Unpopular DB opinions

[ekrolo2]

I don't agree. Super Goku is flanderized, but DB Goku is terribly bland, to the point where he doesn't even seem like he has any personality at all beyond being a big eater and kind, ESPECIALLY in the first arc. It's when his Saiyan nature comes to the forefront that he becomes truly interesting and compelling as a character.

I'd say Goku works in the first arc because he's constantly surrounded by a group of selfish jerks all using him in one way or another. It helps him play off the rest. But when they take him off on his own like the RRA arc or just throw him into a tournament, he becomes really, really boring.

[Lord Beerus]

If you like early Goku, fine, Super's Goku is similar to that. However, Goku has since advanced beyond his ignorant state, he's not so stupid that he can't tie his shoes anymore.

Not really. Even as Goku grew up in DB and later in the Z portion of the story and even in one or two occasions in GT, he did some stupid shit.

Give me a few examples of Goku's child-like ignorance between Raditz and Boo. How about 5? No filler.

- Goku letting of Raditz tail despite kidnapping his son and trying to kill him
- Goku letting Vegeta live
- Goku giving Freeza energy
- Goku not telling Gohan about this strategy to beat Cell
- Goku giving Cell a senzu

[Jinzoningen MULE]

Not really. Even as Goku grew up in DB and later in the Z portion of the story and even in one or two occasions in GT, he did some stupid shit.

Give me a few examples of Goku's child-like ignorance between Raditz and Boo. How about 5? No filler.

- Goku letting of Raditz tail despite kidnapping his son and trying to kill him
- Goku letting Vegeta live
- Goku giving Freeza energy
- Goku not telling Gohan about this strategy to beat Cell
- Goku giving Cell a senzu

That's totally different from something like underreacting from his tail being cut off, or not knowing what lipstick is. Now you're just taking advantage of my loose terminology.

[Lord Beerus]

Give me a few examples of Goku's child-like ignorance between Raditz and Boo. How about 5? No filler.

- Goku letting of Raditz tail despite kidnapping his son and trying to kill him
- Goku letting Vegeta live
- Goku giving Freeza energy
- Goku not telling Gohan about this strategy to beat Cell
- Goku giving Cell a senzu

That's totally different from something like underreacting from his tail being cut off, or not knowing what lipstick is. Now you're just taking advantage of my loose terminology.

All of those instance are pure ignorance though. Or at the very least, displaying an absurd amount of naivety. I mean, we all know Goku has very bad judge of character, but those moments are we he just crosses the line from naivety to pure ignorance. I mean, the pure fact he let Vegeta live after what happened with Raditz was immensely foolish, and it was only through pure good fortune that decision didn't backfire on him spectacularly.

[Dbzfan94]

All of those instance are pure ignorance though. Or at the very least, displaying an absurd amount of naivety. I mean, we all know Goku has very bad judge of character, but those moments are we he just crosses the line from naivety to pure ignorance. I mean, the pure fact he let Vegeta live after what happened with Raditz was immensely foolish, and it was only through pure good fortune that decision didn't backfire on him spectacularly.

I wouldn't say those things puts him on the level of Super Goku's stupidity by any means. It's just his good-nature coming back to bite him. Except for Cell.Giving him a Senzu was just dumb.

[Jinzoningen MULE]

All of those instance are pure ignorance though. Or at the very least, displaying an absurd amount of naivety. I mean, we all know Goku has very bad judge of character, but those moments are we he just crosses the line from naivety to pure ignorance. I mean, the pure fact he let Vegeta live after what happened with Raditz was immensely foolish, and it was only through pure good fortune that decision didn't backfire on him spectacularly.

I wouldn't say those things puts him on the level of Super Goku's stupidity by any means. It's just his good-nature coming back to bite him. Except for Cell.Giving him a Senzu was just dumb.

That was more of a "warrior's code" type thing, though. Toriyama had probably been watching a Kung-fu movie when he wrote it.

