Base - 400
Base with God Ki - 40,000
SSB - 2,000,000

Goku (2nd Zenkai)
Base - 300
Base with God Ki - 30,000
SSB - 1,500,000

Black
SSR - 1,700,000

Future Zamasu - 500,000[/spoiler]

Fusions

[spoiler]Goku
SSB - 1,500,000
SSB Rage - 2,000,000

Vegeta
SSB - 2,000,000

Trunks
Rage God Form - 2,000,000

Merged Zamasu - 15,000,000

Vegito
SSB - 15,000,000[/spoiler]

[Bullza]

So, Goku is the strongest after all? He was able to overpower Zamasu's attack singlehandedly so he's top dog now, right?

Probably not, it was likely just a cool flashy scene at the end there. He might get overpowered and that's what leads to his life risking attack.

If anything I was wondering if Trunks had powered up further and surpassed them both.

[GodVegetto91]

I agree. SSJ Blue Vegito "should" be much stronger than Beerus at this point. Even if Beerus is still tens of times stronger than Goku and Vegeta individually.

Remember fusing with the Potara made Base Goku go from below Frieza to beyond his own SSJ3 form in Base. (Base Vegito) and if we go by the anime he was able to stomp even Buuhan! But even in the Manga, Base Vegito should be stronger than SSJ3 Goku at the very least. Even a guidebook confirmed it somewhere. (Can't remember where) but it definitely was stated in an official guidebook of some sorts.

So Potara Fusion is AT LEAST a 400x multiplier. And Beerus obviously shouldn't be as much as 400 times stronger than Goku and Vegeta the way they are now.

In fact, i believe he's even capable of beating Whis!

[ShinTenshin]

Welcome to the immortal show of the SSBLUE ! Trunks is far from their level !
Goku still the strongest, it's good to know.
Kamehameha as strong as Galick Gun Father and Son.
As for Trunks with just one hit he is totally unable to move after the Galick Gun, saved to the death by a weakened Vegeta that have taken millions more damages, LOL !
So return of the beginning of the arc, Goku >Vegeta >> Trunks. Goku and Vegeta resistance are way way way better than Trunks.

Like against Black Rosé when he lost his form immediately after the Galick Gun and the result is a little bleed ! He has no rage boost in the EP65, it's just the first time Kaioshin see Super Trunks and explain the nature of the form (rage).
He say he become stronger during the transformation not after, so the natural process base to Super form.

[Noah]

Remember fusing with the Potara made Base Goku go from below Frieza to beyond his own SSJ3 form in Base. (Base Vegito) and if we go by the anime he was able to stomp even Buuhan!

No. There's not indicating in the manga that Base Vegetto is indeed above a SSJ3-tier

[GodVegetto91]

Remember fusing with the Potara made Base Goku go from below Frieza to beyond his own SSJ3 form in Base. (Base Vegito) and if we go by the anime he was able to stomp even Buuhan!

No. There's not indicating in the manga that Base Vegetto is indeed above a SSJ3-tier

Yes there is. It's called reason and logic. Not only that, but like i already stated a guidebook somewhere confirmed that Base Vegito is above SSJ3 Goku. There's no question about that.

[Noah]

Yes there is. It's called reason and logic. Not only that, but like i already stated a guidebook somewhere confirmed that Base Vegito is above SSJ3 Goku. There's no question about that.

Yes, there is, show me your source.

[GodVegetto91]

Yes there is. It's called reason and logic. Not only that, but like i already stated a guidebook somewhere confirmed that Base Vegito is above SSJ3 Goku. There's no question about that.

Yes, there is, show me your source.

http://www.kanzenshuu.com/2014/02/21/ve ... eroes-jm3/

[GodVegetto91]

I can't believe we're even having this discussion. Everyone agrees that Base Vegito is above SSJ3 Goku. It's only logical. No need to downplay him for the sake of downplaying.

[HeroR]

http://www.kanzenshuu.com/2014/02/21/ve ... eroes-jm3/

Are you really using Heroes to argue power scaling?

[GodVegetto91]

http://www.kanzenshuu.com/2014/02/21/ve ... eroes-jm3/

Are you really using Heroes to argue power scaling?

It's not just heroes. It's logic, as well as mine. They obviously aren't crazy. They know how strong Vegito should be. Wait, are you also one of the minority that seems to believe something as ridiculous as SSJ3 Vegito>Base Goku!??