Was 22nd WMAT Roshi more powerful than his younger self?

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Angelus
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Was 22nd WMAT Roshi more powerful than his younger self?

Post by Angelus » Tue Dec 13, 2016 8:42 pm

His younger self climbed Korin Tower and received training from Korin for 3 years. This enabled him to finally catch the water jar from Korin. Of course the water was just placebo and it was the training to get it that was the true source of power gain. That younger Roshi would have needed a minimum of power equal to the post-21st WMAT Goku that gained enough power to catch that same water jar from Korin. So let's say younger Roshi was equal to post-Korin tower climb Goku. This would still mean that this younger Roshi was weaker than his older self that trained for the 22nd WMAT right? Apparently, Roshi's power diminished so much that even training for the 21st WMAT, he still wasn't able to reach the level of power he had when he was younger. BUT training for the 22nd WMAT enabled him to even surpass his younger self. Afterall, wouldn't 22nd WMAT Roshi be able to easily beat post-Korin tower climb Goku?

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Re: Was 22nd WMAT Roshi more powerful than his younger self?

Post by dragonball0900 » Tue Dec 13, 2016 9:55 pm

Well, if Master Roshi took 3 years to get the water, then he has to be much weaker than Goku, in order for his training to get to Goku post-Korin level. Then Roshi gets old and doesn't train, and he would be at his power as how we know him in the 21st Budokai, but that Roshi is equal to Goku before getting the water, who by logic is stronger than young Roshi before the water, then I think we can get an idea of why Roshi ended up being much stronger in the 22nd Budokai. Here's how it would be:

Young Roshi (pre water) < Roshi (21st Budokai) = Goku (pre water) < Roshi (post water) = Goku (post water) < Roshi (22nd Budokai)

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Re: Was 22nd WMAT Roshi more powerful than his younger self?

Post by nickzambuto » Wed Dec 14, 2016 12:24 am

I always figured Roshi just trained himself back into shape for the 22nd Budokai after years of letting himself go. Since he had to train Krillin and Yamcha at the same time, he wouldn't have had time for really extensive training. He also apparently did all of his training in secret, so I always thought it made more sense that he was just regaining lost power rather than generating brand new power. This would mean that the Roshi in the 22nd Budokai was equal to his prime, which is appropriate since it's a big deal that Ten and Goku surpassed him.

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Re: Was 22nd WMAT Roshi more powerful than his younger self?

Post by Angelus » Wed Dec 14, 2016 4:06 pm

Yes Roshi would have been weaker than 21st WMAT Goku because it took him 3 years. But after he was able to take the water jug, he would be equal to Goku was when Goku also was able to get the water jug. There's a certain level of power for them to achieve for them to be able to take that water jug.

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Re: Was 22nd WMAT Roshi more powerful than his younger self?

Post by LightBing » Wed Dec 14, 2016 4:31 pm

Roshi wasn't necessarily weaker than 21st TB Goku just because he took three years to get the water. Goku was simply better than him and evolved at an alarming rate.
To give perspective, Bora was said to be unable to climb Karin Tower. I have him at the same level as Namu. So at a minimum Roshi couldn't be weaker than that level, at a maximum he just needs to be weaker than Post-Karin training Goku. He doesn't even need to be that much weaker.
Goku exploded in power, don't forget Goku is a prodigy.

To add, Roshi never trained for the 21st Tenkaichi Budokai. It's never mentioned anywhere.

His 22nd Tenkaichi Budokai form should be much stronger than his youthful best.

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Re: Was 22nd WMAT Roshi more powerful than his younger self?

Post by GodKaio-Ken » Wed Dec 14, 2016 5:31 pm

He was probably less athletic but much much smarter. During that fight with Goku his prowess wasnt in demolishing him physically but rather having an answer to his techniques.

However in certain ways yes he did become stronger with age. Mastering the Kamehameha for instance. I dont know if its ever stated he learned the move well after his climb but I've always assumed it logically.
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Re: Was 22nd WMAT Roshi more powerful than his younger self?

Post by Nejishiki » Thu Dec 15, 2016 3:38 pm

GodKaio-Ken wrote:However in certain ways yes he did become stronger with age. Mastering the Kamehameha for instance. I dont know if its ever stated he learned the move well after his climb but I've always assumed it logically.
One would think so. Karin says Turtle Hermit climbed the tower about 300 years ago. Piccolo isn't familiar with the Kamehameha when Goku charges it either. (That connection requires assumption of how Piccolo's original rampage went down, which is devoid of extensive details) Finally, Gohan knows the technique himself after becoming a student of Turtle Hermit, which happened well after Piccolo's attack. It seems reasonable to assume the 50 year period of developing the technique occurred afterwards.

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Re: Was 22nd WMAT Roshi more powerful than his younger self?

Post by GodKaio-Ken » Thu Dec 15, 2016 5:24 pm

Nejishiki wrote:
GodKaio-Ken wrote:However in certain ways yes he did become stronger with age. Mastering the Kamehameha for instance. I dont know if its ever stated he learned the move well after his climb but I've always assumed it logically.
One would think so. Karin says Turtle Hermit climbed the tower about 300 years ago. Piccolo isn't familiar with the Kamehameha when Goku charges it either. (That connection requires assumption of how Piccolo's original rampage went down, which is devoid of extensive details) Finally, Gohan knows the technique himself after becoming a student of Turtle Hermit, which happened well after Piccolo's attack. It seems reasonable to assume the 50 year period of developing the technique occurred afterwards.
Exactly! Very well put!

Id honestly say this happened:

Roshi climbed the tower and did his training. Afterwards he continued to peak upwards. Later in life he began to decline again but was still a better martial artist than when he made his climb.

In short...he has declined from his peak but not enough to be weaker than when he finished his tower training.
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