[Soppa Saia People]

All of those instance are pure ignorance though. Or at the very least, displaying an absurd amount of naivety. I mean, we all know Goku has very bad judge of character, but those moments are we he just crosses the line from naivety to pure ignorance. I mean, the pure fact he let Vegeta live after what happened with Raditz was immensely foolish, and it was only through pure good fortune that decision didn't backfire on him spectacularly.

I wouldn't say those things puts him on the level of Super Goku's stupidity by any means. It's just his good-nature coming back to bite him. Except for Cell.Giving him a Senzu was just dumb.

Yeah, there's a bit if a difference between being blissfully ignorant (Goku in most of Dragon Ball and a bit in Z) and being a flat out idiot (Goku in Super.
(I'm agreeing with you BTW)

[Dbzfan94]

All of those instance are pure ignorance though. Or at the very least, displaying an absurd amount of naivety. I mean, we all know Goku has very bad judge of character, but those moments are we he just crosses the line from naivety to pure ignorance. I mean, the pure fact he let Vegeta live after what happened with Raditz was immensely foolish, and it was only through pure good fortune that decision didn't backfire on him spectacularly.

I wouldn't say those things puts him on the level of Super Goku's stupidity by any means. It's just his good-nature coming back to bite him. Except for Cell.Giving him a Senzu was just dumb.

Yeah, there's a bit if a difference between being blissfully ignorant (Goku in most of Dragon Ball and a bit in Z) and being a flat out idiot (Goku in Super.
(I'm agreeing with you BTW)

Absolutely. Goku wasn't the smartest guy out there even in Z but at least he was competent outside of fighting unlike DBS

[Nejishiki]

I seriously think people exaggerate Goku's selfishness. I'm quite sure that when he was fighting Raditz along with Piccolo, he wasn't saying anything like: "Wow! I'm excited that this guy is really strong!" If anything, he was more concerned with Gohan.

Heck, the nightmare Goku has of Frieza destroying Earth in the Japanese version should be evidence that he does indeed care about others.

In addition to wanting his son back, he also expressed excitement that he would fight Raditz with his rival. Later, he exhibits horror when it's revealed two stronger Saiyans are next. He's not one shade of character. He combines all of his elements frequently. It doesn't have to be one or the other since humans are flexible beings.

[8000 Saiyan]

Super's animation is the best, despite some problems.

[Lord Beerus]

The Future Trunks arc is the greatest arc Dragon Ball has ever produced.

[ekrolo2]

The Future Trunks arc is the greatest arc Dragon Ball has ever produced.

I wouldn't call that unpopular necessarily, totally wrong? Definitely

[Doctor.]

Zamasu is the most well-written character in the franchise though. Not like that's exactly hard, but still.

[Lord Beerus]

The Future Trunks arc is the greatest arc Dragon Ball has ever produced.

I wouldn't call that unpopular necessarily, totally wrong? Definitely

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOxEx_RjuR8&t=0m2s

[precita]

Zamasu arc was great, but it still feels too short and didn't use the extended cast outside of what we saw compared to all the DBZ arcs.

[Lord Beerus]

Zamasu arc was great, but it still feels too short and didn't use the extended cast outside of what we saw compared to all the DBZ arcs.

I thought it used the cast pretty well, even in the circumstances where they didn't fight. You had Kid Trunks motivating Future Trunks, Future Mai was all over the place, Bulma played an integral role with her time machine, Beerus and Whis played small but siginficant roles in regards to the fate of Present Zamau and Gowasu, Roshi taught Goku how to perform the Mafuba, Piccolo aided in explaining to Future Trunks, Future Mai and Bulma how the Mafuba works and of course Future Trunks was the star of the show.

I'd say the cast was very well handled given the circumstances of how strong Zamasu and Goku Black were.

[nitemare]

Not really. Even as Goku grew up in DB and later in the Z portion of the story and even in one or two occasions in GT, he did some stupid shit.

Give me a few examples of Goku's child-like ignorance between Raditz and Boo. How about 5? No filler.

- Goku letting of Raditz tail despite kidnapping his son and trying to kill him
- Goku letting Vegeta live
- Goku giving Freeza energy
- Goku not telling Gohan about this strategy to beat Cell
- Goku giving Cell a senzu

Can we add "leaving fate of the Earth (and possibly the entire universe) in Gotenks' hands" to the list?

[Lord Beerus]

Give me a few examples of Goku's child-like ignorance between Raditz and Boo. How about 5? No filler.

- Goku letting of Raditz tail despite kidnapping his son and trying to kill him
- Goku letting Vegeta live
- Goku giving Freeza energy
- Goku not telling Gohan about this strategy to beat Cell
- Goku giving Cell a senzu

Can we add "leaving fate of the Earth (and possibly the entire universe) in Gotenks' hands" to the list?

Hmm... I'm not sure if can. Yes, it was an absurd gamble Goku took with Goten and Trunks, but at the same time, they show the strength to defeat Majin Boo. They just goofed around too much as Gotenks.

[Doctor.]

- Goku letting of Raditz tail despite kidnapping his son and trying to kill him
- Goku letting Vegeta live
- Goku giving Freeza energy
- Goku not telling Gohan about this strategy to beat Cell
- Goku giving Cell a senzu

I feel like you're doing a disservice to Goku's character by simply labelling these actions "stupid". Yes, they're stupid now that we know what happened, but Goku had a clear reason and motivation for his actions.

He let Raditz go out of kindness.
He let Vegeta live out of selfishness.
He gave Freeza energy out of kindness.
He didn't tell Gohan his strategy because he wanted Gohan's emotions to be spontaneous.
He gave Cell a senzu because he knew that it'd be irrelevant in the long run and it'd just make Cell extra cocky.

Now, some of the stuff Goku does in Super, like him not recognizing Beerus in the Monaka costume, forgetting so much in the Black arc... there's no reason as to why he's that stupid, that's just pure idiocy. Never in Z did he ever fuck up out of pure stupidity.

[Lord Beerus]

- Goku letting of Raditz tail despite kidnapping his son and trying to kill him
- Goku letting Vegeta live
- Goku giving Freeza energy
- Goku not telling Gohan about this strategy to beat Cell
- Goku giving Cell a senzu

I feel like you're doing a disservice to Goku's character by simply labelling these actions "stupid". Yes, they're stupid now that we know what happened, but Goku had a clear reason and motivation for his actions.

He let Raditz go out of kindness.
He let Vegeta live out of selfishness.
He gave Freeza energy out of kindness.
He didn't tell Gohan his strategy because he wanted Gohan's emotions to be spontaneous.
He gave Cell a senzu because he knew that it'd be irrelevant in the long run and it'd just make Cell extra cocky.

Now, some of the stuff Goku does in Super, like him not recognising Beerus in the Monaka costume, forgetting so much in the Black arc... there's no reason as to why he's that stupid, that's just pure idiocy. Never in Z did he ever fuck up out of pure stupidity.

You see, I've only really come across one instance where Goku, in my opinion, showed a distinct lack of intelligence in Super and that was when he couldn't tell that was Beerus wearing a Monaka suit in EP42. But in that circumstance, it was 100% played for laughs and pure filler. Him forgetting stuff like the senzu and and seal for the Mafuba jar... it's just a case of, well, forgetting things in a race against time. I mean, are we really gonna start labelling people stupid if they forget important things? It's like locking you keys inside your car or leaving a bag of groceries on the bus or forgetting important documents you're meant to take to school or work at home the same day. Shit like that just happens. It's a common lapse in concentration that occurs to everyone at one stage of their life, even if they're not in a rush. It's happened to me, you and everyone on this forum at one point in their live. That shouldn't mean you're stupid. That's a bit of an overreaction, in my opinion.

EDIT: The Monaka suit scenario happened in Episode 42. Not 43.
EDIT 2: Thanks to Anime Kitten for pointing out my mistake.